Marantz AV 10 installed: - Early Review and Impressions.

[AcuDefTechGuy]

... and I thought your posts were long.

You’re NOT kidding. His posts are the longest. Every post has a story.

 

[highfigh]

You’re NOT kidding. His posts are the longest. Every post has a story.

But cumulatively, Dude uses far more bandwidth.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

But cumulatively, Dude uses far more bandwidth.

More bandwidth for what? Hating all AVRs, passive speakers, and Room EQ?

 

[Golfx]

I have it that way. If I am wrong about this correct me Gene, but I set all the bed layer speakers to large, and only the ceiling speakers are crossed iver, and I checked the LFE + main option.

On my previous units you set a speaker to large and had the option to check LFE + main for each speaker. So rightly, or wrongly I assumed the end result was the same and just saved a few steps. As far as I can tell the measurements are the same.

My rears in particular have a very potent bass response. Two KEF B139s in a properly designed and constructed TL line can produce prodigious bass. Raymond Cooke rated them at 80 watts each, but others have found the correct rating is 200 watts each. I have driven them hard for years and touch wood I never blown one up. I hope that does not tempt fate and ruin my run. Falcon acoustics are manufacturing the B 139 again. That is one of the finest bass driver of all time and can see off a lot of, if not most of the competition.

Any how I think always having this AV system set that way, has contributed to the even and not at all boomy bass response over the whole room.

Lastly thank you so much for steering me to the Marantz AV 10. That was the right choice I am certain. Unfortunately I think those units coming out of Vietnam have to be relegated to the junk category. My 7705 failed at five years and went off to be recycled, and the 7706 is on its way back to Marantz now after developing a fault at three months.

My only issue with the AV 10 is its user manual is over 350 pages!

I love Denon/Marantz user manuals—no one else comes close to their thoroughness. Certainly not Anthem.

 

[TLS Guy]

I love Denon/Marantz user manuals—no one else comes close to their thoroughness. Certainly not Anthem.

I agree with that, but it just shows the level of complexity we have got to, when the user manual runs over 350 pages! Then we wonder why there is consumer resistance and the box stores are stuffed with sound bars. The point I continue to make, is that unless there are good simpler solutions that people new to all this can understand then this hobby will niche itself into oblivion. That would be very sad indeed. This would not be good for the industry and especially not the performing arts.

 

[TLS Guy]

I would still go with whichever sounds better, but just for kicks, did you compare the FR graphs of Audyssey of the AV10 vs NO-AUDYSSEY?

I did do this today. I was actually surprised as with no Audyssey and with reference Audyssey the curves were virtually identical. This was a surprise as in previous AVPs Audyssey has really made a mess of it. So either Audyssey has been improved or there is better implementation. I could not hear a difference either, so I left it off to avoid a layer of processing. I guess I will have to be more circumspect about what I say about Audyssey in future. I won't be getting Dirac and their bass management is incompatible with how my system is designed.

At this time I can't believe how good this AV10 sounds. I can assure you, that you can give it a 10 out of 10 recommendation to any prospective purchasers.

I am still more than a little puzzled why this unit sounds better than the 7705 and 7706. I have long been of the opinion that speakers are so dominant in the sound, which I think they are, that electronics would have to be very poor to alter it. So, I think this forces me to change my view on this. But this has certainly caused me to revise my opinion on this. What makes it more difficult is that I am not sure for certain what it is that has actually caused this improvement.

 

[TLS Guy]

And just think- at $130/hr per person (minimum, now), you saved over $3600, just in labor. Fun, isn't it?

Unexpected improvements are one of the reasons I have enjoyed installing AV/Home Theater and stereo systems- when the client is blown away and they make it obvious, it's a good thing. As a DIY-er, it's even better, expecially when your expectations weren't high.

Just in case you didn't see it, I found this in General, Front Panel- maybe it will help with the lights being too bright.

Front Panel AV 10

manuals.marantz.com

I did alter the light today, but the middle setting, which is the next one down, is too dim, and I can't read the display from my chair at the MLP. So it will have to stay as it is, and I'm getting used to it.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I could not hear a difference either, so I left it off to avoid a layer of processing.

So Audyssey FR graph was same as No Audyssey, and SQ was also the same with vs without Audyssey.

That’s a big compliment coming from you since you’ve always hated Room Correction with a passion.

 

[TLS Guy]

So Audyssey FR graph was same as No Audyssey, and SQ was also the same with vs without Audyssey.

