Looking to buy a HiFi system for an open living room for music and TV.

[lawatson123]

I'm looking to move outside my HT for a HiFi 2 or 2.1 channel set-up for music, but will also need to have HDMI for TV use. It will be in an open floorplan living room that opens up to the kitchen, eat-in and sunroom (Mungo Homes The Webster to be exact). The house should be built by June, so planning ahead! I was thinking about the Arcam SA35 when it comes out and maybe Arendal 1723 THX Towers. Would that be a solid jump off point or are there other combos I should look into.

 

[everettT]

I'm looking to move outside my HT for a HiFi 2 or 2.1 channel set-up for music, but will also need to have HDMI for TV use. It will be in an open floorplan living room that opens up to the kitchen, eat-in and sunroom (Mungo Homes The Webster to be exact). The house should be built by June, so planning ahead! I was thinking about the Arcam SA35 when it comes out and maybe Arendal 1723 THX Towers. Would that be a solid jump off point or are there other combos I should look into.

If the space is large, bass management would be a top consideration for me and would make sure my electronics are capable of performing that. If it's 2.1 look at the Lyngdorf streaming amps.

 

[TLS Guy]

I'm looking to move outside my HT for a HiFi 2 or 2.1 channel set-up for music, but will also need to have HDMI for TV use. It will be in an open floorplan living room that opens up to the kitchen, eat-in and sunroom (Mungo Homes The Webster to be exact). The house should be built by June, so planning ahead! I was thinking about the Arcam SA35 when it comes out and maybe Arendal 1723 THX Towers. Would that be a solid jump off point or are there other combos I should look into.

In a situation like that, if it is a new build do an in wall installation. That is what I designed for our great room in a new build five years ago.

That is a big space and that system fills it easily. We use that system a lot, especially my wife who is its biggest fan.

If this is a new build remember that builders on the whole are idiots and need watching like hawks.

One thing they pretty much always neglect is a proper Internet infrastructure. In the modern home this is as important as plumbing and the electrical service.

Choose a place to put an internet patchtay, close to your router and cable modem if you need one. Then connect with wired cat6 to local patch bays. Put all cable in conduit so they can be easily and cheaply undated.

Cheap flexible conduit.

Ethernet patch bay.

Ethernet hub

Stay constantly alert to the stupidity and obstructions of Interior designers.

 

[lawatson123]

Thanks for the tips. It is unfortunately a set design from a large development group with minimal ability to change any thing remotely structural. We did run Cat6 to all foreseeable needed areas and dedicated 20A circuits and outlets, but no go with getting to do anything like in walls.

 

[TLS Guy]

Thanks for the tips. It is unfortunately a set design from a large development group with minimal ability to change any thing remotely structural. We did run Cat6 to all foreseeable needed areas and dedicated 20A circuits and outlets, but no go with getting to do anything like in walls.

Condolences to you on that. Those sort of builders are generally the worst of the lot. Make sure the building inspectors go over it with a fine tooth comb.

Seriously though I would check on things like the roof truss specs and everything you can think of. I mention that as I had to totally re-speck the trusses. I have just done a solar project and even with the added weight I still have 100% unused load factor. The solar people showed me photographs of other homes and some could not take the load of the panels. What is saw was a bunch of roofs ready to blow off in the first really high wind.

Remember you are the best inspector. If it looks dodgy it will be, so make them do it properly.

If you can go in wall, then at least pre-wire speaker and equipment locations with conduit.

If you want in walls, I'm sure they would leave a wall, or part of a wall unfinished. In addition there are commercial in walls that can be placed in finished walls, and you can pre-wire for such.

The problem is great rooms are large spaces that take significant power, and speakers to do the job can certainly detract from the space. The other option is to create a dedicated AV space. I have the luxury of being able to do that as well.

 

[lawatson123]

Condolences to you on that. Those sort of builders are generally the worst of the lot. Make sure the building inspectors go over it with a fine tooth comb.

