My HT Quest

[wilkenboy]

Projector:
Also look at the BenQ PE7700 DLP. Right now the price is about $2500, but the price will likely come down closer to the holidays. I would pick the Panasonic over the sanyo.

Will do - what is its pros / cons vs the Panny? And what have you seen about the Panny that makes it worth the roughtly $200 more than the Sanyo?

My cousin has the Panny and its a great unit.

Screen:
DIY, Goo Systems Paint. CRT White or digital grey.
OR, Dalite Model B manual pull down screen.
Also make sure that you run the projector calcs on the model you buy before building the screen. The model you select and its zoom range will effect the available screen size.

I have a multi-staged approach here. The first step is a DIY painted screen using some of the cool formulations I found on AVS. Should run me around $40 all in - Cheap! But then to compare that solution I've ordered screen samples for Carada and Da-lite. Those are sitting in my filing cabinet now, waiting for the projector purchase.

My cousin did the Goo Systems to the tune of a few hundred dollars. Problem is it did not go on really smooth (roller technique?) but you can see differences in reflectivity across the surface if a single light color is projected on it. Kind of annoying. Any idea what might have gone wrong here?

Receiver:
Yamaha RX-V1500 or HTR-5860

If the V1500 has 3 component imputs I'd be all over it, but it does not. I'll need three (XBOX, DVD player, OTA HD receiver). Right now I'm leaning heavily toward the Pioneer 1015tx, but would make the jump to a Yamaha 2500 or Denon 2805 if I can find a great deal at purchase time.

Speakers:
Axiom M22ti fronts, VP100 Center, M2t rears. Slightly higher than your budget but should perform much better for HT sound.

How would these compare to the Ascend CBM-170s? I really like the Paradigm Studio 20s and 40s and have heard the Ascends are a very close match for roughly 1/3rd the price.

I'd love to do a side-by side on the Axioms vs the Ascends but its hard enough finding someone with either one let alone both. Perhaps I'll order a pair from both and send the loser back...

Subwoofer:
Rocket ULW-10 (built in EQ! $400!) SVS PB-10 ISD, or HSU VTF-2
Keep in mind that PEQ on receivers will not handle the subwoofer frequency range.

Yep, looking at the PB-10 ISD, but considering possibly a PCi 20-35.

Wire:
#12 Belden Speaker wire for 19 cents per foot.
http://www.westlake-electronic.com/

Already dropped some in the walls - home depot 12AWG at $80 for 500ft. 16 cents a foot on a special. Usually around 22-24 cents.

DVD:
Save up for the Oppo Digital to maximize the capabilities of your 720P projector. ($200) Also wire room for DVI / HDMI cable.

Funny, as I was just salivating over some reviews of this one today. I already have a Denon 1710 but it will likely be moved to the family room when the time comes. Does this unit do DVD-A and SACD?

Currently I've wired for component from the receiver to the projector, but have the attic access so I can run HDMI/DVI later if necessary. What's the max length I can run?

Thanks for all the input!!

~Josh

 

[silversurfer]

If you do a search on the Axiom forum and Ascend forum, and even AVSForum you will find many comparisons on the CBM-170 and M22.

 

[jcPanny]

Will do - what is its pros / cons vs the Panny? And what have you seen about the Panny that makes it worth the roughtly $200 more than the Sanyo?

I think that the BenQ is much brighter than the panny, offering better performance in a room with some ambient light. Also has much better scaling than the Panny and Sanyo. Since you have a small screen and light controlled room, this might be a non issue for you.
I would pick the Panny over the Sany because of higher contrast and better color reproduction. If you are happy with your cousins setup, than go for it. Also, let us know how the DIY screen works out.

I'd love to do a side-by side on the Axioms vs the Ascends but its hard enough finding someone with either one let alone both. Perhaps I'll order a pair from both and send the loser back...

