How close are we to WWIII?

[highfigh]

That $12 billion was just for the first week. My point is that complaints about aid to Ukraine costing so much are just partisan BS.

I don't think the expenditures even include the assets lost: three F-15E Strike Eagles, a KC-135 tanker, an E-3 Sentry (AWACS) and an AN/TPY-2 radar system, just for starters.

But yes, the wasted lives of service personnel is tragic. They would still be alive, but for the stupidity of your fearless leader.

Right, we DON'T know the accounting, just numbers that are tossed around. The money for what was lost was spent years ago and- those F-15 haven't been made since 2017 and KC-135 have been made since 1957. Losing one or a few of each doesn't mean more needs to be spent soon but the RADAR defense system isn't plentiful or inexpensive.

The US has operated using heavy redundancy for a long time- anything lost or damaged is easy to replace other than, obviously, people. However, replacements are available and I'm not saying "It's no problem, we have more troops".

At some point, will the countries that surround Iran that have been attacked, retaliate?

 

[GO-NAD!]

Right, we DON'T know the accounting, just numbers that are tossed around. The money for what was lost was spent years ago and- those F-15 haven't been made since 2017 and KC-135 have been made since 1957. Losing one or a few of each doesn't mean more needs to be spent soon but the RADAR defense system isn't plentiful or inexpensive.

The US has operated using heavy redundancy for a long time- anything lost or damaged is easy to replace other than, obviously, people. However, replacements are available and I'm not saying "It's no problem, we have more troops".

At some point, will the countries that surround Iran that have been attacked, retaliate?

While there may be a great deal of redundancy of equipment within the US military, and it may be easy to replace those lost aircraft, it will still cost today dollars to fill those holes.

As for the surrounding countries, maybe they are minimizing their responses in hopes of avoiding the conflict becoming an out-and-out regional war and that the US, Israel and Iran come to a peace deal.

 

[highfigh]

While there may be a great deal of redundancy of equipment within the US military, and it may be easy to replace those lost aircraft, it will still cost today dollars to fill those holes.

As for the surrounding countries, maybe they are minimizing their responses in hopes of avoiding the conflict becoming an out-and-out regional war and that the US, Israel and Iran come to a peace deal.

Or, if they have enough, one or three don't need to be replaced. They don't make many aircraft, they just update them as needed. They're looking at that particular AWACS plane to keep going for a total of about 100 years- B-52 has been going for close to 75 right now and they're apparently using them over Iran. I really hope they stop paying insane amounts for each plane, like the F22, which the US doesn't even sell to other countries- I hope its advantages are worth the price.

I saw something about the EU leader and comments about "it's US's war"- I want to know how they're doing with passage through the Straits of Hormuz being closed off and explain how the rest of Europe doesn't benefit from it being open.

I'm not convinced that, long-term, the Middle East can be peaceful.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Or, if they have enough, one or three don't need to be replaced. They don't make many aircraft, they just update them as needed. They're looking at that particular AWACS plane to keep going for a total of about 100 years- B-52 has been going for close to 75 right now and they're apparently using them over Iran. I really hope they stop paying insane amounts for each plane, like the F22, which the US doesn't even sell to other countries- I hope its advantages are worth the price.

I saw something about the EU leader and comments about "it's US's war"- I want to know how they're doing with passage through the Straits of Hormuz being closed off and explain how the rest of Europe doesn't benefit from it being open.

I'm not convinced that, long-term, the Middle East can be peaceful.

The US...well...Trump, anyway...created a complete and needless mess. He crapped his diaper and now Europe should come and change it? Do you actually want another world war? Because, bringing in a bunch more countries is how you get another world war.

I know it would be a bitter pill to swallow, but the least destructive option would be to admit that this was all a very bad idea and back the hell out. Congress needs to rein Trump in. But, of course, the entire GOP caucus couldn't muster enough vertebrae to construct a single spinal column. The longer this goes on, the worse the outcome is likely to be.

 

[Nondemo01]

But you are RETIRED. Things change.

Yup. From ACTIVE duty. Now? Gotta earn a living somehow. You probably won't like hearing this, but most of the active duty combat force would LOVE to fight in this war. That's the entire point of drills, training, more drills, more training. My generation got 2 and everyone I deployed with loved every minute of it. "Ultimately, we're all dead men. Sadly, we cannot choose how. But, we can decide how we meet that end in order that we are remembered as men." Go curl up in a ball and wait for old age to take you. I'll go out with my friends doing what I LOVE. It's not for everyone and if you've never served in combat, you'll never understand.

The politics? Not the warrior problem. Pick better leaders if you don't want wars. Don't half-ass them when you are in one. Vegetius said it best: if you want peace, prepare for war.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Yup. From ACTIVE duty. Now? Gotta earn a living somehow. You probably won't like hearing this, but most of the active duty combat force would LOVE to fight in this war. That's the entire point of drills, training, more drills, more training. My generation got 2 and everyone I deployed with loved every minute of it. "Ultimately, we're all dead men. Sadly, we cannot choose how. But, we can decide how we meet that end in order that we are remembered as men." Go curl up in a ball and wait for old age to take you. I'll go out with my friends doing what I LOVE. It's not for everyone and if you've never served in combat, you'll never understand.

The politics? Not the warrior problem. Pick better leaders if you don't want wars. Don't half-ass them when you are in one. Vegetius said it best: if you want peace, prepare for war.

Probably best to defer to our elder leaders on military engagement vs love of war.

 

[3db]

Trump, you decided to follow the other warlord, Netanyahu into Iran without consulting NATO. Your lack of forsight about the Strait Hormuz causing economic uphevel throughout the world rests squarely on your shoulders and the rest of the clusterf?ck followers that support you. Why should NATO bail your pathetic narcistic sorry ass out of hot water? Have you even considered that NATO along with Iran wants to see your imcompetant ass removed from the seat of power through economic means? I sincerely hope that NATO continues to show you their collective middle finger because that's all you deserve.