Seriously though I would check on things like the roof truss specs and everything you can think of. I mention that as I had to totally re-speck the trusses. I have just done a solar project and even with the added weight I still have 100% unused load factor. The solar people showed me photographs of other homes and some could not take the load of the panels. What is saw was a bunch of roofs ready to blow off in the first really high wind.

Remember you are the best inspector. If it looks dodgy it will be, so make them do it properly.

If you can go in wall, then at least pre-wire speaker and equipment locations with conduit.

If you want in walls, I'm sure they would leave a wall, or part of a wall unfinished. In addition there are commercial in walls that can be placed in finished walls, and you can pre-wire for such.

The problem is great rooms are large spaces that take significant power, and speakers to do the job can certainly detract from the space. The other option is to create a dedicated AV space. I have the luxury of being able to do that as well.

Do you have any finished pics of the network area?

 

[Eppie]

I'm looking to move outside my HT for a HiFi 2 or 2.1 channel set-up for music, but will also need to have HDMI for TV use. It will be in an open floorplan living room that opens up to the kitchen, eat-in and sunroom (Mungo Homes The Webster to be exact). The house should be built by June, so planning ahead! I was thinking about the Arcam SA35 when it comes out and maybe Arendal 1723 THX Towers. Would that be a solid jump off point or are there other combos I should look into.

To get back to your original question, electronics depend on the features you need. The Arcam SA35 seems to check a lot of boxes as features go but would not have enough inputs for my needs. The single HDMI port does support eARC, but that means all HDMI sources would need to connect to the TV and use eARC to feed audio the Arcam, so think about what you want to connect to your amp / receiver.

There are lots of good options for speakers these days. The 1723 THX Tower (as well as the Monitors) are good speakers, but have you done any comparisons yet? If you like the idea of having free return shipping, the Arendals and SVS can be a good option. If you like a truly neutral sounding speaker with wide dispersion, Philharmonic Audio (well regarded on these forums) has the HT Tower and their BMR Tower. The JBL HDI-3600 is an absolute steal at half price on Crutchfield and I've audtioned those myself, or there is the bigger HDI-3800 which ShadyJ reviewed here. Focal Aria Evo X No.2 is in that price range and looks great in that moss green. Revel F228Be might be too expensive but the F226Be is on sale currently. KEF R7 Meta might be another contender. In that price range, do your homework and if possible get out and listen to those brands if you can. Each will have its own character so personal preference comes into play.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I'm looking to move outside my HT for a HiFi 2 or 2.1 channel set-up for music, but will also need to have HDMI for TV use. It will be in an open floorplan living room that opens up to the kitchen, eat-in and sunroom (Mungo Homes The Webster to be exact). The house should be built by June, so planning ahead! I was thinking about the Arcam SA35 when it comes out and maybe Arendal 1723 THX Towers. Would that be a solid jump off point or are there other combos I should look into.

What's your train of thought on those components?

Why Arcam and Arendal, not other brands?

Why streaming integrated amp, not an AVR?

Subwoofer or no subwoofer?

For my 23' x 24' living room open to everything in my 5500 SF house, I just have a pair of full-range towers and one AVR.

 

[TLS Guy]

Do you have any finished pics of the network area?

Yes, I do.

Here is the 19" patch bay, and one of the 19" hubs.

19" hub in AV rack.

This is the front side of the third AV analog rack.

The modem is below that speaker and the mesh router above it and just to the side of it above the turntable case.

From left to right, the AV rack, then the digital audio rack plus a Revox A700 tape machine, then the digital audio editing station. At the end if the turntable case and preamps, with two Revox A77s and Dolby B encoder/decoder and dbx 1 & 2 encoder decoders.

In the bottom of each rack is an uninterruptible power supply which keeps constant voltage and can power from battery for 20 min and then give a soft shut down. There is also a 20 KVA auto start generator so shut down should not happen. There is a surge protector at entry and one in each panel and at the solar combiner. This is NEC code, and you need to make sure this is done properly. As the climate warms and gets more violent, all members should bring their home up to current national NEC. I have spoken to electricians who have been to homes having total wipeout of everything that contains ICs. that is darn near everything electrical in the home, including light bulbs now. Make sure this is done properly.