Axiom has a great return and upgrade policy. Audioholics rates them highly against other bookshelves in the 1k-2k price range.
Also, the AH reccomended Mordaunt Short Avant series might be in your price range. AH put them in their 12k home theater system.
http://www.accessories4less.com/Amazing/index.asp?CartId=1-EVEREST-4137789XULBO23&FCat=1&FSCat=++++++37

Funny, as I was just salivating over some reviews of this one today. I already have a Denon 1710 but it will likely be moved to the family room when the time comes. Does this unit do DVD-A and SACD?

The Oppo has DVD-A but not SACD. It also supports DIVx and a few other unique formats.

 

[wilkenboy]

Forum searching for Axiom vs. Ascend

Silversurfer, Panny,

Ha. Tried a forum search at Ascend, Axiom, and AVS. My results:

Paraphrased Ascend forum results: we love Ascend. Axioms are nice, but not as nice as Ascends to my ear.

Paraphrased Axiom forum results: we love Axiom. Ascends are nice, but not as nice as Axioms to my ear.

BIG suprise there.

AVS forum search results: Your search for "Ascend CBM-170 Axiom M22" returned 500 threads. 99% of them have nothing to do with what you asked for. Please spend the next 6 hours skimming through those to find a one sentence comment about your query.

I love AVS when I can find a relevant thread that doesn't skew wildly off topic... but I have never had any luck with their search engine.

Audioholics search results: One guy, trw005, was going to do a side by side but then just went with the Axioms... no data point there.

Silver, from some of your posts it looks like you've listened to both the M22 and CBM-170s. Your opinions?

Any direct links anyone can send me?

Any help with links will result in tipped chicklet scales and life-long admiration. Any member offering an in-home audition in the DFW area will result in tipped chicket scales, life-long admiration, and a moderate amount of free alchohol.

~Josh

 

[wilkenboy]

Fingers Crossed

Well the house is coming along fine - interior paint is about 40% done and the brick was sitting in my front yard on Saturday.

I finally received an offer on my existing home today, about 8PM, and counter-offered just slightly higher. They had offered $5k less than asking and we countered with $3k less than asking.

No word back from the realtor yet but I wasn't expecting anything until tomorrow morning.

So we'll see - if they accept and don't get cold feet prior to signing the contract, I could be moving in as soon as mid-October, then a few basics to pick up (window coverings, etc) - then on to the HT!

Wish me luck!

~Josh

 

[wilkenboy]

Contract on existing house

Well, the buyer came right to where I wanted him, so unless he backs out in the next 5 days it looks like the sell of the old house is a go, which would put us in the new media room... I mean, house around the end of October.

I was trying not to become emotionally attached to the new house, but now that we have a contract down on our old one its hard not to!

It looks like Panasonic and Sanyo will be releasing new projector models right around the time I'll be making final decisions, I'm hoping that translates either into great pricing on the 700u or Z3, or a fancy new model at existing price points!

On the new house front the brick is on, flooring going in, and most of the interior paint is complete. I'm going to mock up the screen location soon with my cousins' Panny and perhaps I'll post some pics.

~Josh

 

[Takeereasy]

Congrats Wilken. I'm selling too. Actually already sold. House was on the market for 18 hrs. I'm going to break even, (actually make about $500) on the sale after renovations, repairs are taken into account, lawyers, realtor, etc. Very stressfull event selling a house, I'm glad it's done and was accomplished so quickly.

 

[wilkenboy]

Wow, what a crazy last couple of months! LONG story short the first buyer couldn't get financing at a reasonable rate (bad credit), and backed out, but my realtor was on the spot with another offer within an hour! We moved out of our house and into the new the day before Haloween so my daughter got to trick or treat in her new neighborhood, a cool way to meet many of the neighbors.

So I've been distracted with getting boxes unpacked, blinds put in, bedrooms painted, a new fridge, and a new car for the wife... time is finally freeing up to think media room again.

I've been working on what I'll call a "DOS 5.0" version of my media room (sorry, computers are my other hobby). It consists of my computer speaker system (Logitech 4.1) as the speakers, an HP laptop as the receiver / DVD player, an occasionally borrowed 4:3 projector from work, and some painters tape on the wall to outline the eventual screen location. Crude, but working! I showed it to the wife (via a quick demo of Finding Nemo and LOTR) and she immediately said "can we invite people over to watch?"

