Need some advice, thanks

[PENG]

Used the calculator by imputing 110 watts as the amp power. It gave me a 107.5 db SPL at listening position. Can you give me some guidance as how I am to translate this info when shopping for an amp and speakers?

I can, but if you provide the info, I can do better than the online calculator. For now, 107.5 dB peak is good, assuming you input the data properly. The Yamaha 1070 or Denon X4400H can easily do the job for you

 

[JCanada]

If you give me your room dimensions, sitting distance, speaker model, and how loud you want to listen to (ref is 85 dB avg, cinema level), I will do the calculations.

If you give me your room dimensions, sitting distance, speaker model, and how loud you want to listen to (ref is 85 dB avg, cinema level), I will do the calculations.

Room dimension in feet: 12X22 approx.
Listening distance 12 to 14 feet approx.
Loudness: I guess 60 to 80 db's.

 

[JCanada]

I can, but if you provide the info, I can do better than the online calculator. For now, 107.5 dB peak is good, assuming you input the data properly. The Yamaha 1070 or Denon X4400H can easily do the job for you

Bare in mind, I did a lot of damage to my hearing by attending numerous concerts without ear protection. I regret it now. So, I have to listen to the TV at a higher volume than normal. I also like to play music loud, even though it is sometimes harmful to my hearing.

 

[JCanada]

I can, but if you provide the info, I can do better than the online calculator. For now, 107.5 dB peak is good, assuming you input the data properly. The Yamaha 1070 or Denon X4400H can easily do the job for you

Speaker model will probably be Focal Chorus 726's, Focal Aria 948's, 936's, 926's. Or the Wharfedale Diamond 250's. I am not decided, waiting for a special to come.

 

[PENG]

Speaker model will probably be Focal Chorus 726's, Focal Aria 948's, 936's, 926's. Or the Wharfedale Diamond 250's. I am not decided, waiting for a special to come.

Below is the worst case scenario:

Aria 948 sensitivity..................................... 92.5 dB/2.83V/1m (3.28 feet)
Impedance.................................................. 2.5 ohm (that's the minimum, likely occur in a narrow band between 40-400 Hz)
Sitting distance (13-14 ft so say 13 ft)...... 14 ft

Room gain................................................... Assume none
No. of speaker............................................. Assume 1

Room dimension, 12X24 ft, assume height is 8-12 ft so that's considered a large room by THX standard.

Based on above information, you will need approx. 1,036 WPC. Note that Focal recommended 50-350 W

It would be reasonable to assume you will have room gain of at least 3 dB, and another 3 dB gain for having two speakers making sound about equally loud on average most of the time, then you will need:

1036/4 = 259 WPC

Now, let's assume the 2.5 ohm minimum is just a sharp dip at below 100 Hz that the subwoofer will take the blunt, then you can based on the requirement on 4 ohm nominal, that will bring the power requirement further down to:

= 259*2/3.2 = 162 WPC

That's the average power, or the so called (incorrectly) "RMS" power, so in reality, 81 WPC will give you the 162 WPC peak.

Still, conservatively speaking, if you insist on getting those multiple drivers with low impedance dips, need high spl, and sit 14 feet from them, you should get an external amp rated at least 200 WPC 8 ohm, 300 W 4 ohm.

 

[JCanada]

Below is the worst case scenario:

Aria 948 sensitivity..................................... 92.5 dB/2.83V/1m (3.28 feet)
Impedance.................................................. 2.5 ohm (that's the minimum, likely occur in a narrow band between 40-400 Hz)
Sitting distance (13-14 ft so say 13 ft)...... 14 ft

Room gain................................................... Assume none
No. of speaker............................................. Assume 1

Room dimension, 12X24 ft, assume height is 8-12 ft so that's considered a large room by THX standard.

Based on above information, you will need approx. 1,036 WPC.

It would be reasonable to assume you will have room gain of at least 3 dB, and another 3 dB gain for having two speakers making sound about equally loud on average most of the time, then you will need:

1036/4 = 259 WPC

Now, let's assume the 2.5 ohm minimum is just a sharp dip at below 100 Hz that the subwoofer will take the blunt, then you can based on the requirement on 4 ohm nominal, that will bring the power requirement further down to:

= 259*2/3.2 = 162 WPC

That's the average power, or the so called (incorrectly) "RMS" power, so in reality, 81 WPC will give you the 162 WPC peak.

Still, conservatively speaking, if you insist on getting those multiple drivers with low impedance dips, need high spl, and sit 14 feet from them, you should get an external amp rated at least 200 WPC 8 ohm, 300 W 4 ohm.

Thank you, much appreciated.

 

[PENG]

I just edited my post to include a reminder that Focal recommended 50-350 W for the Aria 948 so you should go much higher than 350 W regardless of the power requirement calculations. I would say no concern up to 500 WPC.

 

[RichB]

Below is the worst case scenario:

Aria 948 sensitivity..................................... 92.5 dB/2.83V/1m (3.28 feet)
Impedance.................................................. 2.5 ohm (that's the minimum, likely occur in a narrow band between 40-400 Hz)
Sitting distance (13-14 ft so say 13 ft)...... 14 ft

Room gain................................................... Assume none
No. of speaker............................................. Assume 1

Room dimension, 12X24 ft, assume height is 8-12 ft so that's considered a large room by THX standard.

