Marantz SR6014 vs. Denon AVR-X3600H

A

AltecBX

Audiophyte
Hi Guys, long time follower/first time subscribing.

Been researching the internet for the last few months to get into a home theater setup. In the meantime, I just got in the Atmos game by going with a Nakamichi shockwafe ultra 9.2 soundbar. The experience has been awesome but I feel like I should get dedicated ceiling speakers to experience what I think is missing in certain movies. I'm still in the planning stage but want to get the right receiver for the job. Speakers, placements, sus, etc is coming later. Now, I want to make sure I get the right receiver to and these two look like the ones I may need.

I came across the SR6014 & the X3600H which will do everything I want. (Atmos, DTS-X, Auro 3D, eArc, HDCP 2.3, iMax Enhanced, etc.) They are both 9.2 channels receiver with similar specs, but the 6014 is $400 more ($1,499 vs $1,099). My question is, What is the difference between both other than the things I mentioned (Please nerd out), that's why I'm here to learn the things I'm not used too seeing on youtube reviews and Amazon/Crutchfield bullet points.

Thanks
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
I expect others will give you a more specific run down, but as a rule (I assume you know that Marantz and Denon are owned by the same company and share much of their designs) these two are much the same.
Marketing, Marantz is sold as a more upscale product relying on their more prominent reputation while Denon is more value oriented. I think the analogy of Pontiac vs Chevy is reasonably applied here and I think I read that the more recent models had very little to differentiate between the Denon and Marantz versions!
One thing you should consider is buying last year's model (6013 or 3500) at a great discount. Seldom is there a new feature that comes close to justifying the difference in price!
 
A

AltecBX

Audiophyte
Thanks Kew.
Yep I know that is owned under the same umbrella. I wanted to see the differences, other than the obvious things that are known. I want to see if the Marantz is worth the extra $400, even though both of these are built in the same factory in Vietnam. I know last year models are cheaper but decided to go with 2019 models instead.
 
ryanosaur

ryanosaur

Audioholic Ninja
Really, it comes down to a couple items difference. In the previous models, Marantz offers the HDAM modules, and usually has extra analog inputs that the Denon does not. Denon has offered a slightly beefier Amp stage.
The differences will really come down to your preference and feature set, (in terms of whether you may need those analog inputs, for example).
Denon has been considered a slightly better value, as they sound no different.
Hope that helps!
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I expect others will give you a more specific run down, but as a rule (I assume you know that Marantz and Denon are owned by the same company and share much of their designs) these two are much the same.
Marketing, Marantz is sold as a more upscale product relying on their more prominent reputation while Denon is more value oriented. I think the analogy of Pontiac vs Chevy is reasonably applied here and I think I read that the more recent models had very little to differentiate between the Denon and Marantz versions!
One thing you should consider is buying last year's model (6013 or 3500) at a great discount. Seldom is there a new feature that comes close to justifying the difference in price!
I would have suggested the same, but not this time because the 3500 is limited to 7.1. The 3600 has 9 channels of power amps and can process 11.1, more truly comparable to the 6013 or 6014 except it does not have the 7.1 analog inputs and HDAM.
 