 

[highfigh]

The US...well...Trump, anyway...created a complete and needless mess. He crapped his diaper and now Europe should come and change it? Do you actually want another world war? Because, bringing in a bunch more countries is how you get another world war.

I know it would be a bitter pill to swallow, but the least destructive option would be to admit that this was all a very bad idea and back the hell out. Congress needs to rein Trump in. But, of course, the entire GOP caucus couldn't muster enough vertebrae to construct a single spinal column. The longer this goes on, the worse the outcome is likely to be.

I don't want ANY wars, but the Ayatollah needed to go.

Yeah, Congress.....shining example of governmental bullshyte. Someone needs to enact term limits or this place is going to completely implode.

 

[3db]

I don't want ANY wars, but the Ayatollah needed to go.

Agreed but its none of USA's business even though the USA set up the whole thing supporting the Shaw of Iran in a CIA led coupe.

 

[NMG]

I think the best thing the world could do is sit this one out. Trump is clearly in over his head and to me is trying to either dump his problem onto others or suck them into it to help bail him out. Screw that.

Nothing on the world stage is going to improve until that head case is no longer in power. If it takes a few years and skyrocketing gas prices to get there, so be it. It’s better than creating an even larger catastrophe with millions of dead people strewn across the globe.

 

[GO-NAD!]

I don't want ANY wars, but the Ayatollah needed to go.

Yeah, Congress.....shining example of governmental bullshyte. Someone needs to enact term limits or this place is going to completely implode.

Well, they killed one Ayatollah - only for another to be appointed. Is anyone any better off? Is there any realistic expectation of regime change without putting boots on the ground? I don't think so.

 

[pewternhrata]

That $12B would not have been spent replacing the ammo if not for this war, no? Certainly, a fleet exercise would not have cost that much even if you include Airforce participation. And no war casualties.

Well the ammunition in all cases does come with a shelf life, so it is constantly being purchased, the old is DEMIL. So yes, it would be replaced, but regardless if used or not.

 

[GO-NAD!]

The Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action (JCPOA) may not have offered an iron-clad assurance that Iran wouldn't continue with a hidden nuclear weapons program, but it was better than what's happening now and what is likely to happen in the future. Whether or not Iran could have been trusted to adhere to the JCPOA can be debated. But, the message they have received is that they cannot trust the US, which may make them more determined than ever to construct nuclear weapons.

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www.cbc.ca

 

[highfigh]

Agreed but its none of USA's business even though the USA set up the whole thing supporting the Shaw of Iran in a CIA led coupe.

The people of Iran didn't want an Islamic dictator but they have suffered under them for 47 years.

 

[highfigh]

I think the best thing the world could do is sit this one out. Trump is clearly in over his head and to me is trying to either dump his problem onto others or suck them into it to help bail him out. Screw that.

Nothing on the world stage is going to improve until that head case is no longer in power. If it takes a few years and skyrocketing gas prices to get there, so be it. It’s better than creating an even larger catastrophe with millions of dead people strewn across the globe.

OK, what should the world do about their shipping needs being disabled?

 

[highfigh]

The US...well...Trump, anyway...created a complete and needless mess. He crapped his diaper and now Europe should come and change it? Do you actually want another world war? Because, bringing in a bunch more countries is how you get another world war.

I know it would be a bitter pill to swallow, but the least destructive option would be to admit that this was all a very bad idea and back the hell out. Congress needs to rein Trump in. But, of course, the entire GOP caucus couldn't muster enough vertebrae to construct a single spinal column. The longer this goes on, the worse the outcome is likely to be.

Iran has sent rockets to several countries- should they not make it clear that it needs to stop?

I have said for a long time that Trump needs a muzzle and handlers. WRT Congress, they couldn't agree that the sky is blue or that water is wet. I'm more concerned that members on both sides couldn't make a brain stem. Obstruction for the sake of it is no way to ruin a country. That's not a typo.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Iran has sent rockets to several countries- should they not make it clear that it needs to stop?

Most of those rockets have been aimed at US facilities in those countries. Regardless, how are they supposed to make it clear that "it needs to stop"? Most of them don't have sufficient military resources to contribute effectively. Not that adding more rockets to the conflict is likely to make matters better.

Of course, it would be easy to make it stop - the US and Israel can stop any time they want. Iran will follow suit.

I have said for a long time that Trump needs a muzzle and handlers. WRT Congress, they couldn't agree that the sky is blue or that water is wet. I'm more concerned that members on both sides couldn't make a brain stem. Obstruction for the sake of it is no way to ruin a country. That's not a typo.

Nobody is going to (or could) muzzle Trump. Besides, if a president needs a muzzle, it's clear that he is unfit for the office.

While the level of intelligence within both houses can be debated, the GOP controls both. It's up to them to rein Trump in - and they are far too craven to stand up to him.

 

[NMG]

OK, what should the world do about their shipping needs being disabled?

Wait it out or make deals with Iran to allow passage. As insane as that sounds, what other options are there other than a prolonged war with the risk of intolerable escalation? It’s almost as though Trump didn’t think any of this through . . .

 

[3db]

The people of Iran didn't want an Islamic dictator but they have suffered under them for 47 years.

That does not make it the US's business.

 

[3db]

Wait it out or make deals with Iran to allow passage. As insane as that sounds, what other options are there other than a prolonged war with the risk of intolerable escalation? It’s almost as though Trump didn’t think any of this through . . .

Its obvious that he didnt think this through at all as the Strait of Hormuz is biting him in the ass. Lol