Great rooms in general present problems installing AV, due to lack of wall space. I did not intend a system for our great room, but my wife insisted, and ordered it take no floor space! In our last home there was absolutely nowhere to put and AV system in the great room. In this one I created the only possible space. It is a large space so it needs significant power to fill it.

This gives you an idea of the challenge great rooms can create for AV.

So that space takes up the lions share of the main level.

This picture of the system in our family room may give you some ideas.

It is a challenge to accommodate AV without dominating the space. Making it seem a natural part of the space is not easy, but worth the effort.
If it is a dedicated space like and an AV room, then it is much easier, as you are entirely dealing with form and function.

I'm sorry I have been slow to reply, but at Christmas time there are other priorities.

Lastly remember this is your home and you have a right to have it the way you want. The builder will do what he wants unless you keep tight control of him. You need to be assertive and remind the builder it is your home and you have the purse strings. I should make special mention of lighting. This is an area I can guarantee the builder will short change you given half a chance. Their modus operandi is to put in wholly inadequate lighting and a bunch of switched outlets for you to sprinkle casual lamps all over the place. Don't let them get away with that. Good well planned lighting is crucial to a comfortable home.

A good plan of your great room would be very helpful to give you specific and useful advice.

 

[lawatson123]

Yes, I do.

Here is the 19" patch bay, and one of the 19" hubs.

19" hub in AV rack.

This is the front side of the third AV analog rack.

The modem is below that speaker and the mesh router above it and just to the side of it above the turntable case.

From left to right, the AV rack, then the digital audio rack plus a Revox A700 tape machine, then the digital audio editing station. At the end if the turntable case and preamps, with two Revox A77s and Dolby B encoder/decoder and dbx 1 & 2 encoder decoders.

In the bottom of each rack is an uninterruptible power supply which keeps constant voltage and can power from battery for 20 min and then give a soft shut down. There is also a 20 KVA auto start generator so shut down should not happen. There is a surge protector at entry and one in each panel and at the solar combiner. This is NEC code, and you need to make sure this is done properly. As the climate warms and gets more violent, all members should bring their home up to current national NEC. I have spoken to electricians who have been to homes having total wipeout of everything that contains ICs. that is darn near everything electrical in the home, including light bulbs now. Make sure this is done properly.

Great rooms in general present problems installing AV, due to lack of wall space. I did not intend a system for our great room, but my wife insisted, and ordered it take no floor space! In our last home there was absolutely nowhere to put and AV system in the great room. In this one I created the only possible space. It is a large space so it needs significant power to fill it.

This gives you an idea of the challenge great rooms can create for AV.

So that space takes up the lions share of the main level.

This picture of the system in our family room may give you some ideas.

It is a challenge to accommodate AV without dominating the space. Making it seem a natural part of the space is not easy, but worth the effort.
If it is a dedicated space like and an AV room, then it is much easier, as you are entirely dealing with form and function.

I'm sorry I have been slow to reply, but at Christmas time there are other priorities.

Lastly remember this is your home and you have a right to have it the way you want. The builder will do what he wants unless you keep tight control of him. You need to be assertive and remind the builder it is your home and you have the purse strings. I should make special mention of lighting. This is an area I can guarantee the builder will short change you given half a chance. Their modus operandi is to put in wholly inadequate lighting and a bunch of switched outlets for you to sprinkle casual lamps all over the place. Don't let them get away with that. Good well planned lighting is crucial to a comfortable home.

A good plan of your great room would be very helpful to give you specific and useful advice.

Awesome! Thank you so much for sharing!

 

[lawatson123]

To get back to your original question, electronics depend on the features you need. The Arcam SA35 seems to check a lot of boxes as features go but would not have enough inputs for my needs. The single HDMI port does support eARC, but that means all HDMI sources would need to connect to the TV and use eARC to feed audio the Arcam, so think about what you want to connect to your amp / receiver.