That’s a big compliment coming from you since you’ve always hated Room Correction with a passion.

Yes it was the same except for very minor insignificant variations and sounded the same.

Previously with all my other AVPs Audyssey has been wide of the mark, and not sounded good. So, this has been another surprise among many.

I honestly was really concerned about the failure of the last 2 units, especially the last.

Frankly the only thing I expected from the AV 10 was a lower noise floor, and that it delivered. What I did not expect was this significant increase in SQ, and it is significant. You can't miss it. I am not at all sure why.

This evening I listened to this Friday's MN Orchestra concert streamed live with audio engineered by MPR and vision by TPT. Both picture and sound were superb. Now I'm very familiar with Orchestra Hall and the Minnesota Orchestra. Honestly I might just as well have been there. The sound and ring of the hall was just like I know it, and the whole sound stage was so realistic with everything not only very accurate left to right, but front to back, and wider than the room, and seeming to stretch way beyond the screen.
The Dolby Surround up mixer in this unit seems to work nearly as well as native Atmos streams. In the applause I was totally surrounded like you would be in the concert hall.

How this is being achieved is totally beyond me, and unexpected. So I have gone from being annoyed by the failure of that 7706 and regarding it as good fortune and regard the price of the AV 10 money well spent. I never imagined that audio in the home could ever get so close to the live event. The speaker system and amps are powerful enough I can play at full concert hall levels which also adds to the realism.

So, it turns out, that my speaker system has not been the limiting factor of this rig, which honestly has been a quite astonishing revelation. I just wish I knew why. What I do know is that AV 10 must have been designed by very skilled and dedicated engineers. Honestly this is the first time I have had to regard the failure of a key component as a blessing.

 

[Squishman]

Now I'm very familiar with Orchestra Hall and the Minnesota Orchestra. Honestly I might just as well have been there.

I saw The Kinks at Orchestra Hall in the 70's. ha.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Yes it was the same except for very minor insignificant variations and sounded the same.

Previously with all my other AVPs Audyssey has been wide of the mark, and not sounded good. So, this has been another surprise among many.

I honestly was really concerned about the failure of the last 2 units, especially the last.

Frankly the only thing I expected from the AV 10 was a lower noise floor, and that it delivered. What I did not expect was this significant increase in SQ, and it is significant. You can't miss it. I am not at all sure why.

This evening I listened to this Friday's MN Orchestra concert streamed live with audio engineered by MPR and vision by TPT. Both picture and sound were superb. Now I'm very familiar with Orchestra Hall and the Minnesota Orchestra. Honestly I might just as well have been there. The sound and ring of the hall was just like I know it, and the whole sound stage was so realistic with everything not only very accurate left to right, but front to back, and wider than the room, and seeming to stretch way beyond the screen.
The Dolby Surround up mixer in this unit seems to work nearly as well as native Atmos streams. In the applause I was totally surrounded like you would be in the concert hall.

How this is being achieved is totally beyond me, and unexpected. So I have gone from being annoyed by the failure of that 7706 and regarding it as good fortune and regard the price of the AV 10 money well spent. I never imagined that audio in the home could ever get so close to the live event. The speaker system and amps are powerful enough I can play at full concert hall levels which also adds to the realism.

So, it turns out, that my speaker system has not been the limiting factor of this rig, which honestly has been a quite astonishing revelation. I just wish I knew why. What I do know is that AV 10 must have been designed by very skilled and dedicated engineers. Honestly this is the first time I have had to regard the failure of a key component as a blessing.

So it’s sort of a “blessing in disguise” or serendipity.

Hey, let Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Chopin, Debussy, and Schubert come to your room! Enjoy life to the max!

 

[TLS Guy]

So it’s sort of a “blessing in disguise” or serendipity.

Hey, let Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Chopin, Debussy, and Schubert come to your room! Enjoy life to the max!

Well, that is it exactly. I bought this, what can only be called a very high end luxury unit, for reasons of reliability. I did not imagine what has transpired, but I will take it for sure.

I just wish I knew why. The test equipment I have is very useful and serviceable, but I am sure it is not up to solving this riddle. This is the first unit I have had that truly makes Audyssey work "like it says on the tin." The change in distortion levels does not account for this. My hunch is that it is the DAC and how these surround modes and upmixer is implemented. But that is well beyond my pay grade. I had no idea this speaker system could be made to reproduce program at such a high level as it does now. That is a very pleasant surprise.