I paused, savoring a rare and wonderful moment of WAF. Success.

So far we've watched Disney's Tarzan and a few episodes of "Lost" in HD. Even in its crude form, its very enjoyable!

Bonus checks are still a few months away, so I'll have to live with the limitations of the room for a while yet, meaning no major component purchases.

In the meantime I've decided to try a DIY screen as an improvement over projecting onto a textured light brown wall. I've been lurking quite a bit over at the DIY screen forum at AVS, and have decided on a melamine coated board as my "starter" screen.

For those still searching, here are the reasons I chose Melamine as my first screen. I was considering a purchased screen, paint mixture on hardboard, Blackout Cloth stretched on a frame, and melamine.

1) Inexpensive! $20 for the basic screen and hanging hardware.
2) Very little assembly required (method to hang only). Does not require a lot of assembly like BOC, with equal or better picture quality
4) No painting required up front, can do it later if you want. I'm decent with a roller but reading the painting methods with all the painting, mixing, sanding, re-painting sounded like an investment of more than 1-2 evenings, and a lot of cleanup! Furthermore, I've seen painted screens with rollermarks that I just couldn't ignore. I know with skill you can eliminate these, but I have little skill.

Went to Home Depot last night and picked up the 3/4" Melanine coated product they have (no thinner stock available in my area here in NE Ft. Worth). It took some grunting but finally got it in the back of my Tahoe and then into my garage. ITS HEAVY , which I knew going into the decision. I'll use a french cleat to attach it to the wall, and a couple of buddies to lug it upstairs to the media room when the time comes. If you are considering this method and have the means in your area, go with the thinner stuff.

I cut the board last night with a circular saw and some clamped guides down from 49x97 to 46.5x81.5 (will eventually with border be a 45x80). Another piece of advice to those considering this method - have the place you purchase from cut it down to the dimensions you specifiy! Home Depot does it for free, and it would have saved me a lot of effort.

Today over my lunch break I stopped by Home Depot and picked up the materials for the border, which I have designed to fit over and hang from the screen. More details once I've started construction but the short story is I'm using 2x3s cut via table saw and router to be a little more decorative, which I will eventually cover with a black velvet via spray adhesive and possibly some stapling.

I don't have my camera on me at the moment but I'll post progress pictures over the weekend. The basic concept (side view) of my design is attached for those who are interested.

Enjoy!

~Josh

 

[wilkenboy]

Congrats Wilken. I'm selling too. Actually already sold. House was on the market for 18 hrs. I'm going to break even, (actually make about $500) on the sale after renovations, repairs are taken into account, lawyers, realtor, etc. Very stressfull event selling a house, I'm glad it's done and was accomplished so quickly.

Tareereasy - wow, houses don't move quite that fast here - toom much new construction in the area. Where are you? It was stressful having the house on the market for 90+ days, I can imagine its stressful in a different way only having it on for 18 hours!

Agreed, its a wonderful thing to have finished and out of the way!

~Josh

 

[Matt34]

Congrats on the new house. Keep us posted on your HT progression.

 

[westcott]

My only suggestion would be to allocate more funds to your speakers and wait on the sub and or equalizer until you have the funds to add them.

I say this because speakers generally stay with us for a very long time. Long after the display and the receivers and dvd players and all the other components in your system have come and gone.

I would even forgo the surrounds if I knew I was getting a better center channel and front tower speakers for the long haul. Speakers with high sensitivity may also serve you well if you can not afford separate amp and processor now.

Hope this helps.

 

[wilkenboy]

My only suggestion would be to allocate more funds to your speakers and wait on the sub and or equalizer until you have the funds to add them.

Wait for the sub? *Gurgle* Bass is such an integral part of a HT setup I don't think I could live without it...

What would be your next recommended step up from the Ascends CBM-170s or the Axiom M3s (the two leading contenders when funds become available)? I'm not doing floorstanders - bookshelves all around.

~Josh

 

[wilkenboy]

Finished Screen!

Ok, my first real update in a while... I've been diverted to work on my study (18 cabinets, 3 seperate work surfaces, and integrated ethernet computer wiring through the whole thing).

