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cfrizz

Senior Audioholic
That's because it's a pro amp meant for concerts & what not. Small, ugly, but light weight oh and of course cheap.

The Emotiva will give you the power boost that you need. The sound won't change, (that is not an amplifiers purpose) there will just be a lot more of it being pushed out effortlessly.

Knowing and hearing your speakers operate to their full potential will bring a smile to your face!

man that thing is small it only 26 lbs ?
 
walter duque

walter duque

Audioholic Samurai
I am using MB Quart QLS 830.
4ohm
87dB

I was running them off of a Yamaha rx-v1400 rated 110w @ 8ohm. Not 4ohm stable, and not rated for 4ohm use. I used it to run my system for about a year without any problems.

With a concern of clipping my receivers amp, due to the 4ohm load, low sensitivity, and large room size, I added an external amp.

Amp is an Adcom 7605, rated 175w @ 4ohm. No audible difference.

+1 Reduced the load on my receiver.
+2 Reduced the chance of clipping. Amp also has clipping indicators, which is nice.

EDIT: I added the amp for reasons listed above, not for an audible difference.
Nice speakers. You don't think if you give them speakers 400-500 watts that they would sound like a world of difference. Adcom is not bad either, they make good amps but I think your speakers are way underpowered, these babies look like they can rock, I like them. These don't come a department store either. I'll have to find a dealer on these.
 
Z

zumbo

Audioholic Spartan
Nice speakers. You don't think if you give them speakers 400-500 watts that they would sound like a world of difference. Adcom is not bad either, they make good amps but I think your speakers are way underpowered, these babies look like they can rock, I like them.
I love 'em.

Manufacturer recommends power from 110-180 specifically. Amp specs 175. I can crank to ear bleeding levels for a long period of time without any issues.

Amp is solid, reliable, and not too bad looking.

An equal power multi-buck amp wouldn't yield any audible difference.

An amp would have to be 350w to give me a 3dB increase. While this would improve many areas, I know me. I would push it a little too far.

I can tell with my system when my clip indicators come on, my speakers are done. What they produce at that point is utterly unbelievable, and I feel there is enough power being sent to them.

I am very pleased with my system, but I would like to upgrade my sub some day.

In the middle of upgrading pre-pro/receiver at the moment.
 
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rcpilot_971

Audioholic
I hope your hearing will not be lost in a few years time. :eek:
I have been listening to loud music for over 27 years I like to feal the music as well as hear it and if I do loose my hearing I wont have to listen to the wife anymore LOL
 
walter duque

walter duque

Audioholic Samurai
I love 'em.

I can tell with my system when my clip indicators come on, my speakers are done. What they produce at that point is utterly unbelievable, and I feel there is enough power being sent to them.

I am very pleased with my system, but I would like to upgrade my sub some day.

In the middle of upgrading pre-pro/receiver at the moment.
I have been using this comany for many years now. Most of my speakers are custom made, but the drivers they use are amazing. These speakers just don't give up. You give the power they give the sound without flintching. Besides now and then I like to hit 120db or better. It is in a small room though.
http://www.sourcespeaker.com/
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
man that thing is small it only 26 lbs ?
Yes but built like a tank. It is a class D amplifier so it doesn't require as much power supply as a less efficient type of amplifier design. I believe the consumer term for the technology is "ice power." I'm not sure where that came from. It isn't small at all. It is as deep as it is wide and both dimensions are larger than consumer amps. At any rate, the smaller power supply transformer makes it lighter than a traditional A/B biased amplifier. All the Class D, H, G etc. amps are quite light for this reason. Unlike consumer amplifiers, this unit is designed to run at full power and do it continuously.
 
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F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
Knowing and hearing your speakers operate to their full potential will bring a smile to your face!
What, pray tell, does power have to do with the "full potential" of speakers?
 
W

wyllisx1

Junior Audioholic
I have been using this comany for many years now. Most of my speakers are custom made, but the drivers they use are amazing. These speakers just don't give up. You give the power they give the sound without flintching. Besides now and then I like to hit 120db or better. It is in a small room though.
http://www.sourcespeaker.com/

I need to get some time to check these guys out. They're only about a 20 miunte drive for me.:D
 
R

rcpilot_971

Audioholic
Yes but built like a tank. It is a class D amplifier so it doesn't require as much power supply as a less efficient type of amplifier design. I believe the consumer term for the technology is "ice power." I'm not sure where that came from. It isn't small at all. It is as deep as it is wide and both dimensions are larger than consumer amps. At any rate, the smaller power supply transformer makes it lighter than a traditional A/B biased amplifier. All the Class D, H, G etc. amps are quite light for this reason. Unlike consumer amplifiers, this unit is designed to run at full power and do it continuously.


so what is the main difference AB class and D class Amps is one better witch one is cleaner
 
H

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Be sure to wear hearing protection when you do that. You'll be as deaf as a rock star in time if you don't.
That will never happen. The first part, I mean. Second part is guaranteed.
 
