More Yamaha 801 questions...

[1981rt]

It is likely an error in the SM, may be that page got mixed up with the A-S701 or some AVR that have some shared design and parts used, and those do use the TI PCM5101 or 5102 chip as well. There just don't seem to be any good reasons for the A-S801 to use a different dac for the optical/coax inputs.

For amps that have two zones and allows the user to use different sources for each zone then it might need to use a different dac for zone 2. That's what Denon, Marantz and Yamaha AVRs and AVPs do, but again, not for such entry level integrated amps. So, while I agree it is still clear as mud, but I think it is as least clear mud, that it is some sort of printer error. Keep in mind that Yamaha's integrated amp do share several of the ICs including volume controls, and circuitry with their AVR/AVP cousins, sort of standardization/or synergy, to minimize costs.

It is likely an error in the SM, may be that page got mixed up with the A-S701 or some AVR that have some shared design and parts used, and those do use the TI PCM5101 or 5102 chip as well. There just don't seem to be any good reasons for the A-S801 to use a different dac for the optical/coax inputs.

For amps that have two zones and allows the user to use different sources for each zone then it might need to use a different dac for zone 2. That's what Denon, Marantz and Yamaha AVRs and AVPs do, but again, not for such entry level integrated amps. So, while I agree it is still clear as mud, but I think it is as least clear mud, that it is some sort of printer error. Keep in mind that Yamaha's integrated amp do share several of the ICs including volume controls, and circuitry with their AVR/AVP cousins, sort of standardization/or synergy, to minimize costs.

you need to get on the blower to Yamaha and sort this out

 

[1981rt]

you need to get on the blower to Yamaha and sort this out

I’ve been going optical via Google Chromecast Audio for a couple of years. If they’ve flimped me re the ESS Sabre DAC not doing the work at the digital end I won’t be happy

 

[PENG]

I’ve been going optical via Google Chromecast Audio for a couple of years. If they’ve flimped me re the ESS Sabre DAC not doing the work at the digital end I won’t be happy

What you don't know won't affect you so let's leave Yamaha alone.

Or, if you must know that you are "listening" to a better DAC, just go grab an external one, such as the following:
Supposedly on sale for USD48 but Amazon's currently at $79.99 but 20% coupon brings it to $64
NEOHIPO DC10 Stereo DAC Review | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum

It has Optical, Coax and USB inputs just like the A-S801, but it uses much better ESS DAC IC as well as TI's opamps, the NE5532. The A-S801 does uses the NE5532 but it uses an AVR IC for volume control, that's not too bad, but is a real bottleneck, on paper anyway.

The A-S801 uses the premier class ES9010K2M, that has decent specs but far from being SOTA. The ES9028Q2M is nowhere near ESS's flagship DAC but again it is considered "reference" by ESS and its specs are still truly SOTA.

Unit price of the ES9028Q2M is $16.8, versus the ES9010K2M's $5, based on Mouser's. That's just the DAC chip: ES9028Q2M ESS Technology | Mouser

Can you hear a difference? Only you can know, but I bet in a blind test no one can tell the difference, enough said...

The ES9028Q2M

 

[highfigh]

I looked up that Parasound Hint 6. What's the price on that?
I checked their website and followed links to their listed dealers. Those don't even list products let alone prices.
They just say "contact us for a consultation."

Parasound was sold and the new owner doesn't know how to build a website, they cut off their small dealers and as a former dealer, I have no desire to deal with that kind of crap from a manufacturer. I liked their products and I have their P5/A23 preamp/power amp combo, but I'm done with them. If they think consumers want to talk to them when local dealers were the whole reason they stayed in business through the difficult times since they began, they're clueless. One of the reasons dealers liked Parasound was because the founder was frequently the one to answer the phone. How many company founders did that?

