Is the world coming to an end?

[Halon451]

It'll help many of us get through the summer with $4+ a gallon gas prices.

If my wife and I receive the full $1200 proposed (no kids yet), this means she will be able to fill up her tank 10 times, and I will be able to fill up mine 7 times. I did the math already. I average about a tank per week (SUV, lot of driving around town), hers is a little four-banger that gets decent mileage, but she drives around town more than I do, so we fill up at about the same rate. Would it help? Well, anything does, but it would be a temporary fix either way. Gas prices have risen and fallen, but historically when they fall again, they never go back to their pre-spike levels, so averaged out over the course of a couple of years of so and it represents a marked increase that is outpacing current inflation rates with wild, reckless abandon.

Point being, stimulus package or no stimulus package - the levee is sure to break eventually, as something has to give. This mere "tax rebate" is like a couple grains of sugar when you need the entire bowl of frosting to cover the cake.

 

[haraldo]

If my wife and I receive the full $1200 proposed (no kids yet), this means she will be able to fill up her tank 10 times, and I will be able to fill up mine 7 times. I did the math already. I average about a tank per week (SUV, lot of driving around town), hers is a little four-banger that gets decent mileage, but she drives around town more than I do, so we fill up at about the same rate. Would it help? Well, anything does, but it would be a temporary fix either way. Gas prices have risen and fallen, but historically when they fall again, they never go back to their pre-spike levels, so averaged out over the course of a couple of years of so and it represents a marked increase that is outpacing current inflation rates with wild, reckless abandon.

Point being, stimulus package or no stimulus package - the levee is sure to break eventually, as something has to give. This mere "tax rebate" is like a couple grains of sugar when you need the entire bowl of frosting to cover the cake.

Now I'm getting really scared here Halon if your wife filling up the thank is what makes you happy

 

[haraldo]

Not only the world is coming to an end but also the galaxy too
It is on a collision course with another giant galaxy

Read about that too, you now even if two galaxy's collide there's like one in a 100.000.000.000.000.000 possibility for the sun to collide with another star in 100.000.000.000 years

And the collision won't happen really in 5.000.000.000 years....

Guess there are greater issues at hand

 

[Halon451]

Read about that too, you now even if two galaxy's collide there's like one in a 100.000.000.000.000.000 possibility for the sun to collide with another star in 100.000.000.000 years

And the collision won't happen really in 5.000.000.000 years....

Guess there are greater issues at hand

No doubt - I get sucked into those shows on History Channel and Nat Geo all the time; if one were to take everything they present to heart, he/she would likely be cowering under a table waiting for the sky to fall any minute. Interesting stuff though, nonetheless, I just try to not take it all so seriously. I love learning about the universe and all the spectacular things that happen out there like colliding galaxies, black holes, etc. I read somewhere that our own Milky Way is actually currently "absorbing" a neighboring mini-galaxy. As you pointed out though Haraldo, the probability of suns, planets and the like colliding during the process is very small indeed, due to the vast distances between them (hundreds and thousands of light years).

Everyone can breathe a sigh of relief...

 

[haraldo]

No doubt - I get sucked into those shows on History Channel and Nat Geo all the time; if one were to take everything they present to heart, he/she would likely be cowering under a table waiting for the sky to fall any minute. Interesting stuff though, nonetheless, I just try to not take it all so seriously. I love learning about the universe and all the spectacular things that happen out there like colliding galaxies, black holes, etc. I read somewhere that our own Milky Way is actually currently "absorbing" a neighboring mini-galaxy. As you pointed out though Haraldo, the probability of suns, planets and the like colliding during the process is very small indeed, due to the vast distances between them (hundreds and thousands of light years).

Everyone can breathe a sigh of relief...

If you worry about everything that may happen out there, you will just be scared and not be able to do anything.....

Like every 500 Million Years there's a star exploding into a super-hypernova, energy release from one single star may be up to 1000 times the rest of the energy release of the whole galaxy, and it happens in like 5 minutes.... such an explosion may wipe out life in a whole galaxy, but you cannot really think about such things in the daily life

Excuse me if the numbers are wrong, but this is how I remember it.....