C

cfrizz

Senior Audioholic
A whole lot! Receivers don't put out the same kind of power (and tests have PROVEN THAT FACT!) that separate amps do and the vast majority of people can hear the difference!

I'm sorry if you and others can't hear the difference, or just choose to rely on specs & tests to tell you what you should be hearing. Or simply decide for the sake of saving some money that a difference isn't made.

But you shouldn't be telling the rest of us that we are NOT hearing what we hear, or we are crazy for hearing it since you obviously don't hear what we hear.

What I find ironic is if the pros on here decide to test speakers they ALWAYS use separate amplification. That alone should tell you something, but you CHOOSE to ignore that little bit of information & still insist that ext amps don't make a difference!

If you choose not to use separate amplification, that is your choice & you are free to do so. However, if someone comes on here looking for amp recommendations, at least have the curtesy of staying out of the conversation if you have nothing but negatives to add.

As the old saying goes. If you have nothing good to say, say nothing at all!

Now if you have knowledge of constant equipment failure from a certain brand etc, then by all means a warning to that effect would be in order.

In some ways, those of you who decry the benefits of amplification so vehemently and harangue those looking for advice about it, remind me of the useless people who scream at women going into clinics that also happen to perform abortions.

It doesn't affect you, or your wallet so what do you care? You have your truth, and they have theirs.

It is their money, let them spend it as they wish. Live & let live folks!

What, pray tell, does power have to do with the "full potential" of speakers?
 
C

cfrizz

Senior Audioholic
That is a question only your ears will be able to answer. Rotel also now makes Ice amps for home use. But try to let your ears decide the matter first & not your wallet.

Once your ears know, the rest will fall into place.

so what is the main difference AB class and D class Amps is one better witch one is cleaner
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
so what is the main difference AB class and D class Amps is one better witch one is cleaner
Class D are more efficient and still have inaudible distortion.

Amplifier biasing is something like a water faucet. Class A has the water running all the time so we just put our bucket in the stream when we need to fill it. As we bias toward higher efficiency (class B in the old days) we either shut the water off and only turn it on when we need water or we leave a trickle running and open it up wide when we need to fill the bucket. That's simplistic but by making our faucet more efficient we waste less water. By biasing our amplifiers toward higher efficiency we use less power, generate less heat, and have an amplifier that is smaller, lighter and cheaper to build. But the problem was always that biasing for efficiency also biased for higher distortion levels.

In recent years they have made a lot of advances in technology so that a lot of different biasing schemes have come to bear on audio that all provide inaudible distortion but have higher levels of efficiency. We have schemes now like class H that provide variable rail voltages to increase efficiency with no increase in distortion at all.

A few years ago class D amps were used only with subwoofers because subs have a high level of distortion so you couldn't hear the distortion in the amplifier itself. Today, class D amps are as clean as a whistle as the specs to the Yamaha pro amp show.

In a nutshell I would suggest that these new classes of amplifiers are better because they are more efficient. They are smaller, lighter, cheaper to make and cheaper to operate and still have inaudible levels of distortion.
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
A whole lot! Receivers don't put out the same kind of power (and tests have PROVEN THAT FACT!) that separate amps do and the vast majority of people can hear the difference!
Actually the reverse is true. Receivers produce exactly the "kind" of power. Bias controlled listening tests have proven that people cannot hear differences between solid state amplifiers that are operating below their clipping levels. Whoever told you about scientifically valid tests that prove otherwise are confused, I'm afraid.

I'm sorry if you and others can't hear the difference, or just choose to rely on specs & tests to tell you what you should be hearing. Or simply decide for the sake of saving some money that a difference isn't made.
I get really annoyed at this argument. It is completely false and insulting. One's hearing acuity has nothing, repeat NOTHING to do with the audible differences between solid state amplifiers. Bias controlled listening tests obviate any effects from hearing acuity.

But you shouldn't be telling the rest of us that we are NOT hearing what we hear, or we are crazy for hearing it since you obviously don't hear what we hear.
I'm not telling you don't hear what you hear. What I'm telling you is that what you hear isn't caused by the equipment. It is caused by your expectations and biases. I hear them too. I just understand why I hear them. I'm trying to help you understand why you hear them.

What I find ironic is if the pros on here decide to test speakers they ALWAYS use separate amplification. That alone should tell you something, but you CHOOSE to ignore that little bit of information & still insist that ext amps don't make a difference!
There aren't any receivers in pro audio. I've never heard a pro audio person comment on the audibility of an amplifier. It isn't an issue.