D

Don Gately

Audiophyte
I don't know if this violates rules on here, but as far as specs comparison goes, zkelectronics is the best resource I've found. No offense but it would be a foolish decision to buy the 6014 over the 6013. THEY ARE THE SAME--the only difference is HDCP 2.3 and higher bluetooth standard. Bluetooth sucks anyway. Now with the Denon's, there is quite a bit of difference between the two, to start the 3500 is only 7.2. Another site to check out is audio science review. The numbers from the previous model were not very good as far as S/N ratio and distortion. I recently just purchased the 6013 to replace an Onkyo 686. I could not be more happy. I would consider the Onkyo 840 before the Denon.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I don't know if this violates rules on here, but as far as specs comparison goes, zkelectronics is the best resource I've found. No offense but it would be a foolish decision to buy the 6014 over the 6013. THEY ARE THE SAME--the only difference is HDCP 2.3 and higher bluetooth standard. Bluetooth sucks anyway. Now with the Denon's, there is quite a bit of difference between the two, to start the 3500 is only 7.2. Another site to check out is audio science review. The numbers from the previous model were not very good as far as S/N ratio and distortion. I recently just purchased the 6013 to replace an Onkyo 686. I could not be more happy. I would consider the Onkyo 840 before the Denon.
Since you referenced ASR, their numbers were not bad at all for the X3500H, ranked higher than quite a few much more expensive units including Anthem's and NAD's in SINAD, SNR and DR. Keep in mind their numbers are "unweighted" so you have to read them in comparison with other units tested and measured the same way.
I just took another look to do some comparison with the Marantz AV8805 and noticed that the X3500H's DR, measured under the same condition, i.e using digital input, was only about 1 dB below that of the AV8805 That's actually much better than I expected.


The AV8805 did much better in the DAC section but that should be expected for the obvious reasons. Fair comparisons should be made with other AVRs and the lower end integrated amps in the same price range.

In that sense, overall, the AVR-X3500H actually performed quite well on the ASR test bench. In fact, the reviewer commented that:

"The AR-X3500H massively outperforms the two NAD products in noise and distortion while matching the power rating. And on that front, the amp is exceeding its rated power. "

"Again, the NAD T777 V3 is left in the dust with respect to noise and distortion."

In the conclusion, he said:

"Overall, you have a lousy DAC but a good amplifier with Room EQ at attractive price in Denon AVR-X3500H. As such, it makes a decent option if you have such needs. If it goes on sale, it may be even a better bet. "

I highlighted the last sentence because it has in fact been on sale. As the X3600H price has dropped too, imo it is now the one to get. In fact, if you don't mind me using your logic "No offense but it would be a foolish decision to buy the 6014 over the 6013." I could say the same thing about the 6013 vs the X3600H, currently C$1599 vs C$798, but that's only true for Canadians.
 
CajunLB

CajunLB

Full Audioholic
I am understanding that you can’t try the DTS-X up mixer on Dolby content to see which one you prefer on the Denon avr-X3600H. I’m a new owner and very d about this.
 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
This is an interesting discussion, as I am pretty much in the same situation; planning my upgrade.

To provide some background, I am based in the Philippines, so availability and pricing is vastly different from the US. I am in communication with various retailers, and will post an update with prices once I receive them.

I currently have a Yamaha RX-V375 5.1 channel amp, and am looking to move to a 9.2 channel amp. I was trying to decide between 7.2.2, and 5.2.4, and am now leaning towards 5.2.4. Do share your thoughts if you believe 7.2.2 would be better.

My front towers are Polk Audio Signature S50's. Picked them up last year, and am very happy with them for 2 channel stereo. My upgrade now is purely for movies and home-theater. That said, if there is more quality to be extracted for stereo music listening through this upgrade, great!

The contenders:
  • Denon AVR-X3600H
  • Denon AVR-X4500
  • Marantz SR6013
  • Marantz SR6014
  • Onkyo TX-RZ740
  • Yamaha RX-A2080
The Onkyo is the cheapest of the lot.

What I've read so far:
- The 6014 has little in terms of new features, making the 6013 the better option.
- The Marantz can run really hot, which is a bit of a concern, given the already hot tropical climate. Though the receiver will be placed in the open.
- Marantz receivers are great in terms of their musicality, and should be the first choice for stereo music.
- I do prefer the larger screens, with more info displayed, especially the speakers in use, and the movie soundtrack format being decoded (DTS, DTS-H, Dolby Digital, etc.). This puts the Marantz at a disadvantage given its minimalistic screen.

