Monolith 7x200w for 6x JBL 590s .. Overkill?

ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Overlord
Your Denon X4400H outputs 105watts/ch. In my opinion, the Outlaw's power output is only 120 watts, less than 1 dB more, and that would be a waste of money.

If you want external amplification, the 3 channel 200 w/ch Monolith would be the wiser decision. As I previously said, your receiver is amply capable of driving all the surround channels with external front channel amplification.
This.

@gaby95 If you are going to spend the money on an Amp, you want it to make a difference. There is another thread happening where a guy wants to run his Speakers at 105dB PLUS headroom. (This is a stupid idea, and I am not recommending it for you.) I bring it up, however because in the conversation it is brought up about how much power an amp should be able to deliver to your Speakers.
The 590s are rated up to 250w. They are 6ohm nominal, and if rated truthfully, can likewise still drop to 4ohms.

My goal would be to Power the Mains specifically with something capable of delivering 300W at 4ohms. Not because you will NEED it. But because it safely covers what your Speakers may demand in a worst case scenario.
Mind... your ears will likely tap out well before that point.
This is the nature of Headroom.
The difference between 150w and 300w is 3dB. Enough to make a difference in SPL, yes. Yet anything less than that isn't really giving you anything you do not already have. except perhaps a little more juice down low when the dynamics demand a little more.

The other channels usually aren't as demanding. Center can be. But you have a different Speaker there which I am less familiar with.

Amp conversations like this come down to a value proposition... what that means to you, only you can determine. However, if you want to buy an Amp, look for the one that is going to make a difference, and do so in a reasonable budget.
There are Amps out there which can give you more juice still, but the cost starts to rise significantly. Moreover, you don't really benefit from that.
But an Amp that can give you 200w into 8 ohms, 300 into 4 would be your sweet spot using the 590s.

Again, you will likely never come close to tapping that power reserve. :)
 
G

gaby95

Audioholic
This.

@gaby95 If you are going to spend the money on an Amp, you want it to make a difference. There is another thread happening where a guy wants to run his Speakers at 105dB PLUS headroom. (This is a stupid idea, and I am not recommending it for you.) I bring it up, however because in the conversation it is brought up about how much power an amp should be able to deliver to your Speakers.
The 590s are rated up to 250w. They are 6ohm nominal, and if rated truthfully, can likewise still drop to 4ohms.

My goal would be to Power the Mains specifically with something capable of delivering 300W at 4ohms. Not because you will NEED it. But because it safely covers what your Speakers may demand in a worst case scenario.
Mind... your ears will likely tap out well before that point.
This is the nature of Headroom.
The difference between 150w and 300w is 3dB. Enough to make a difference in SPL, yes. Yet anything less than that isn't really giving you anything you do not already have. except perhaps a little more juice down low when the dynamics demand a little more.

The other channels usually aren't as demanding. Center can be. But you have a different Speaker there which I am less familiar with.

Amp conversations like this come down to a value proposition... what that means to you, only you can determine. However, if you want to buy an Amp, look for the one that is going to make a difference, and do so in a reasonable budget.
There are Amps out there which can give you more juice still, but the cost starts to rise significantly. Moreover, you don't really benefit from that.
But an Amp that can give you 200w into 8 ohms, 300 into 4 would be your sweet spot using the 590s.

Again, you will likely never come close to tapping that power reserve. :)
Thanks a for for the details, it all makes sense indeed :)
 
Verdinut

Verdinut

Audioholic Spartan
G

gaby95

Audioholic
Here are the specs for the Monolith 3 channel power amp:

This amplifier can output 300 watts/ch with a 4 ohm load with all channels driven. It would be pretty well matched with the JBL 590's.
So I checked today and it seems that I watch movies at around -8 or -7.
Also, at least from specs my receive pulls a max of 780w so that comes to 87W max..of course, not all channels pull the same amount at the same time but kind of getting an idea of what it can do.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Overlord
So I checked today and it seems that I watch movies at around -8 or -7.
Also, at least from specs my receive pulls a max of 780w so that comes to 87W max..of course, not all channels pull the same amount at the same time but kind of getting an idea of what it can do.
For Denon and Marantz gear, they claim that when running multiple channels you can expect 70% of rated per channel performance.
You cannot just take the Total Watts and divide it. Other factors come in to play. Gene had done an article or video on this at some point. May be worth searching and seeing if you can find it. ;)
 
Verdinut

Verdinut

Audioholic Spartan
So I checked today and it seems that I watch movies at around -8 or -7.
Also, at least from specs my receive pulls a max of 780w so that comes to 87W max..of course, not all channels pull the same amount at the same time but kind of getting an idea of what it can do.
Where did you get info indicating that it consumes 780 watts. If that is what is mentioned in your owner's manual, it has nothing to do with it's maximum power consumption. As a matter of fact, the figure given is most likely the average power consumption for a certain power output which has never been clarified by any AVR manufacturer so far. It could be referring to a consumption while output with all channels driven at 25 or 30% of their average power rating.

Also, when it consumes 780 watts, it cannot output 100% of what it consumes as it's not 100% efficient. There is power loss in heat and the power transformer is neither 100% efficient. Nothing that consumes electricity is 100% efficient.
 
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mono-bloc

mono-bloc

Full Audioholic
As reported above adding a power amp for the front channels is an excepted way of doing things. To progress further consider a 3 channel PA, which would include the center channel. Rotel's RB 993 while a bit dated is a fine example, Or take it a stage further and use a RMB 1066, 6 channel, Use in bridge mono mode getting 150watts into an 8 ohm load. Many years ago I ventured into the power amp world and obtained a Rotel RB 1070 twin channel PA. Rated at 170 watts per channel. I then learned that it could be mono-bloc'ed, So I acquired a second 1070, and mono bloc'ed them to give be 350+ watts per unit These things will drive 2 ohm load without raising a sweat, and clipping is somewhere in the past. Plus the cost for used / 2nd hand is reasonable

Monolith and Outlaw are not available here [ OZ ] Also Emotiva have ceased to be imported, Our 5 channel reasonable priced PA's consist of Rotel 1075 and hand made Elektra, Arthur does not have a web site, product info available here. HTTPS://www.sydneyhificastlehill.com.au/brand/Elektra-audio/
 
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