Based on above information, you will need approx. 1,036 WPC. Note that Focal recommended 50-350 W

It would be reasonable to assume you will have room gain of at least 3 dB, and another 3 dB gain for having two speakers making sound about equally loud on average most of the time, then you will need:

1036/4 = 259 WPC

Now, let's assume the 2.5 ohm minimum is just a sharp dip at below 100 Hz that the subwoofer will take the blunt, then you can based on the requirement on 4 ohm nominal, that will bring the power requirement further down to:

= 259*2/3.2 = 162 WPC

That's the average power, or the so called (incorrectly) "RMS" power, so in reality, 81 WPC will give you the 162 WPC peak.

Still, conservatively speaking, if you insist on getting those multiple drivers with low impedance dips, need high spl, and sit 14 feet from them, you should get an external amp rated at least 200 WPC 8 ohm, 300 W 4 ohm.

If 162 is average power, then peak is twice that not half. Am I missing something?
Also, phase has an effect causing heat and perhaps trigging limiting circuitry.

Would this work to compute power requirements:

1. Measure the voltage using a some sine waves and adjust to 2.83 volts.
2. Compute the power using a typical and worst case speaker impedance
3. Measure the volume at the listening position
4. Use the typical and worst case impedance measured power (1 or 2 watts) as the basis to compute volume and power requirements.

- Rich

 

[PENG]

If 162 is average power, then peak is twice that not half. Am I missing something?
Also, phase has an effect causing heat and perhaps trigging limiting circuitry.

- Rich

Of course, but I intentionally put it that way to emphasize you only need 81 W to yield 162 W peak that was required to get 105 dB peak by THX standard. I could have said 162 W average, 324 W peak, same difference in principle. I chose the 81/162 way because the 162 W was calculated to yield the 105 dB peak spl..

Anyway, the Acoustic Frontier has an article on the THX spl requirement and it also highlighted that:

Many people also make a simple mistake which effectively doubles the size of amplifier required. Using the online calculators they enter follow a process of trial and error to determine the amplifier size required for 105dB SPL. The issue is that our THX requirement is not for 105dB continuous output but 105dB peak output. More on this later.

http://www.acousticfrontiers.com/2013322spl-calculator/

I normally don't bring this up precise to avoid confusions. I would have preferred to keep that secret 3 dB hidden just to be conservative. In fact I prefer to have at a total of 10 dB buffer on top of what that online peak spl calculator shows, that's just me..

 

[PENG]

If 162 is average power, then peak is twice that not half. Am I missing something?
Also, phase has an effect causing heat and perhaps trigging limiting circuitry.

Would this work to compute power requirements:

1. Measure the voltage using a some sine waves and adjust to 2.83 volts.
2. Compute the power using a typical and worst case speaker impedance
3. Measure the volume at the listening position
4. Use the typical and worst case impedance measured power (1 or 2 watts) as the basis to compute volume and power requirements.

- Rich

Sure, I have in fact done all those things including rms and peak current and voltage, and some...

 

[JCanada]

If 162 is average power, then peak is twice that not half. Am I missing something?
Also, phase has an effect causing heat and perhaps trigging limiting circuitry.

Would this work to compute power requirements:

1. Measure the voltage using a some sine waves and adjust to 2.83 volts.
2. Compute the power using a typical and worst case speaker impedance
3. Measure the volume at the listening position
4. Use the typical and worst case impedance measured power (1 or 2 watts) as the basis to compute volume and power requirements.

- Rich

Thank you, much appreciated.

 

[JCanada]

Sure, I have in fact done all those things including rms and peak current and voltage, and some...

Thank you, much appreciated.

 

[JCanada]

I currently stream DEEZER from my ROKU because I enjoy the on screen TV interface.
Question 1: Are there any AVR's that offer an on screen TV interface for DEEZER?
Question 2: In terms of sound quality, am I better off streaming DEEZER through ROKU, or through an AVR?
Question 3: Is there a Network player besides the COCKTAIL AUDIO line that offers an on screen TV interface? (COCKTAIL AUDIO out of my budget range).
Anyones guidance is welcome. I found no info on this when I conducted a search in the past posts.

 

[lovinthehd]

Not really answers but sorta

1/ You'd need to see what avrs have the Deezer app built in, on this page it says Onkyo does and indicates that Yamaha's Music Cast and Denon's (and Marantz) Heos avrs have access as well. https://www.deezer.com/us/devices/soundsystems

2/ Often apps are different from device to device as to the bitrate and/or codec, so perhaps, might want to dig around the Deezer site for bitrate/codec info. I didn't use my tv's smart apps for music but generally found the apps not to be as capable audio-wise (particularly multi-ch vs 2ch, but that's more Netflix and video apps in that example).

3/ Look at that devices/soundsystems page. I remember seeing Bluesound there...

Good luck in your quest!

 

[JCanada]

Not really answers but sorta

1/ You'd need to see what avrs have the Deezer app built in, on this page it says Onkyo does and indicates that Yamaha's Music Cast and Denon's (and Marantz) Heos avrs have access as well. https://www.deezer.com/us/devices/soundsystems

2/ Often apps are different from device to device as to the bitrate and/or codec, so perhaps, might want to dig around the Deezer site for bitrate/codec info. I didn't use my tv's smart apps for music but generally found the apps not to be as capable audio-wise (particularly multi-ch vs 2ch, but that's more Netflix and video apps in that example).

3/ Look at that devices/soundsystems page. I remember seeing Bluesound there...

Good luck in your quest!

Thank you