Let me know of your expert thoughts and suggestions please.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
- Marantz receivers are great in terms of their musicality, and should be the first choice for stereo music.
That's fake, hearsay, no such thing at all. I like Marantz and have quite a few of their prepro, preamp and amps so I don't think I am biased against them.:D If distortion is below the threshold of audibility, musicality is determined by the media content itself, not the transparent amplifiers. So I hope you don't fall for those market hypes, invented by fans and dealers. Some also claimed Yamaha/Sony are thin and bright sounding, no truth to those either. Amps just amplify, not suppose to change the signal other than linear amplification. Okay it might have been true many years ago that somehow some manufacturers would tune their amps to have a drop off at above 8 kHz or something like that but I am not sure if that's even true really..

Of those listed, my recommendation is, as usual, the AVR-X3600H, but some people found that the AVR-X4500H has been at the same price point, in that case it is a no brainer. If longevity is very important to you, you should consider Yamaha, so then the RX-A2080 would be my choice, but you won't be able to do 7.1.4, that to me is a must even for my small room but ymmv..
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
I was trying to decide between 7.2.2, and 5.2.4, and am now leaning towards 5.2.4. Do share your thoughts if you believe 7.2.2 would be better.
I believe the consensus among Atmos users is that 5.1.4 is better than 7.1.2.
 
M

Michael Brown

Audiophyte
I understand the Denon X3600H can process 11 channels and you could upgrade to 7.1.4 later by adding a 2 channel amp to the first two front channels. I think it may be one of the few capable of doing this.
 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
That's fake, hearsay, no such thing at all. I like Marantz and have quite a few of their prepro, preamp and amps so I don't think I am biased against them.:D If distortion is below the threshold of audibility, musicality is determined by the media content itself, not the transparent amplifiers. So I hope you don't fall for those market hypes, invented by fans and dealers. Some also claimed Yamaha/Sony are thin and bright sounding, no truth to those either. Amps just amplify, not suppose to change the signal other than linear amplification. Okay it might have been true many years ago that somehow some manufacturers would tune their amps to have a drop off at above 8 kHz or something like that but I am not sure if that's even true really..

Of those listed, my recommendation is, as usual, the AVR-X3600H, but some people found that the AVR-X4500H has been at the same price point, in that case it is a no brainer. If longevity is very important to you, you should consider Yamaha, so then the RX-A2080 would be my choice, but you won't be able to do 7.1.4, that to me is a must even for my small room but ymmv..
Thanks so much for the detailed notes Peng; it helps a lot.

I had a feeling that the supposed claims of 'better in terms of musicality' sounded like snake oil. Thanks for clarifying.

You've mentioned the Yamaha RX-A2080 for longevity; is Yamaha known for a better build and thus longer life?

I'm still awaiting the prices; will share once I have that. That'd be a key factor too. I've also asked about possible promos, and ongoing promos.
 
E

EBN

Audioholic Intern
This is an interesting discussion, as I am pretty much in the same situation; planning my upgrade.

To provide some background, I am based in the Philippines, so availability and pricing is vastly different from the US. I am in communication with various retailers, and will post an update with prices once I receive them.

I currently have a Yamaha RX-V375 5.1 channel amp, and am looking to move to a 9.2 channel amp. I was trying to decide between 7.2.2, and 5.2.4, and am now leaning towards 5.2.4. Do share your thoughts if you believe 7.2.2 would be better.

My front towers are Polk Audio Signature S50's. Picked them up last year, and am very happy with them for 2 channel stereo. My upgrade now is purely for movies and home-theater. That said, if there is more quality to be extracted for stereo music listening through this upgrade, great!

The contenders:
  • Denon AVR-X3600H
  • Denon AVR-X4500
  • Marantz SR6013
  • Marantz SR6014
  • Onkyo TX-RZ740
  • Yamaha RX-A2080
The Onkyo is the cheapest of the lot.

What I've read so far:
- The 6014 has little in terms of new features, making the 6013 the better option.
- The Marantz can run really hot, which is a bit of a concern, given the already hot tropical climate. Though the receiver will be placed in the open.
- Marantz receivers are great in terms of their musicality, and should be the first choice for stereo music.
- I do prefer the larger screens, with more info displayed, especially the speakers in use, and the movie soundtrack format being decoded (DTS, DTS-H, Dolby Digital, etc.). This puts the Marantz at a disadvantage given its minimalistic screen.