 

[stratman]

Well the sooner we get into alternative energy cars, the better. I've seen an upsurge of Priuses and Camry hybrids of late. Man I REALLY HATE OPEC!

I'm not counting on Detroit to lead the pack.

Do you think there's a psychological break-point for gas prices, when the average joe will, I'm sorry I can't anymore?

 

[Shadow_Ferret]

I'd have had a hybrid or electric a looooong time ago if they were affordable.

And since they are mostly new, there aren't any affordable used ones on the lots yet.

 

[haraldo]

Well the sooner we get into alternative energy cars, the better. I've seen an upsurge of Priuses and Camry hybrids of late. Man I REALLY HATE OPEC!

I'm not counting on Detroit to lead the pack.

Do you think there's a psychological break-point for gas prices, when the average joe will, I'm sorry I can't anymore?

Actually, in some areas of alternative energy.... US is leading the pack and the rest of the world is lagging behind.....

From what I have heard they sell more Toyota Prius Hybrids in LA than in the rest of the world
I don't really think it's about gas prices, economy, whatever..... If you've got cars with less emission, the air in which you breathe will be better for you.....

 

[haraldo]

I'd have had a hybrid or electric a looooong time ago if they were affordable.

And since they are mostly new, there aren't any affordable used ones on the lots yet.

GOOOOOD!

I would too, and Actually I believe there are lots of people that think like you, but still.... No matter how you put it an electric car will not even be close to affordable...
I know because i live in a country where there's
- No tax whatsoever on Electric cars
- Something like 150 - 350% tax on regular cars, depending on motor size (not a typo)
- The lowest el prices in the world

Still, the electric cars are not competitively priced, still too expensive, and still too expensive with a $200/month maintenance fee on the batteries.

The producers of el cars go bankrupt all the time, and there's a reason to it.....

 

[stratman]

I don't really think it's about gas prices, economy, whatever..... If you've got cars with less emission, the air in which you breathe will be better for you.....

This might be the reasoning in Hollywood, but not down here. Here it's the gas prices, Miami has one of the best air quality index number in the US, due to our geographical location and prevailing winds. Hollywood actors try to assuage their overpaid consciousness by trying to be green.

 

[haraldo]

This might be the reasoning in Hollywood, but not down here. Here it's the gas prices, Miami has one of the best air quality index number in the US, due to our geographical location and prevailing winds. Hollywood actors try to assuage their overpaid consciousness by trying to be green.

Yeah of course!!! That makes sense
Hollywood has always been scr..... up anyways, all about image and looking good...

 

[Halon451]

Do you think there's a psychological break-point for gas prices, when the average joe will, I'm sorry I can't anymore?

I say that to myself already.... every time I'm at the pump filling up. Last time I got a laugh from the guy at the pump next to me when I turned and asked him, "Hey, where on this machine do you put in your arm and your leg?"

Fact of the matter is, I believe we've already hit the psychological break-point. There isn't a person who drives a standard gas-combustion engine car that I know who isn't outraged by the prices we're seeing. The question I have is when will we actually hit the literal break-point where it is no longer affordable by Average Joe and the entire nation grinds to a halt. Nobody can get to work, truckers cannot afford to deliver goods and freight (already being seen as previously mentioned), as more and more businesses (smaller to larger) end up closing their doors.

But hey, at least the current members of OPEC will have all the money they need to build their god d**med Palm Islands, gold palaces and indoor ski slopes...

 

[haraldo]

I'm not sure there's a pshycological price point. We thought we were in Norway, but since that, the gas price is increased to something like $9.50/gallon. This impacts everybody and businesses close up as result of this, but most of all we have to learn to live using a lot less gas, because we have to, or we will have to sell our house and car.

Many places in Europe prices are even higher.... Wonder why there are so many small cars in France and Italy?

I don't think there's this magical point, you just do what you have to in order to survive in this world.....

 

[stratman]

I'm not sure there's a pshycological price point. We thought we were in Norway, but since that, the gas price is increased to something like $9.50/gallon. This impacts everybody and businesses close up as result of this, but most of all we have to learn to live using a lot less gas, because we have to, or we will have to sell our house and car.

