How good is the DACs that come with the receiver/pre for music?

[Irvrobinson]

But I remember you talked about the long term effects

That's correct, and before I let the Levinson go I listened to the Benchmark for several weeks, with the test being how often and I long I listened for. I didn't notice any difference, the system still attracted me just as much, and when my wife travelled on business I sometimes listened for five hours or more, with no fatigue. I had to conclude that the two DAC-preamps were indistinguishable. I was actually pretty impressed at how far technology had come. The Levinson had one of those hugely expensive UltraAnalog DACs in it, a part alone that cost three figures back then. No need for that sort of thing any longer.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I believe we are into this hobby for overkill. Overkill amps, overkill speakers, overkill everything. We can get the same or better sound with less money, but that's just not how we roll.

 

[Irvrobinson]

I believe we are into this hobby for overkill. Overkill amps, overkill speakers, overkill everything. We can get the same or better sound with less money, but that's just not how we roll.

I don't know about that, at least not for me, especially with speakers. The only speakers that intrigue me as much or more than the Salon2s, the Sound Labs, cost more.

You might have a point with subs, just for sheer output, but nothing really approaches the DD18+ for looks and features in addition to 20Hz output. Clearly I could get even more output with the SVS PB-13 Ultra, but it lacks various features I use, and it isn't as good-looking. The Funk 18.3, my likely alternative choice, isn't much less expensive, doesn't look as good, and lacks some features I like, though I suspect it has better performance. Nonetheless, I'm not really seeing the overkill factor.

In electronics I could almost agree, since I could have picked Emotiva instead of ATI and saved money, and there is a chance the difference would be inaudible, but that's not really your point, is it? I think what you're saying is that I could have got an AVR and not heard the difference, and of this I'm not convinced. When I pop the lid on an AVR and compare it to what's inside of a well-engineered power amp, well, there's no comparison. Could I have gone with a low-end Class D Crown and been just as happy? I don't know, but the Crown I would have chosen, the Macro-Tech, was over twice the price (as an AT3002 would be).

So on amps and speakers I'm not so convinced I committed overkill, though I admit I certainly approached the point of diminishing returns, or paid for features and robustness rather than simply sound.

Pre-amps and DACs, the subject of this thread, are a different question, because they can be just IC-based, but as I said earlier, I'm still not convinced. AVRs are, IMO, a silly engineering compromise intended for convenience in the mass market. I know some selected specs can be just as good, but the whole idea of the compromises involved look like a bad idea. If a pre-pro or a DAC-pre is overkill, I guess i'm guilty as charged, but I bet I win on appeal.