Is the PB12 worth the $$ over the PB10?

[silversurfer]

Mass differences too small? Do you know what T/S parameters are?

You are very much over simplifying the matter.

Like I posted before, you have NO transient response data. Also, there are different types of distortion, not just the measurements you show.

Transient response is the speed in which the cone can change direction in regards to the signal.

 

[Sheep]

Well, those links have FR, THD sum of all harmonics, THD by component, GD, and power compression.

If anything, TR will show up in GD no? Also, TR is related to the power of amp and size of magnet.

Your going to look me in the eye and say the DD18 doesn't have enough power or a large enough magnet to have decent TR?

At any rate, I smell another stand off. Shall we continue over PM's like last time?

SheepStar

 

[silversurfer]

The links are for the whole sub...not just the driver.

I will look you in the eye and say it is not a simple matter of the bigger driver being better in all aspects.

Stand off it is, which most often means it is not a clear cut situation, which is what I am trying to convey.

 

[j_garcia]

Sorry, jumping in here after the fact a bit, but I'd look you in the eye and say a 18" won't have the ability to perform as well as a 10" in the lower midrange. As you go up in cone size, the bottom gets better and the top gets worse (generic, not every case; depends on design). That's why I say a decent speaker that allows you to use a lower x-over is usually better. A speaker that can cover low enough to use at least a 80Hz x-over. When you step to a decent 12", a 60Hz x-over or lower might be better (and mains that can handle it as well), etc... The driver should be tailored to the range it is trying to produce, and as you widen the range the driver has to cover, the less capable it will be, IMO.

 

[zumbo]

Sorry, jumping in here after the fact a bit, but I'd look you in the eye and say a 18" won't have the ability to perform as well as a 10" in the lower midrange. As you go up in cone size, the bottom gets better and the top gets worse (generic, not every case; depends on design). That's why I say a decent speaker that allows you to use a lower x-over is usually better. A speaker that can cover low enough to use at least a 80Hz x-over. When you step to a decent 12", a 60Hz x-over or lower might be better (and mains that can handle it as well), etc... The driver should be tailored to the range it is trying to produce, and as you widen the range the driver has to cover, the less capable it will be, IMO.

And this is even more of the reason I would think the 10" would be better suited for the B&W's. Their low mid is weak. They are one of my favorite brands, however, they could use some help around 70Hz. I have a 12", and it certainly prefers to be crossed @ 60Hz.

 

[MacManNM]

Mass differences too small? Do you know what T/S parameters are?

You are very much over simplifying the matter.

Like I posted before, you have NO transient response data. Also, there are different types of distortion, not just the measurements you show.

Transient response is the speed in which the cone can change direction in regards to the signal.

Transient response is not dependent on cone size/mass only. It is a combination of motor strength, motor linearity, and electrical response. A 200 inch woofer can have the exact same transient response as a 10 inch unit. One can not make statements that a 10 is better than a 12, or vice versa. Creating pressure makes sound, no matter what size driver is used. The more pressure, the more sound. If a 10 and a 12 inch driver are moved the same amount and the same speed in free air, the the 12 will create more sound, due to the larger surface area. For the 10 to equal it, it must have a greater xmax. Usually, as you increase the xmax of a driver it looses linearity and creates higher distortion. Therefore for most cheaper sub designs when comparing a 10 to a 12, the 12 will have less distortion, and sound a bit better.

About a few of the previous posts:

All drivers have distortion, they are not just reproducing the distortion inherent to the electronics, they are creating it. All analog devices have distortion. Anytime you convert electrical energy to mechanical movement there are losses, heat is generated. This heat changes the electrical characteristics of the motor in a speaker, thus the TS paramaters change. Now the box the driver is in doesnt change.... see what I'm getting at here!