There are lots of good options for speakers these days. The 1723 THX Tower (as well as the Monitors) are good speakers, but have you done any comparisons yet? If you like the idea of having free return shipping, the Arendals and SVS can be a good option. If you like a truly neutral sounding speaker with wide dispersion, Philharmonic Audio (well regarded on these forums) has the HT Tower and their BMR Tower. The JBL HDI-3600 is an absolute steal at half price on Crutchfield and I've audtioned those myself, or there is the bigger HDI-3800 which ShadyJ reviewed here. Focal Aria Evo X No.2 is in that price range and looks great in that moss green. Revel F228Be might be too expensive but the F226Be is on sale currently. KEF R7 Meta might be another contender. In that price range, do your homework and if possible get out and listen to those brands if you can. Each will have its own character so personal preference comes into play.

Thank you so much for the other suggestions. I live in Greenville, SC and I am unaware of any local showrooms. I am looking to go check out Audio advice in Charlotte. I really want to hear more systems. I honestly do not know what my preferences are regarding even warm, neutral or bright, preference of a wider sound stage or better imaging, etc. I just don't have enough experience hearing other systems than my own. I agree more experience would be great, just not easy and going to have to start somewhere! For now just keep reading a bunch of reviews and watching a lot of YouTube!

Thanks again for the info!

 

[shadyJ]

Thank you so much for the other suggestions. I live in Greenville, SC and I am unaware of any local showrooms. I am looking to go check out Audio advice in Charlotte. I really want to hear more systems. I honestly do not know what my preferences are regarding even warm, neutral or bright, preference of a wider sound stage or better imaging, etc. I just don't have enough experience hearing other systems than my own. I agree more experience would be great, just not easy and going to have to start somewhere! For now just keep reading a bunch of reviews and watching a lot of YouTube!

Thanks again for the info!

Neutral speakers are a good starting point, because they can easily be equalized to suite your preference. Non-neutral speakers may need more equalization to get your desired tonality.

 

[lawatson123]

What's your train of thought on those components?

Why Arcam and Arendal, not other brands?

Why streaming integrated amp, not an AVR?

Subwoofer or no subwoofer?

For my 23' x 24' living room open to everything in my 5500 SF house, I just have a pair of full-range towers and one AVR.

I was thinking the SA35 would be a good start since it seems like it will have good enough power to drive most speakers, but also be able to serve as a preamp of I decide to start moving towards separates. Just plan on getting there a little step wise. What had to have HDMI and I like the option of sub outs. So I guess upgradability with out obsolescence in my system. I am also really tempted by the Yamaha R-N2000A in silver. It looks super sexy.

I am not dead set on those two brands by any means. I'm just trying to get a feel for my understanding on pairing and if that would potentially work. I am actually now leaning hard towards Martin Logan Motion XT F200s. I really like Andrew Robinson's channel and would be lying if I said his review wasn't swaying me a lot! I will hopefully be able to make a trip to Audio advice to demo some stuff, but just haven't had opportunities to hear really any systems other than my own HT setup. I unfortunately will have to eventually pick a single set-up to start. Believe me, I wish I could start with A/B-ing different components in my home!

I am interested in streaming integrated as a stepping stone towards separates, but without having to rebuy, just hopefully able to add to as I figure out my path. As for receivers, I have and will still have a media room for HT. I have a 5.1.4 (will be a 7.1.4) with Klipsch RP speakers, 2x SVS PB3000 subs, and Denon x4800H receiver. I'm happy with that set up and an wanting to more focus on sound treatment to see how much more I can eek out of that system before upgrading anything there. I am looking to add a 2 channel system in the living room, mostly for music, but would also be for that TV. Short answer: want to hear how non-receivers compare.

