Israel's influence on US foreign policies

[3db]

I want to state that while a military response in no way, morally, ethically, legally, has to proportionate. Israel, IMO, passed the point of morals on it's response.

I want to point out that Palestinians got what they voted for. Period. HAMAS was elected, and part of their appeal is that the Islamic Brotherhood wasn't violent enough.

As a matter of fact after the 2008 elections, HAMAS rounded up their I.B. competition and tied ropes around their necks, the other end to a truck bumper. I'll let you figure out the rest.

I'm not sure how you deal with that death culture mindset if you are Israel.

We agree on the Israeli response being over the top.
Palestine didn’t vote for Hamas as the West likes to depict. I firmly believe that Netanyahu made a deal with the devil ( Hamas) to prevent a legitimate Palestinian government (PLA) and two state solution from forming.

 

[jinjuku]

There has been no documented proof of this whatsoever. Just idle speculation and gossip as usual. The same BS that claimed weapons of mass destruction held by Iraq.

Have you watched the video? I'm thinking not by the response of the sound of crickets I'm hearing here.
Sad, really sad.

What are you talking about? Can you provide actual sources?

Fact Sheet: The Iran Deal, Then and Now - Center for Arms Control and Non-Proliferation

Updated June 2025 What is the Iran Deal or “Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action” (JCPOA)? On July 14, 2015, the United States and its international negotiating partners reached an agreement with Iran on its nuclear program: the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action (JCPOA) or the Iran nuclear deal...

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What You Need to Know About the Iran Nuclear Deal

Get up to speed with the recent Iran nuclear deal news here.

www.icanw.org

Iran Newly Breaches Nuclear Deal | Arms Control Association

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[jinjuku]

We agree on the Israeli response being over the top.
Palestine didn’t vote for Hamas as the West likes to depict. I firmly believe that Netanyahu made a deal with the devil ( Hamas) to prevent a legitimate Palestinian government (PLA) and two state solution from forming.

The PLO was already in it's death spiral. Arafat couldn't maintain an impossible balance because that balance ultimately had the stipulation that Palestinian Arabs and the political apparatus had to acknowledge Israels right to simply exist. He was in, and by extenstion, the PLO, and impossible bind.

Israel isn't of entirely clean hands, but since things have been historically messy, I think it's impossible and all you will have is an array of schitty choices.

 

[jinjuku]

Too bad Israel wasn't put somewhere else...or that all this religious nonsense still means anything.

It's more tribal. Just read the 'Seven Pillars of Wisdom' for some insight.

 

[GO-NAD!]

My point is that there never was a Palestinian people or nation, they were simply a nomadic tribe who identified simply as Muslim Arabs. They’ve been driven out of virtually every Muslim country. They reside in because everywhere they go. They start crap with that nation and eventually get kicked out. The Muslim world hates them and only wants them in Israel’s territory because they hate Israel as well. The idea of a two state solution sounds good on paper, but it’s just never gonna work out. The Palestinian official position is that Israel will never exist as a country and they will never recognize it.

Well, they identify themselves as Palestinians. Who are we to say otherwise? Despite the American declaration of independence , there were no actual Americans until the 1783 Treaty of Paris.

There are 2 million Palestinians still in Jordan, a half million in Lebanon and another half million in Syria. And ironically, there are 2 million in Israel itself.

You talk about them as if they share a single opinion. The PA/PLO recognize the State of Israel (although not its Jewish Character). It's Hamas that has not recognized and has vowed to destroy Israel. There is no single Palestinian position, either official, or public opinion.

 

[3db]

The PLO was already in it's death spiral. Arafat couldn't maintain an impossible balance because that balance ultimately had the stipulation that Palestinian Arabs and the political apparatus had to acknowledge Israels right to simply exist. He was in, and by extenstion, the PLO, and impossible bind.

Israel isn't of entirely clean hands, but since things have been historically messy, I think it's impossible and all you will have is an array of schitty choices.

Really? Is that why Yasair Arafat signed the Oslo accords? Isn’t part of that accord that each state recognizes the other?

I agree with the mess sentiment for sure from both sides. However, the stigma and Western slant that Arabs and Palestinian peoples are inherently evil still very much persists today judging by some of the posts I have read on this post. The flagrant dispelling of truths by Israeli controlled US media doesn’t help.

 

[3db]

What are you talking about? Can you provide actual sources?

Fact Sheet: The Iran Deal, Then and Now - Center for Arms Control and Non-Proliferation

Updated June 2025 What is the Iran Deal or “Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action” (JCPOA)? On July 14, 2015, the United States and its international negotiating partners reached an agreement with Iran on its nuclear program: the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action (JCPOA) or the Iran nuclear deal...

armscontrolcenter.org

What You Need to Know About the Iran Nuclear Deal

Get up to speed with the recent Iran nuclear deal news here.

www.icanw.org

Iran Newly Breaches Nuclear Deal | Arms Control Association

www.armscontrol.org

You have a point there. I forgot about the aspect of them resuming their program.

I would like to point out that Iran complied with JCPOA and had no enriched nuclear material before that point to make weapons before the treaty. Its fact that the Islamic religion forbids to target civilians and the assassinated supreme leader was prohibiting their development. Furthermore and in typical short sightedness of present and past US administrations, the US walked away from this despite Iran working with the JCPOA. Seeing Israel as a threat to their sovereignty, they began to enrich their nuclear weapons since the US walked away and broke the deal.

The attack of the US and Israel on Iran has now hardened Iran's resolve to have nuclear deterrents where as before the war and the US departure out of the JCPOA, they were complying with the JCPOA.

I'm inclined to think that Israel would be the first country to toss nuclear weapons at Iran if backed into a corner, not the other way around based on their Iran's behaviour in this war of strictly hitting military targets. Iran in this war has proven itself to be very disciplined in its retaliation responses unlike the Israelis who go after civilians and military opposition.