I voted this morning

Rickster71

Rickster71

Audioholic Spartan
An interesting read:

Before we declare the rise of white supremacy as the official story of the 2016 presidential campaign, it is a good idea to consider the possibility that there are actually other reasons that Trump has been the most unexpected political surprise of our lifetimes.

After all, politics can be... complicated.

Here are some other possible factors:

1. Funding His Campaign - One of Trump’s earliest and greatest applause lines in the campaign was that he was spending his own money and would therefore not be beholden to anyone. This seemed like a promising alternative to the perceived problem of politicians who seem always wholly owned by special interests. Why not try something different? Like many other aspects of his appeal, the merit here is superficial: do we really want politicians who are powerful but accountable to absolutely no one? That could create the worst of all worlds. As it turns out, however, Trump has in fact taken in $325 million in outside donations from many special interests, among which include real estate, general contractors, health care, securities, lawyers, and agriculture, and spent vast sums on renting his own facilities for campaign work – a nice gig if you can get it.

2. Americans Admire Wealth - There is a strange presumption on the American left that the average person despises wealthy people. Not so. Americans admire business success. This is well-documented and runs deep in our history. Crony capitalist or not, the least objectionable characteristic of Trump is his business acumen. His wealth is widely seen among regular people as a sign of his competence, not his self-evident evil. Better a businessperson than a professional politician with a legal background, people presume.

3. No Prescribed Political Narrative - Politics has long ago been taken over by consultants from previous campaigns, who seem to take over like the Borg anyone with a modicum of winning prospects. The consultants carefully script every press conference, speech, and debate answer. As a result, the typical pol can come across as robotic and brazenly manipulative. In this respect, Trump has been a welcome relief. He followed no one’s plan and has seemed to speak from the heart. His very presence on the debate stage had the effect of exposing and destroying the over-professionalization of modern political life. It’s fun to see settled systems of propaganda smashed, even if they are replaced by new ones (even worse ones).

4. Economic Stagnation - For nearly eight years now, we’ve been told how economic recovery is just around the corner. And yet growth rates are truly terrible, drifting around one and two percent in a time of rising population and explosive technological change. This is not the Great Depression much less Weimar, but perception is everything: among many classes of people, social progress in one generation no longer seems possible. That’s a gigantic cultural change and one destined to result in the kind of political panic that would-be strongmen can use to obtain power. That can involve scapegoating – and result in dangerous policies like protectionism and nativist demographic planning – but the root here is not racial but economic.

5. ObamaCare - Have you noticed that President Obama no longer brags about his health-care reform? That’s because it has been a disaster, the largest and fastest failure of any large-scale government program in history. Obamacare took a deeply flawed system of insurance and made it vastly worse – unsustainably worse. The vast gulf between the promise and the result has enraged multitudes. More than anyone else, Trump proved effective at exploiting this failure to his personal benefit, promising that only he, with a proven record of business success, could fix it.

6. Opposition Was and Is Awful - By comparison to Trump, his opponents in the primary seemed canned, overly scripted, and incompetent by comparison. Trump managed to get far more airtime than the others, if only because he was far more interesting, and he had a clean and relentless message. The others seemed to be tossing out bon mots to constituent groups and lacked courage of their convictions. And during the general election, it is hard to imagine a weaker opponent than Hillary Clinton: uncompelling, wedded to failed policies, personally embroiled in dozens of sketchy dealings, and a terrible record in public service to boot. Again, this has nothing to do with race; it’s all about his comparative advantage relative to those who are set against him in the contest.

7. Sick of the Media - The long pattern of establishment media culture is uniformly predictable: cheering the good-government Democrats over the reactionary Republicans. This has been going on since at least the New Deal and it’s tremendously annoying. In a time of democratized information flows, why do we need high priests telling people what to think and curating so carefully what is and isn’t news? We have algorithms for that now. Trump stood up against their hegemony using alternative means of communication. His fearless and relentless denunciations of the overly pious press has been a non-stop delight to free-thinking Americans.