I am not opposed to subs at all! Just trying not to push my luck regarding the Wife-approval-factor in our family room. I'm trying to sneak in a little bit of sound treatment . I would like to play with more full range speakers to start to further learn my preferences for 2 channel listening. I also spend enough time tinkering with sub/speaker integration in the HT with Dirac and REW. The idea of simplifying with only 2 speakers is appealing due to the fewer variables. I would consider sub/subs if I felt I was lacking in the bottom end (and get approval from the boss!).

So many things to consider! I appreciate the questions for the thought exercise!

What full range towers are you rocking?

 

[lawatson123]

Neutral speakers are a good starting point, because they can easily be equalized to suite your preference. Non-neutral speakers may need more equalization to get your desired tonality.

I agree entirely! Just relying on being told what is actually neutral to establish a baseline. I understand what most of the terminology means and I think I know what it would sound like, but have never been able to A/B to really know. Hell! I don't even know if I really even have a discerning enough ear for this all to matter! I love the idea of just being happy if I like it, but I am honest with myself and realize I will continue to wonder if there is something out there I would like the sound of even more. I just need a place that has a ton of blind A/B comparisons such as bright vs warm vs neutral sounding speakers, box vs open baffle, traditional vs. electrostatics, a non treated room vs over treated and dead vs. ideal absorption/refraction, long rt-60 vs low rt-60, etc! I'm envious of those who just get a system and are love the way it sounds! Ignorance IS bliss.

 

[Eppie]

Visiting Audio Advice is a good idea as they should have a good selection. Sounds like you have a healthy budget to work with so take your time. Speakers tend to be a long term investment.

 

[MrBoat]

What is the size of your audience? In my immediate family, I am the only one who really cares about hi-fi. As such, I am able to focus more on a small sweet spot, or multiples of them, instead of trying to treat a large space full of compromises for an otherwise, non-existent audience. Everyone else is generally ok with what ambient music is left for them because even that sounds better than what they care about or are used to.

I'd rather have a killer sounding near field 2.1 arrangement to get my fix, than a large 'ok' one full of compromises. With that said, perhaps a 2.1 desktop or studio type arrangement in another room for serious listening, and an average system in what will surely amount to an expensive, difficult to treat space.

 

[TLS Guy]

I agree entirely! Just relying on being told what is actually neutral to establish a baseline. I understand what most of the terminology means and I think I know what it would sound like, but have never been able to A/B to really know. Hell! I don't even know if I really even have a discerning enough ear for this all to matter! I love the idea of just being happy if I like it, but I am honest with myself and realize I will continue to wonder if there is something out there I would like the sound of even more. I just need a place that has a ton of blind A/B comparisons such as bright vs warm vs neutral sounding speakers, box vs open baffle, traditional vs. electrostatics, a non treated room vs over treated and dead vs. ideal absorption/refraction, long rt-60 vs low rt-60, etc! I'm envious of those who just get a system and are love the way it sounds! Ignorance IS bliss.

I think if you just buy a system without putting a lot of thought into it, it is akin to buying a lottery ticket.

It really would be helpful to know the dimensions of that space. I assume you must have a plan from the builder. Also it would be very helpful to know how you intend to use this system and with what program.

At this time I'm assuming that you want it to play TV and movies and probably music program of your choice.

You are correct that you don't need a sub right away if you have capable speakers. My speakers in that family room system give a perfectly acceptable performance without the subs. The biggest issue is that most speakers will not give a satisfactory performance for TV when you move off center. It takes really good speakers to keep a central image when you are off center. Those speakers in my family room can keep a central image off center, but for most speakers that is not the case. The reason those speakers can is because they use one of the best mid range domes ever made, that easily handle the whole speech discrimination band from 400 Hz to 4 KHz. Generally there is a crossover in the speech discrimination band with the associated phase/timing issues which prevents the ability to present a stable speech location, hence the requirement for a center channel if you use the system for TV and movies.

I really can't be more helpful until I know how you want to use this system. I will say you don't have to place speakers all over the place to have a good system. Two good speakers are at least 90% of the loaf. In any event great rooms are seldom suitable spaces for surround audio and Atmos. So it seems to me you are going about this the right way.