I can tell you one thing, I won't discourage any member considering an up grade to the AV 10 or AV 20. That is for sure. I doubt they put lead weights in those units, so that increase in the back breaking lift, must have a purpose. I was stunned at our heavy their was and had to make a careful plan to install and mount it safely.

Since you are a dealer, my only advice is to encourage a customer pondering purchase of one of these units.

 

[highfigh]

More bandwidth for what? Hating all AVRs, passive speakers, and Room EQ?

Have you seen the number of his posts, often one after another? Mostly in the Steam Vent.

 

[Trebdp83]

I did alter the light today, but the middle setting, which is the next one down, is too dim, and I can't read the display from my chair at the MLP. So it will have to stay as it is, and I'm getting used to it.

Can the illumination feature brightness level not be adjusted separately from the port hole and full display panel brightness level? Is this not achievable from the Display Settings in the Onscreen setup?

It would be criminal if the AV10 did NOT outperform the 7706 in every way. I do not think you will miss the 7.1 CH IN feature. I’m curious about the comparison to the material played using it in the old unit to HDMI in the new unit with digital processing now fully available for use.

I’m also still curious about the use of the LFE Distribution setting but it may be a bit complicated in your case based on the way your speakers are set up and wired.

 

[highfigh]

I just wish I knew why. The test equipment I have is very useful and serviceable, but I am sure it is not up to solving this riddle. This is the first unit I have had that truly makes Audyssey work "like it says on the tin." The change in distortion levels does not account for this. My hunch is that it is the DAC and how these surround modes and upmixer is implemented. But that is well beyond my pay grade. I had no idea this speaker system could be made to reproduce program at such a high level as it does now. That is a very pleasant surprise.

I can tell you one thing, I won't discourage any member considering an up grade to the AV 10 or AV 20. That is for sure. I doubt they put lead weights in those units, so that increase in the back breaking lift, must have a purpose. I was stunned at our heavy their was and had to make a careful plan to install and mount it safely.

Since you mentioned weight, have you read much about the effects of vibration on circuits and assemblies? It matters. I don't think it matters as much as audiopile fancy gadget sellers do, but it matters. A friend spent a lot of his career as an Electrical Engineer working for Defense Department contractors, in guided missile design, construction and testing.

I'll be seeing him this month, so I'll ask about this. At least the equipment we use doesn't need nuclear hardening.

Components fail when subjected to extremes of all kinds and maybe yours was more sensitive to it
than it should have been. Heavy audio component chassis design has existed for decades- Sony was using a composite for the base of their Esprit series preamps, power amps, etc and it's an easy concept- it's more difficult for sound to cause vibrations in dense materials but curciot board flex, so they need more points for support if low sensitivity to airborn energy was part of the design.

 

[Trell]

Have you seen the number of his posts, often one after another? Mostly in the Steam Vent.

And there there are your misanthropic xenophobic rantings on topics you know little about with more than a little tinge of xenophobia.

 

[TLS Guy]

And there there are your misanthropic xenophobic rantings on topics you know little about with more than a little tinge of xenophobia.

Yes, and I’d like that translated please. Them’s big words!

 

[Trell]

Yes, and I’d like that translated please. Them’s big words!

Go read his posts in the Steam Vent, and when he runs out of arguments or is just annoyed he drags out his xenophobe card against non-US members. He's done that for years.

And yes, he's a bigot.

 

[Trell]

So it’s sort of a “blessing in disguise” or serendipity.

Hey, let Bach, Beethoven, Mozart, Chopin, Debussy, and Schubert come to your room! Enjoy life to the max!

So no more ranting about AVR and Room EQ from him?

Not all of us can afford to build a house with specially designed rooms for audio along with all the needed equipments. Some of us actually lives in apartments with limited placements and what we can do in it. But hey, I should only use stereo and not a 5.1 setup, because something.

Looking at his pictures of his excellent, it really is, audio setups (posted many times) in his house it's very easy for the causal reader to get the impression that it's a common house and they can get similar. That's quite unlikely as special attention has been made to not only the dimensions of the rooms, but of it's construction as well. You could say it's very much "in between the walls": Extensive room treatments that are hidden from view and that is the way I would for me, as well, but that takes space and money.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I won't discourage any member considering an up grade to the AV 10 or AV 20. Since you are a dealer, my only advice is to encourage a customer pondering purchase of one of these units.

Only if they have the budget.

For clients who don’t have the budget, I recommend a much less expensive Denon or Yamaha that will still sound very good.