Listened to B&W 805S speakers today

[gus6464]

What CD did you use for the demo's?

cheers

We used the new Queens of the Stone Age (Era Vulgaris) cd for vocal testing, Nine Inch Nails (Year Zero) cd for bass/low freq testing, Coldplay (X&Y) for mids, and Muse (Black Holes and Revelations/Absolution) for high freq testing.

Most of the speakers failed our vocal test off the bat but some (PSB M2, B&W 805S, Dali Mentor 2) sounded exactly the same. Then in low freq test the PSB just had too much bass. In mid testing B&W and Dali were the same but on highs testing the Dali's excelled over the B&W's. And even thought we were looking for "neutrality" the Dali's didn't make any of the songs boring, but actually exciting because of the new things we were hearing on the recordings.

I really recommend the PSB M2's though since they only failed our low freq test. We were heavily leaning on those until we heard Nine Inch Nails. And the bass wasn't really all that overpowering, but it just wasn't our cup of tea. And the mids and highs were still very clear over the bass.

 

[mazersteven]

Try auditioning with this.

The Best of Sade

No Ordinary Love

Never As Good As The First Time

 

[gus6464]

Try auditioning with this.

The Best of Sade

No Ordinary Love

We were going to use what is on most review lists but we realized what would be the point of we would never listen to that type of music. Unless that Sade cd could pick up something on the speaker which would help us with other music that we listen to.

 

[mike c]

You ask about 4 and 6 ohm loads and yet you claim you heard a difference on nominal 8 ohm speakers which shouldn't be difficult to drive at all. What is the point if you are using your 8ohm speaker/amp difference as an example to prove your argument?

apparently you have nothing to back up your parrot claims. try wikipedia.

I mentioned an 8 ohms highly sensitive full tower because it was an easier load than ANY 4 or 6 ohm load, and yet the "receivers" DO NOT sound the same with the full towers.

No, I'm not at all saying that they handle all loads the same but I am saying that when they are operating within their normal operating range any differences will (in all probability) be below the threshold of audibility.

but you just said all mid level receivers sound the same. and I specifically mentioned the instances where I heard the differences. 6 ohms OR 8 ohm full towers run full range.

And, for what it's worth, as you are the one claiming differences in sound do exist the onus of proof is on you.

so you don't have any? I wasn't the first one who made the claims in this thread.

I'm actually surprised that an audioholics member with as many posts as you is maintaining such a position when there are countless threads with many links and many articles that support my position as opposed to yours which is the usual anecdotal, "I heard it so it's there." ~shurg~

it's not "suprising" you are always surprised. try to remove the horse blinders every once in awhile.

because unlike you, I try things for myself and form my own conclusions.

"ooh, I read it on the internet, therefore it's true"

 

[mike c]

sorry for the thread hijack

I do not have to have the last say in things ...

you can reply, and I will not.

I'm just tired of reading "I'm right, you're wrong" posts from people who simply have no tolerance for viewpoints that are different than their own.

 

[pt95124]

I dont know if it was because of the McIntosh receiver that was powering them or what but my wife and I were completely amazed. We brought one of her cds to test it out and she was excited. She said she could listen to the different layers of the song that she had never heard before (she has a way better ear then me when it comes to music). But long story short she wants them even though they cost as much as our entire budget. We also listened to some Paradigm Studio Reference 100 towers with the same cd we used to test the 805S' and it just wasnt the same. The 100s were powered by a Pioneer Elite receiver.

My question is did the receiver make the difference with the B&W's or are they just that good? But now my wife wants B&W 800 series speakers and wants to buy the set in parts. Get the 805S' now and buy the center and rears after a couple of months in parts. So now I dont know what to do, are the B&W 800s worth the price and what receiver should I get to power the things?

Definitely! I had the same experience. First I listened to 802D through Mac, then Triangle Antal ESW ($2k), different dealers but same Mac, I heard the same sound.
I am not saying a $2K speaker is as good as $12k but the difference is not worth $10k and the sound is definitely the Mac sound.

 

[Warpdrv]

Definitely! I had the same experience. First I listened to 802D through Mac, then Triangle Antal ESW ($2k), different dealers but same Mac, I heard the same sound.
I am not saying a $2K speaker is as good as $12k but the difference is not worth $10k and the sound is definitely the Mac sound.

Oh boy.... That is quite the opening statement with your first post...

Both speakers sounded the same because of a Macintosh Amp...

Might want to have your ears checked....

 

[Joe Schmoe]

Oh boy.... That is quite the opening statement with your first post...

Both speakers sounded the same because of a Macintosh Amp...