Let me know of your expert thoughts and suggestions please.
Just wait little longer. It won´t be more than few weeks for Denon, Yamaha and Onkyo when you start to see new models announced. If you still want to stick with the models you mentioned you should see price reduction around June-August. For Yamaha that could mean being able to jump on RX-A3080. It has 11.2 processing for 7.2.4 if you change your mind later and want larger system. Also better DAC and few extra watts plus XLR connections. The information below just cause i know @PENG is reading this thread. ;)

The Yamaha RX-A3080 utilize the ESS SABRE ES9026PRO DAC (for the main 7 channels)
which has up to 124 dB dynamic range and -110 dB THD+N. In terms of digital-to-analog conversion taking place on the remaining channels, the RX-A3080 uses the ESS SABRE ES9007S DAC. Instead of two different DAC models, the RX-A2080 uses dual ESS SABRE ES9007S DACs. As a result, however, the RX-A2080 doesn't have the total harmonic distortion compensation function in order further minimize noise which the ESS SABRE ES9026PRO DAC provide for the RX-A3080 7 main channels. The RX-A2080 also lacks the ability to adjust the roll-off frequency for the DAC digital filters whereas on the RX-A3080 and RX-A3070 either Sharp or Slow roll-off type can be selected. Additionally, you can use Short Latency Type of filter on the RX-A3080 and RX-A3070 so that the audio delay is reduced. Only the RX-A3080 and RX-A3070 have an Ultra Low Jitter PLL Mode which allows you to choose from three levels of jitter elimination.
 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
Just wait little longer. It won´t be more than few weeks for Denon, Yamaha and Onkyo when you start to see new models announced. If you still want to stick with the models you mentioned you should see price reduction around June-August. For Yamaha that could mean being able to jump on RX-A3080. It has 11.2 processing for 7.2.4 if you change your mind later and want larger system. Also better DAC and few extra watts plus XLR connections. The information below just cause i know @PENG is reading this thread. ;)
Thanks EBN. This is great info.

I'm perfectly fine to wait till Jun-Aug; though a factor will be how long it'll take to trickle down to the Philippines. Availability may not be as quick as the US.

I did read about the Sabre DACs in other reviews, but the differences between the A2080 and A3080 are good to know. I don't believe I looked into the A3080.
 
V

virtualdanger

Audioholic Intern
I have received the prices from the Audio store:

Denon AVR-X3600H - 1281
Denon AVR-X4500 - 1340
Marantz SR6013 - 1261
Marantz SR6014 - 1340
Onkyo TX-RZ740 - 847

I've converted all of them from Philippine Pesos to USD.

The Yamaha A2080 is not in stock at this time, and they do not have pricing on it.

Does this change anything; or is the Denon AVR-X3600 still the best option?
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Thanks so much for the detailed notes Peng; it helps a lot.

I had a feeling that the supposed claims of 'better in terms of musicality' sounded like snake oil. Thanks for clarifying.

You've mentioned the Yamaha RX-A2080 for longevity; is Yamaha known for a better build and thus longer life?

I'm still awaiting the prices; will share once I have that. That'd be a key factor too. I've also asked about possible promos, and ongoing promos.
That has been suggested by M Code, a long time member who has a lot of insider information. If you do a search just here on Audioholics.com, you will find that has been some troubles reported by a few owners, so I did ask M Code to do a follow up to see if there are updates to show if more recent stats/service records still indicate their recent models (say within the last 5-6 years) still appear to be more reliable than other major players like D+M, Yamaha, Pioneer, Onkyo, Sony, NAD etc.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Thanks for seconding; will stick with my 5.1.4 plan.
How about room dimensions? If it is something larger than 12X18X8, I would suggest 7.1.4. I agree 5.1.4 is better than 7.1.2, it is just so obvious, that I think it is common sense..:D
 

newsletter
  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top