If you choose not to use separate amplification, that is your choice & you are free to do so. However, if someone comes on here looking for amp recommendations, at least have the curtesy of staying out of the conversation if you have nothing but negatives to add.
Why? People should be allowed to be exposed to the truth. If they choose to ignore the truth like you do, that is their business. But not offering it in the first place is more than discourteous.

As the old saying goes. If you have nothing good to say, say nothing at all!
But I do have something good say. My comments tell people the truth and truth can save them a lot of things, including money. To say that a $15000 amplifier sounds better than a $500 one is simply false and saying so is certainly not a good thing. It is you who are disseminating falsehoods and saying bad things, not I.

It doesn't affect you, or your wallet so what do you care? You have your truth, and they have theirs.
I don't care what people buy. I only care that they are exposed to the truth before they buy it.

It is their money, let them spend it as they wish. Live & let live folks!
I couldn't agree more. Incidentally, I can prove my position to you. Let me know if you want to accept my challenge. It involves a wager, however, so there is something for you to lose besides your beliefs. Sorry to have intruded into your forum and offered up information with which you disagree. The best way for you to win a debate is to try to squelch the other side. It didn't work, though. Better luck next time.
 
Z

zumbo

Audioholic Spartan
A whole lot! Receivers don't put out the same kind of power (and tests have PROVEN THAT FACT!) that separate amps do and the vast majority of people can hear the difference!

I'm sorry if you and others can't hear the difference, or just choose to rely on specs & tests to tell you what you should be hearing. Or simply decide for the sake of saving some money that a difference isn't made.

But you shouldn't be telling the rest of us that we are NOT hearing what we hear, or we are crazy for hearing it since you obviously don't hear what we hear.

What I find ironic is if the pros on here decide to test speakers they ALWAYS use separate amplification. That alone should tell you something, but you CHOOSE to ignore that little bit of information & still insist that ext amps don't make a difference!

If you choose not to use separate amplification, that is your choice & you are free to do so. However, if someone comes on here looking for amp recommendations, at least have the curtesy of staying out of the conversation if you have nothing but negatives to add.

As the old saying goes. If you have nothing good to say, say nothing at all!

Now if you have knowledge of constant equipment failure from a certain brand etc, then by all means a warning to that effect would be in order.

In some ways, those of you who decry the benefits of amplification so vehemently and harangue those looking for advice about it, remind me of the useless people who scream at women going into clinics that also happen to perform abortions.

It doesn't affect you, or your wallet so what do you care? You have your truth, and they have theirs.

It is their money, let them spend it as they wish. Live & let live folks!
Your rant is useless.

The facts are in the thread.

You are free to feel the way you do.

You are free to post what you want.

No need to get all bent out of shape.

Everyone is aware of the placebo effect.;)

EDIT: I envy your Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature 5 ch, and wish it were mine. But, the facts are the facts.
 
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walter duque

walter duque

Audioholic Samurai
A whole lot! Receivers don't put out the same kind of power (and tests have PROVEN THAT FACT!) that separate amps do and the vast majority of people can hear the difference!

I'm sorry if you and others can't hear the difference, or just choose to rely on specs & tests to tell you what you should be hearing. Or simply decide for the sake of saving some money that a difference isn't made.

But you shouldn't be telling the rest of us that we are NOT hearing what we hear, or we are crazy for hearing it since you obviously don't hear what we hear.

What I find ironic is if the pros on here decide to test speakers they ALWAYS use separate amplification. That alone should tell you something, but you CHOOSE to ignore that little bit of information & still insist that ext amps don't make a difference!

If you choose not to use separate amplification, that is your choice & you are free to do so. However, if someone comes on here looking for amp recommendations, at least have the curtesy of staying out of the conversation if you have nothing but negatives to add.

As the old saying goes. If you have nothing good to say, say nothing at all!

Now if you have knowledge of constant equipment failure from a certain brand etc, then by all means a warning to that effect would be in order.

In some ways, those of you who decry the benefits of amplification so vehemently and harangue those looking for advice about it, remind me of the useless people who scream at women going into clinics that also happen to perform abortions.

It doesn't affect you, or your wallet so what do you care? You have your truth, and they have theirs.

It is their money, let them spend it as they wish. Live & let live folks!
You're a 100% right on, don't let these clowns get to you. A $500.-- Amp vs. $15000.-- and no difference. I guess they all hang out a BB. They never heard good equipment. Seems like all they know is Denon_Onkyo-Polk and Klipsch which is worth about 10 cents on a Dollar.
Them Sunfire amps on your signature kick, these guys can't even comprehent High Powerd amps. It' just sonic heaven isn't it. It's like driving a VW or a Ferrari they'll get you there, Yeah
No difference at all. I can tell a major difference when I change my Amps around from 200 watts to 350 watts major difference belive me. That's why we spend the money.
 
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