8. Celebrity Culture - Many people long ago gave up their high expectation for politics and public affairs managed by the political class. What’s it been good for? What’s it done for us since, say, we landed a man on the moon? Given the shoddy record, so much of modern politics has collapsed into pure popular entertainment like sports, movies, and music. It is a cultural phenom and nothing more. Trump, more than anyone else, has mastered this art, treating politics as a variant of celebrity culture, and here he has vastly more experience than his competitors.

9. Growing Tamer - You could have made a case for the primacy of race in the earliest part of his campaign, but it is possible that his seeming dalliance with the alt-right was inadvertent (still inevitable). After all, once he had sewn up the primary, he quickly tacked left on all cultural matters. No Republican nominated for office has ever given such an overt plea for the rights of the LGBTQ community, and even his somewhat ham-handed appeal for black votes defies the narrative. Daily his campaign posts appeals using all the approved buzzwords: social justice, equality, fairness, and so on. It seems he was genuinely stung by the attempt to link him to the politics of hate and now bends the other direction in order to avoid the taint. In other words, he finds political benefit in seeming not to cater to white racialism, and this has actually helped him gain popularity.

10. Safety - In the last two years, global terrorism has taken a new direction, from hitting far-flung government targets to embedding itself in civilian life in major cities. And it seems to be getting worse with bombs randomly appearing in urban settings. The protests against police abuse in major cities contribute to a general feeling of insecurity. In contrast, Trump offers not only an explanation (bad policy) but a classic appeal to law, order, and safety, society managed by police authority. Tragically for those who love liberty, the appeal of that pitch never loses its strength to persuade.

When you consider all these points, abstracted entirely from the “white riot” theory, you have the makings of a surprisingly successful political campaign and candidate. You don't need a template of racial obsession to account for it.

The politics of revolt has been gaining steam since 2008, whether we are talking Tea Party, Occupy, Black Lives Matter, or the Trump movement. They all represent a roiling impatience with the status quo that goes beyond racial divisions. Trump, Clinton, and the status quo are equally unpopular, and that creates a combustable political environment. Fascism doesn’t necessarily need racism to be a winning strategy for political control.
 
majorloser

majorloser

Moderator
An interesting read:

Before we declare the rise of white supremacy as the official story of the 2016 presidential campaign, it is a good idea to consider the possibility that there are actually other reasons that Trump has been the most unexpected political surprise of our lifetimes.

After all, politics can be... complicated.

Here are some other possible factors:

1. Funding His Campaign - One of Trump’s earliest and greatest applause lines in the campaign was that he was spending his own money and would therefore not be beholden to anyone. This seemed like a promising alternative to the perceived problem of politicians who seem always wholly owned by special interests. Why not try something different? Like many other aspects of his appeal, the merit here is superficial: do we really want politicians who are powerful but accountable to absolutely no one? That could create the worst of all worlds. As it turns out, however, Trump has in fact taken in $325 million in outside donations from many special interests, among which include real estate, general contractors, health care, securities, lawyers, and agriculture, and spent vast sums on renting his own facilities for campaign work – a nice gig if you can get it.

2. Americans Admire Wealth - There is a strange presumption on the American left that the average person despises wealthy people. Not so. Americans admire business success. This is well-documented and runs deep in our history. Crony capitalist or not, the least objectionable characteristic of Trump is his business acumen. His wealth is widely seen among regular people as a sign of his competence, not his self-evident evil. Better a businessperson than a professional politician with a legal background, people presume.

3. No Prescribed Political Narrative - Politics has long ago been taken over by consultants from previous campaigns, who seem to take over like the Borg anyone with a modicum of winning prospects. The consultants carefully script every press conference, speech, and debate answer. As a result, the typical pol can come across as robotic and brazenly manipulative. In this respect, Trump has been a welcome relief. He followed no one’s plan and has seemed to speak from the heart. His very presence on the debate stage had the effect of exposing and destroying the over-professionalization of modern political life. It’s fun to see settled systems of propaganda smashed, even if they are replaced by new ones (even worse ones).