Over the Christmas vacation I was able to get some time to knock out the do-it-yourself screen. Its a 45" x 80" screen, unpainted melamine surface, with custom border wrapped in velvet.

The speakers in the pictures are the Logitech 4.1 system that I usually have hooked to my gaming computer downstairs but are serving as my "DOS" version surround system for the time being. All in all these little speakers and sub don't do so bad... probably an opinion that will change when I get my real speakers and sub in. But the sub in this system hits 30 Hz, better than some of the junk they sell in Best Buy for 5x the price!

Sorry for no screens showing how a movie looks, I don't have the loaner projector tonight. I'll have it back in the next few days and will do some shots and also compare to the screen material samples I received a while back.

Over the break we had family in town and the room got a nice workout - movies at night, video games through the day and an occasional kiddo movie thrown in to calm the little ones down and give the parents a break.

For $50 in material and a few hours labor I'm very happy with it! Just a few more months (Feb-Mar) till the bonus checks roll in... counting the minutes!

~Josh

 

[Sheep]

Ok, my first real update in a while... I've been diverted to work on my study (18 cabinets, 3 seperate work surfaces, and integrated ethernet computer wiring through the whole thing).

Over the Christmas vacation I was able to get some time to knock out the do-it-yourself screen. Its a 45" x 80" screen, unpainted melamine surface, with custom border wrapped in velvet.

The speakers in the pictures are the Logitech 4.1 system that I usually have hooked to my gaming computer downstairs but are serving as my "DOS" version surround system for the time being. All in all these little speakers and sub don't do so bad... probably an opinion that will change when I get my real speakers and sub in. But the sub in this system hits 30 Hz, better than some of the junk they sell in Best Buy for 5x the price!

Sorry for no screens showing how a movie looks, I don't have the loaner projector tonight. I'll have it back in the next few days and will do some shots and also compare to the screen material samples I received a while back.

Over the break we had family in town and the room got a nice workout - movies at night, video games through the day and an occasional kiddo movie thrown in to calm the little ones down and give the parents a break.

For $50 in material and a few hours labor I'm very happy with it! Just a few more months (Feb-Mar) till the bonus checks roll in... counting the minutes!

~Josh

The Logitech Computer systems are work horse speakers. The Z5500 is the ultimate HTIB. How many HTIB's will hit 100dBs?

I have the Z2200's for my computer. Best gaming experience I have ever had. My HT is no where near as good for gaming.

SheepStar

 

[wilkenboy]

The Projector Dilemma

Ok, time for you projector-lovin' freaks to step forward and slap me with some solid advice. Bonus time fast approaches (end of Feb) and I need to start narrowing in on a projector.

My basic budget max is $2000, although I'd GREATLY prefer to spend less. I'm not trying to minimize the budget, rather would like the best bang/buck.

The basic facts:

• Screen and cabling are done, don't worry about 'em.
• Projector mount is figured out. Don't worry about it.
• Light can be completely controlled.
• Screen is 92" diagonal, 16:9, (80" width, 45" height).
• Primary application will be DVD and XBox, with HD in a close second and some occasional SD over Verizon's Fios TV.
• Projector will be mounted roughly 11.5' to 12' from the screen, almost directly centered.

The candidates are:
Sanyo PLV-Z3: least expensive of the bunch, good scaler, good color, nice maintenance features with the user-cleanable panels, but I'm concerned that the lumens won't be enough once the bulb starts to dim with age. Some screen door effect from less than 1.5x screen width seating distance. 3 yr warranty.

Sanyo PLV-Z4: poor scaler for SD and 480i signals (boo), good color, nice maintenance features with the user-cleanable panels. Better light output and contrast than Z3. Some screen door effect from less than 1.5x screen width seating distance. 3 yr warranty

Panasonic PT-AE700U: decent scaler, excellent color, no user cleanable panels. Some users report video banding issues and bulb life issues. No screen-door effect. 1 yr warranty. Probably best bang/buck.

Panasonic PT-AE900U: good+ scaler, excellent color, most lumens, no user cleanable panels. Some users report bulb life issues. No screen-door effect.