Might want to have your ears checked....

I agree. Amps may have some very slight impact on the overall sound (though I am not convinced that they do), but this is utterly trivial compared the differences between speakers. Speakers+room account for at least 95% of the way any system sounds (my guess is closer to 99%.)

 

[avaserfi]

The way I see it the main time an amp will contribute to speaker sound is when it doesn't have enough juice to properly power the speakers and things like clipping occur. Maybe Gene could write some article teaching everyone (with really long equations ofcourse) how amps do not affect sound and why?

 

[mazersteven]

Definitely! I had the same experience. First I listened to 802D through Mac, then Triangle Antal ESW ($2k), different dealers but same Mac, I heard the same sound.
I am not saying a $2K speaker is as good as $12k but the difference is not worth $10k and the sound is definitely the Mac sound.

LOL

 

[Adam]

Oh boy.... That is quite the opening statement with your first post...

Both speakers sounded the same because of a Macintosh Amp...

Might want to have your ears checked....

Oh, be nice, Warp. I figure if he/she can't tell the difference between $2k speakers and $12k speakers, and likes the Mac, good for him/her! The end result, whether it's because of the speakers or the amp or the room or (just kidding here) the power cord, is all personal perception and preference. At least the person went and listened and didn't buy something because of internet hype...like I'm doing with an SVS sub.

 

[Adam]

The way I see it the main time an amp will contribute to speaker sound is when it doesn't have enough juice to properly power the speakers and things like clipping occur. Maybe Gene could write some article teaching everyone (with really long equations ofcourse) how amps do not affect sound and why?

I think that I need to be schooled, and a good article would be a nice start. I know that I've read at least one article explaining the fundamentals behind different types of amplification, and I ended up with the belief that, at the very least, tube amps and solid state amps can definitely sound different because of the (it's been a while so I'm going to try to get this term correct) rise time associated with the electronics in the amp. Is my understanding just way off base?

 

[avaserfi]

I think that I need to be schooled, and a good article would be a nice start. I know that I've read at least one article explaining the fundamentals behind different types of amplification, and I ended up with the belief that, at the very least, tube amps and solid state amps can definitely sound different because of the (it's been a while so I'm going to try to get this term correct) rise time associated with the electronics in the amp. Is my understanding just way off base?

I was asking for the article for personal reasons as well. I don't really know anything about tube amps as they are way before my time but the few article I have read just allude to the fact that power it power and as long as you have at least enough you are golden. Another reason I mentioned the article is it seems there has been a bit of bickering over this subject as of late and we could get the resident expert to get everyone to shut up and say Read this *****!

 

[Adam]

I did a quick search on Google, and the first page that popped up looked familiar. Maybe it's the one that I read before (I'll be reading it later today).

http://sound.westhost.com/amp-basics.htm

 

[no. 5]

I did a quick search on Google, and the first page that popped up looked familiar. Maybe it's the one that I read before (I'll be reading it later today).

http://sound.westhost.com/amp-basics.htm

I've always found Rod Elliott's articles to be informative, here is one on amplifier 'sound' too.

 

[AdrianMills]

I do not have to have the last say in things ...

you can reply, and I will not.

I'm just tired of reading "I'm right, you're wrong" posts from people who simply have no tolerance for viewpoints that are different than their own.

There's a host of material out there to be read about the audible differences of amps, on psychoacoustics and why sighted listening tests are not ideal for finding differences.

Receivers can of course sound different to power amplifiers if there's some processing going on in the receiver - but then that wouldn't be a valid comparison now would it...

I'll leave it there now as I've seen too many of these discussions degenerate into incoherent shouting matches and I'm just too jaded by the "I hear it so it must be so" audiophile mentality to be bothered with all of that. So to quote Tom Andry, "Dude, whatever."

 

[gus6464]

My wife and I returned to the store to give the Dali Mentor 2's and PSB Platinum M2's one more listen before we take the plunge and something interesting happened. We listened to the four cd's again one more time to hear the differences in the highs, mids, lows, and vocals. We took another Nine inch nails cd that has some songs where the bass is supposed to hit super hard and the M2's were just exploding whereas the Mentor's still had the same bass output no matter what. So its when we realized that what if the M2's actually do a better job of producing the sound that you are supposed to be hearing.

So after this we decided to do the blind test and I blindfolded by wife and kept switching back and forth between the speakers and she kept picking the PSB M2's over the Dali's. So now we are even more confused as the saga continues.

 

[Tomorrow]

Gus...you simply are cheating yourself if you do NOT audition the Aerials.