4. Economic Stagnation - For nearly eight years now, we’ve been told how economic recovery is just around the corner. And yet growth rates are truly terrible, drifting around one and two percent in a time of rising population and explosive technological change. This is not the Great Depression much less Weimar, but perception is everything: among many classes of people, social progress in one generation no longer seems possible. That’s a gigantic cultural change and one destined to result in the kind of political panic that would-be strongmen can use to obtain power. That can involve scapegoating – and result in dangerous policies like protectionism and nativist demographic planning – but the root here is not racial but economic.

5. ObamaCare - Have you noticed that President Obama no longer brags about his health-care reform? That’s because it has been a disaster, the largest and fastest failure of any large-scale government program in history. Obamacare took a deeply flawed system of insurance and made it vastly worse – unsustainably worse. The vast gulf between the promise and the result has enraged multitudes. More than anyone else, Trump proved effective at exploiting this failure to his personal benefit, promising that only he, with a proven record of business success, could fix it.

6. Opposition Was and Is Awful - By comparison to Trump, his opponents in the primary seemed canned, overly scripted, and incompetent by comparison. Trump managed to get far more airtime than the others, if only because he was far more interesting, and he had a clean and relentless message. The others seemed to be tossing out bon mots to constituent groups and lacked courage of their convictions. And during the general election, it is hard to imagine a weaker opponent than Hillary Clinton: uncompelling, wedded to failed policies, personally embroiled in dozens of sketchy dealings, and a terrible record in public service to boot. Again, this has nothing to do with race; it’s all about his comparative advantage relative to those who are set against him in the contest.

7. Sick of the Media - The long pattern of establishment media culture is uniformly predictable: cheering the good-government Democrats over the reactionary Republicans. This has been going on since at least the New Deal and it’s tremendously annoying. In a time of democratized information flows, why do we need high priests telling people what to think and curating so carefully what is and isn’t news? We have algorithms for that now. Trump stood up against their hegemony using alternative means of communication. His fearless and relentless denunciations of the overly pious press has been a non-stop delight to free-thinking Americans.

8. Celebrity Culture - Many people long ago gave up their high expectation for politics and public affairs managed by the political class. What’s it been good for? What’s it done for us since, say, we landed a man on the moon? Given the shoddy record, so much of modern politics has collapsed into pure popular entertainment like sports, movies, and music. It is a cultural phenom and nothing more. Trump, more than anyone else, has mastered this art, treating politics as a variant of celebrity culture, and here he has vastly more experience than his competitors.

9. Growing Tamer - You could have made a case for the primacy of race in the earliest part of his campaign, but it is possible that his seeming dalliance with the alt-right was inadvertent (still inevitable). After all, once he had sewn up the primary, he quickly tacked left on all cultural matters. No Republican nominated for office has ever given such an overt plea for the rights of the LGBTQ community, and even his somewhat ham-handed appeal for black votes defies the narrative. Daily his campaign posts appeals using all the approved buzzwords: social justice, equality, fairness, and so on. It seems he was genuinely stung by the attempt to link him to the politics of hate and now bends the other direction in order to avoid the taint. In other words, he finds political benefit in seeming not to cater to white racialism, and this has actually helped him gain popularity.

10. Safety - In the last two years, global terrorism has taken a new direction, from hitting far-flung government targets to embedding itself in civilian life in major cities. And it seems to be getting worse with bombs randomly appearing in urban settings. The protests against police abuse in major cities contribute to a general feeling of insecurity. In contrast, Trump offers not only an explanation (bad policy) but a classic appeal to law, order, and safety, society managed by police authority. Tragically for those who love liberty, the appeal of that pitch never loses its strength to persuade.

When you consider all these points, abstracted entirely from the “white riot” theory, you have the makings of a surprisingly successful political campaign and candidate. You don't need a template of racial obsession to account for it.

The politics of revolt has been gaining steam since 2008, whether we are talking Tea Party, Occupy, Black Lives Matter, or the Trump movement. They all represent a roiling impatience with the status quo that goes beyond racial divisions. Trump, Clinton, and the status quo are equally unpopular, and that creates a combustable political environment. Fascism doesn’t necessarily need racism to be a winning strategy for political control.
 