Many places in Europe prices are even higher.... Wonder why there are so many small cars in France and Italy?

I don't think there's this magical point, you just do what you have to in order to survive in this world.....

Haraldo,

The situation here in the states is very different, the US is a giant machine intertwined and interconnected, when one of those connections stops working, the frailty of the system quickly shows, economic survival depends on oil right now, this country will go through major upheavals if something isn't done today. You might have riots, starting with the truckers, delivery folk, then the general population will basically say, "I don't have gas to go to work," or like WW2 the government will step in, artificially control prices and give ration cards out. This is not far fetched. The stock market will melt, ironically those countries wishing for this to happen will be dragged into the worst economic meltdown the world has ever seen.

 

[haraldo]

Haraldo,

The situation here in the states is very different, the US is a giant machine intertwined and interconnected, when one of those connections stops working, the frailty of the system quickly shows, economic survival depends on oil right now, this country will go through major upheavals if something isn't done today. You might have riots, starting with the truckers, delivery folk, then the general population will basically say, "I don't have gas to go to work," or like WW2 the government will step in, artificially control prices and give ration cards out. This is not far fetched. The stock market will melt, ironically those countries wishing for this to happen will be dragged into the worst economic meltdown the world has ever seen.

I see your point and it definitely makes sense to me... And some of that economic meltdown is something we see and recognize all over the world, the US economy directly affects the global economy....

I have no problems recognizing that things are very different in the US as compared to EU. However, in the long run I probably believe that something will force itself through to make consumers and the major businesses less dependent on gas prices and OPEC.
That's certainly not easy and that's not going to be painless. I fear that oil prices may be stable at a high level.

What I can say when it comes to ourselves is that in Norway we're working our guts off to try to produce as much oil as possible and to discover and exploit new resources. The executives of the leading oil company "StatoilHydro" http://www.statoilhydro.com hoping for lower oil prices. They would make more gains from higher oil prices but targeting lower oil prices because that's healthy for the long term economy. The matter with OPEC is quite different, though.... Hey, we're NOT part of OPEC

This is actually important because this company is one of the largest exporters of crude oil.....

Our contribution is to produce as much oil as possible and that may be a small contribution to actually lower your guy's gas prices, really!

-Harald

 

[stratman]

You see we don't lack inventory, on the contrary gas demand has been going down in the last four months, there is an oil glut, we have more than what prices indicate, but a major problem is refining, we haven't built a refinery in this country in well over 20 years.

 

[haraldo]

You see we don't lack inventory, on the contrary gas demand has been going down in the last four months, there is an oil glut, we have more than what prices indicate, but a major problem is refining, we haven't built a refinery in this country in well over 20 years.

Believe me, there's a lot! of effort put in here and other places....
http://www.offshore-technology.com/projects/snohvit/snohvit6.html
Things will not happen overnight, but there are large projects targeted with the US market in mind.

If refinery capacity can keep up... I don't know but you need stable refinery capacity in civilized countries. Whether this is in US or Europe is not important, what's important is reliable provitions. That will lower the prices too....

 

[Audioholics]

At least the stimulus is not another tax cut for the rich.

Yes, heaven forbid your employer hires any more employees or gives you a raise... or puts another reviewer on staff...

Those evil "rich" people are everywhere...

 

[jeffsg4mac]

What really burns my bananna is how congress and the senate and even the W himself have this attitude that they are giving us all something extra; when THEY SHOULD HAVE NEVER TAKEN IT FROM US IN THE FIRST PLACE.

 

[Halon451]

What really burns my bananna is how congress and the senate and even the W himself have this attitude that they are giving us all something extra; when THEY SHOULD HAVE NEVER TAKEN IT FROM US IN THE FIRST PLACE.

I owed money to the IRS this year - I still haven't seen a check that was supposedly mailed "early", based on the last 2 digits of my SSN - Monday. Wouldn't it be crazy if the whole thing was just a big lie to temporarily appease us?