FWIW- I also use a Yamaha WXC-50 MusicCast as a source, but I used it as my system's preamp for a few years and I never had any problems with the sound but I also don't believe in the idea that miniscule differences are as important as many think. If you want to compare DACs, it won't be in real time and any time between listening will make fair/accurate comparisons impossible- humans don't have good enough sonic memory to do that.

 

[KenM10759]

Parasound was sold and the new owner doesn't know how to build a website, they cut off their small dealers and as a former dealer, I have no desire to deal with that kind of crap from a manufacturer. I liked their products and I have their P5/A23 preamp/power amp combo, but I'm done with them. If they think consumers want to talk to them when local dealers were the whole reason they stayed in business through the difficult times since they began, they're clueless. One of the reasons dealers liked Parasound was because the founder was frequently the one to answer the phone. How many company founders did that?

FWIW- I also use a Yamaha WXC-50 MusicCast as a source, but I used it as my system's preamp for a few years and I never had any problems with the sound but I also don't believe in the idea that miniscule differences are as important as many think. If you want to compare DACs, it won't be in real time and any time between listening will make fair/accurate comparisons impossible- humans don't have good enough sonic memory to do that.

That's really interesting info! A real shame and a very idiotic move for the new owners of Parasound to dismantle a good distribution network. That is EVERYTHING in sales. You can choose to have one sales point, or with a good distribution network you can have 5, 50, or 200 salespeople out in the field supporting your product. Even SVS, who started out as internet direct only, has now see the light and has a growing dealer network, which clearly has enabled continuous growth.

 

[highfigh]

That's really interesting info! A real shame and a very idiotic move for the new owners of Parasound to dismantle a good distribution network. That is EVERYTHING in sales. You can choose to have one sales point, or with a good distribution network you can have 5, 50, or 200 salespeople out in the field supporting your product. Even SVS, who started out as internet direct only, has now see the light and has a growing dealer network, which clearly has enabled continuous growth.

Many small dealers can be good for a brand, or they can be less than good. The least the new owner could have done is send a survey to dealers, to find out what they know about audio, amplifiers, sales, etc and either provide training to the weak ones or weed them out- no brand needs clueless dealers but kicking them to the curb makes them turn on that brand, as I have done. I like the equipment but won't sell it now.

 

[KenM10759]

Many small dealers can be good for a brand, or they can be less than good. The least the new owner could have done is send a survey to dealers, to find out what they know about audio, amplifiers, sales, etc and either provide training to the weak ones or weed them out- no brand needs clueless dealers but kicking them to the curb makes them turn on that brand, as I have done. I like the equipment but won't sell it now.

Trust me, I understand about distribution. I was in B2B industrial sales for over 10 years and the global company I worked for had one Germany-based division absorb the bigger American one that I started with. One of the first things they did was eliminate any distributor that wasn't selling at least 1/2 a $Million annually. I had three of those, and my commissions took a hit. Worse, the company told me to "just let those end users know they can buy the product from the bigger distributors." Sure thing. Those small distributors have the customer loyalty, and promptly switched their customers over to other lines and I lost their business.

 

[highfigh]

Trust me, I understand about distribution. I was in B2B industrial sales for over 10 years and the global company I worked for had one Germany-based division absorb the bigger American one that I started with. One of the first things they did was eliminate any distributor that wasn't selling at least 1/2 a $Million annually. I had three of those, and my commissions took a hit. Worse, the company told me to "just let those end users know they can buy the product from the bigger distributors." Sure thing. Those small distributors have the customer loyalty, and promptly switched their customers over to other lines and I lost their business.

After four decades in audio, I can say with certainty that many foreign companies absolutely fail to understand the US market and within that, they fail to understand why some areas don't perform as well as places like NYC/East Coast, Chicago, California, Texas and others- they expect all areas to buy the same/similar and then, they give people a hard time when that doesn't happen. Companies based in a small country like England need to come to the US to learn, not look at the data and tell people how it is. Many US states are larger than England- anyplace in that country are within one day's travel distance.

 

[1981rt]

Why have we veered away from the AS 801 topic?