Attachments

H

herbu

Audioholic Samurai
Wow! Are you simply trying to be hurtful? Has politics consumed you such that you find glee in the distress of your friends?

Is that really where you are coming from?

I mean, I know we disagree on politics, but I still always considered you a teammate in helping inform and advise people on audio, and a friend.
KEW, of course I'm not trying to be hurtful. Neither do I find glee in the distress of my friends. I'm pleased to consider most of the members here friends, and proud when that feeling is reciprocated.

Please let me explain. For years I have seen a movement by the liberals to further the idea that feelings are more important than achievement. We're not going to keep score because we may hurt the feelings of the losers. We're going to give participation trophies so everybody gets one. We have to create "safe zones" where nobody will disagree with what you say. I've felt we were preparing a society unable to cope with the realities and disappointments of the real world. And not only preparing our youth, but buying into it ourselves.

I see liberals blaming Hillary's loss to race, gender, heritage, etc. So these people really believe half the population are racists, bigots, misogynists, xenophobes, etc? Really? A quarter of the population is literally deplorable. Seriously? To me, that is another symptom of people unable to deal with failure... I mean figuring out the real causes and the most constructive way to handle them. In this case, the real cause is that govt has taken more responsibility than we want them to have.

So when I say it tickles me, I mean it tickles me to see what I've been saying for years would happen, actually happen. Kinda like when you warn your kid over and over, "Don't shoot that wasp nest w/ your new BB gun". But inevitably, one day he does. You feel sorry for his pain, but you're tickled that you told him 20 times, but knew he'd ultimately learn the hard way.

When 10 people apply for the same job, the highest achiever will get it. The highest achiever will get the raise and promotion. Your feelings are not the most important thing to your boss or your customers. You will have failures and disappointments. It is how you handle those failures that will ultimately determine your success.

I think now we are seeing the result of this "feelings" philosophy. The liberals failed in the election and don't know how to deal with it. Remember all the protests, marches and destruction of property by conservatives when Obama won? Me neither. Hurt and Disappointed? You bet your bippy!

Note: Naturally, there are exceptions. But I don't think you'll find many of those exceptions in the universities that are cancelling classes and bringing in counselors and therapy dogs to help the students handle their grief. Good grief! Now that tickles me.
 
Goat1

Goat1

Audioholic
Rickster.. are you a writer? You should be, that was damn impressive. I agree with everything you said.

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
 
Rickster71

Rickster71

Audioholic Spartan
Rickster.. are you a writer? You should be, that was damn impressive. I agree with everything you said.

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
Hi Goat, no I'm not. I can barely string two words together.:)
That's an article written by Jeffrey Tucker.
I was a bit reticent about attributing it, fearing it would by dismissed out of hand.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Chew on this for a minute- the Democrats lost the election, it wasn't stolen from them, it wasn't the fault of third party candidates and their followers, it wasn't the FBI/Comey or the media. The last two may have affected it, but the fact is, not enough Democrats voted to elect her. Obama received almost 9.5 million more votes than McCain and almost 5 million more than Romney. Neither party trotted out a great candidate and a large number from each side cast their ballot to prevent the other from being elected.

Both candidates are heavily flawed, but by being part of what many in the US see as a government working against them, she stuck her own foot in it. He picked up on this and used it as a major part of his platform.
 
Steve81

Steve81

Audioholics Five-0
I see liberals blaming Hillary's loss to race, gender, heritage, etc. So these people really believe half the population are racists, bigots, misogynists, xenophobes, etc? Really? A quarter of the population is literally deplorable. Seriously? To me, that is another symptom of people unable to deal with failure...
Worse, it's a symptom of arrogance. Trump was written off as little more than a joke early on. He was supposed to be nothing more than a minor impediment on the way to the first female president. He was a reality TV star versus "the most qualified candidate ever." His supporters were billed as a bunch of uneducated hicks, voting against their own interests because they had been conned. Even now, you'll see plenty of blogs and articles proclaiming half the electorate to be morons in one breath, and wondering how we can heal the country in the next. Seems like some soul searching is in order.
 