I don't know if the Z3 has enough lumens to go the distance when the bulb starts to dim. I'm really concerned about Panasonics' reported bulb life issues and shorter warranty, which would leave me at the Z4. BUT the Z4 does not equal the 700 or 900 color reproduction and I am really worried about artifacts from the scaler when watching SD or playing 480i games...

Anyone have some advice here? Should I suck up the poor scaling problems with the Z4, or take a risk with the Panny bulb reliability and shorter warranty?

I'd love to hear opinions, suggestions, rants, whateva you got. My brain hurts from all the forum crawling and reading.

~Josh

 

[kia303]

I was not aware of the bulb life issues with the Panny's, I guess sometimes ignorance is bliss. I am very happy with my AE700U, but I only have about 250 hrs. on the bulb. I do not think you can go wrong with any of those PJ's, all of them review pretty well and are a good balance between price/performance.

P.S. I bought the 700 with the most current, at the time, software update and I do not see any VB. I think the former software was more susceptible to VB. I am sitting about 11 1/2 feet away from my 106" screen and it even does pretty good with SD feeds; Xbox, PS2 and cable.

 

[wilkenboy]

Kia303-

I have a cousin who has the 700u and is very happy with it. I only found out about the bulb life issues when I went to projectorcentral.com and looked at the user reviews.

Also through some more reading at AVSforum it seems that Panny makes a few great units up front which get rave reviews, and then when they go to mass production they have some initial quality issues. Given that the 900 has been out since Septemberish I am hoping that they are resolved when I order come late feb - early march.

I've been reading so much on these my head hurts! My cousin pointed out that the BenQ 7700 series is good and around a $1800 price point (which includes a spare bulb!!) But then I found this review comparing it to the 900u at projectorcentral and I'm back toward leaning toward the 900.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/ae900_pe7700.htm

I still have a few weeks before I pull the trigger - keeping the fingers crossed for more price drops!

~Josh

 

[wilkenboy]

Visual Apex is offering a extended warranty on the 900 (1 extra year warranty) for Audioholics members.

Thanks, Brian, I'll be sure to check them out when the time comes to pull the trigger. Their prices seem competitive.

Am I a member right now, or do I need to do something else?

~Josh

 

[westcott]

When you consider the sheer number of Panasonic 700u units sold, they are very dependable units and make a good choice.

The Z4 is also a nice unit.

I think you are on the right track and could not go wrong with any of the four units (700,900,z3,z4)

As others have pointed out, a sub does make a movie experience what it is.

Unfortunately, they are not cheap for a good one. Especially when you think of it as two components, a speaker and an amplifier.

I know money does not grow on trees but if you want something for the long haul, it is going to cost you.

I wish I could give you some advice on the speakers you have chosen but I have never listened to them so I will refrain from comment.

Test driving is the funnest part IMO, so listen to as many speakers as you can and let your ears decide.

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[wilkenboy]

I think you are on the right track and could not go wrong with any of the four units (700,900,z3,z4) .

After a lot of worrying about this, I agree. If I can get a good deal on a 900u I'll go that way, but if not I'll get a warrantied 700u. The Z3 lumens still scare me... if I dial in my setup at projector central it shows I'm just on the borderline of needing a higher gain screen. When the bulb starts to dim I don't want to be squinting at the screen.

As others have pointed out, a sub does make a movie experience what it is..

Yep. I emails the nice folks over at SVS and they recommended the PB10 for my size room. Do you have another sub to recommend or another price range I should be looking at Seems SVS have captured the hearts and minds of the direct-over-internet buyer.

Test driving is the funnest part IMO, so listen to as many speakers as you can and let your ears decide.

Agreed! My current plan is to order a pair of Ascend CBM-170SEs, a pair of Axoim M3tis, and a pair of Aperion 532-LRs. I'll so side-by-sides with each of these by themselves, then I'll take the winner out to a local store and see how they stack up against some HT store-stocked speakers in the same and higher price ranges. I'll send the losers home, all three if I like the store-stocked stuff better. I'm really looking forward to opening all those boxes and posting impressions here!

~Josh