Goat1

Goat1

Audioholic
It's funny how the left wing that promotes peace, equality, tolerance are rioting , calling names and causing all sorts of trouble. Hypocrisy! Shouldn't they just say, we lost, we need to move on and try to make the best of it and help bring the country together?

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jinjuku

jinjuku

Moderator
Say what you will but the guy:

Defeated his OWN party to get nominated
Defeated the the OTHER party to get voted in

And did it all while slighting women, Muslims, and people that technically shouldn't be here.

It's farging impressive on it's own merits. I don't know whether to have hope or despair. I'm like the old man in Moon Struck where his just absolutely confused.

I do have to give kudo's to the man because you don't do what he just did by not having some insight.
 
Goat1

Goat1

Audioholic
Jinjuku.. absolutely agree! The country is about to be changed for the better. I'm tired of a lawless and weak country. Obama's apology tour.. What a fool! Make friends with our enemies and screw over our allies. Idiot!

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jinjuku

jinjuku

Moderator
Jinjuku.. absolutely agree! The country is about to be changed for the better. I'm tired of a lawless and weak country. Obama's apology tour.. What a fool! Make friends with our enemies and screw over our allies. Idiot!

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
I don't know about that. But I believe there is going to be a fundamental change. I have zero idea if it's going to be a good or bad change.

I just know not to underestimate the man.
 
Goat1

Goat1

Audioholic
That's exactly why I'm optimistic.

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ski2xblack

ski2xblack

Audioholic Samurai
Say what you will but the guy:

Defeated his OWN party to get nominated
Defeated the the OTHER party to get voted in
Nah, by nominating Hillary, the Dems plaxico'd themselves.

Trump vs Bernie or Biden or Warren would have killed it in the ratings, bigly. If only...Warren and Bernie spoke to the same anti-globalization sentiment that Trump exploited. It would have been a good fight, and perhaps raised awareness that there is common ground on the populist right and progressive left.

We're either headed further into corporatocracy, or worse, or will have to reign all the BS back in via some sort of neo-New Deal.

Interesting times we live in.
 
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Goat1

Goat1

Audioholic
It will be fine. We need to be energy independent. We need to quit depending on everyone else. We need to bring companies back to this country. Dems kill small business, which is crazy!

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C

Chu Gai

Audioholic Samurai
Say what you will but the guy:

Defeated his OWN party to get nominated
Defeated the the OTHER party to get voted in

And did it all while slighting women, Muslims, and people that technically shouldn't be here.

It's farging impressive on it's own merits. I don't know whether to have hope or despair. I'm like the old man in Moon Struck where his just absolutely confused.

I do have to give kudo's to the man because you don't do what he just did by not having some insight.
He also defeated the media, paper, video and print, all the celebrities, the inherent and exposed collusion with the news, the UN, the sundry governments and god knows what else. I like to think if it's pissing off the French there must be some merit.
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
Whatever the reasons for Trump's victory, I think the price of his victory will be very high. If he keeps just few of his campaign promises, it will be an economic disaster for the USA (but a boon to Europe). Those of you complaining about economic stagnation will remember these as the halcyon days as your 401ks evaporate and the price of all commodities skyrocket from inflation. You can say I am over-reacting now, but bookmark this post and let's see how peachy things are in 2 years- and if I am wrong, rub it in my face. It looks like all the reasons why people voted for Trump can be boiled down to 'sticking it to the man'. The thing is, running a government is difficult and filled with compromises. Few people get all that they want. So a big chunk of the voting population essentially had a infantile temper tantrum and voted for a similarly infantile candidate. Nothing good will follow.
 
cel4145

cel4145

Audioholic
Hi Goat, no I'm not. I can barely string two words together.:)
That's an article written by Jeffrey Tucker.
I was a bit reticent about attributing it, fearing it would by dismissed out of hand.
That's what Melania Trump should have said: she didn't want to attribute her RNC speech as coming from Michelle Obama for fear it would have been "dismissed out of hand." ;)
 
Goat1

Goat1

Audioholic
Now let's discuss how great the country would be with Hillary as Pres.. Tell us all the important things she would have done. I'll tell you what she would have done.. Whatever the people pulling her string wants her to do!

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