Hi Everyone - need some sub advice on setup

[r_malvia]

Still waiting......

So for a quick update; I brought in my Pioneer SC35 3 weeks ago due to the pre-out on the subwoofer cutting in and out on the audio. They called me back about 2 weeks ago telling me that the amp in the receiver is shot (very low volume). I told them that I've only hooked up the system just after Xmas and I've only starting to break in my system with the volume at -30 for most of the times. How can a receiver amp be toast when it hasn't even been pushed hard? I think there's more to this than they are telling me. Anyways, they said they are talking to Pioneer and seeing what can be done. They tech calls me and says they need to send my receiver to Pioneer as they don't carry the necessary parts to fix. It'll cost me about $100 for shipping. This is a total kick in the butt!!! Anyways, I'm still waiting for them to get a consensus from Pioneer.

As for my current setup, I'm running everything with the Pioneer VSX921. It seems to be running nicely. The auto MCACC was a breeze since it's a simplified version from the SC35 setup. The FV12 is sounding nice! I played chapter 5 in "War of the Worlds" and the sub gets down really low! I had to go out and buy this disc since it was the only demo I heard (at the Sound Room). Other than that, I have nothing else to compare to. But I did realilze one thing that people should be aware of..... when I demoed the GoldenEar Forcefield sub (see previous posts in this thread), there was a whole lot of shaking going on with the recliner I was sitting on. Finally dawned on me that they must have been running a "Buttkicker" on the seat. I was totally impressed with the same WOTW chapter. There's no way that the Goldenear can extend as deep as the FV12. And the room was open on one end; mine is totally sealed with it being 12' x 19'. Sales tactics!!!

 

[cwall99]

Sorry to hear of all your misadventures in getting things dialed in. A few years ago, I bought a store's demo model VSX82-TXS along with their demo B&W DSM603 S3s and LCR600 (center). I have NHT 1.3As in back. Since I'm only driving five speakers, I've bi-amped (and bi-wired) the 603s. A couple summers ago, I went to Audio Advisor's first ever warehouse sale and picked up an Earthquake SuperNova v15 for $100 (it lists for $2600; I think it was a demo Earthquake sent them for demo purposes).

Anyhow, it's a subwoofer that's in a whole 'nother class of gear than the rest of my system, and it really took a lot of work getting the thing dialed in. I did a few things that really seemed to help out:

• First, I found the article on Audioholics about dialing in your subwoofer made easy. This alone made a huge difference.
• Next, since all my speakers are good down to 50 Hz or lower, I set my crossover at 50 Hz instead of 80, and then ran all my speakers as small. I find this gives me a lot more precision and definition in the upper and mid-bass and lets the sub do all its work down really low where it's needed. This also improves the low frequencies' non-directional qualities.
• Then I just got really patient and tried a variety of positions for the subwoofer. My room has one particular spot where the bass is super-emphasized, but that's not a normal listening position. But I found a good spot for the subwoofer and am satisfied with the coverage I get all over the room with the sub in its current position.
• After all that, knowing how much cable I needed, I ordered a subwoofer cable. Nothing fancy. spent about $40 on Blue Jeans Cable. It's shielded, and that's really all I figured I needed.

Anyhow, now that it's all dialed in, it sounds great. Patience, it seems, is more than just a virtue when you're dialing in a subwoofer.

 

[r_malvia]

You have a nice system. I'm just choked right now since I've been waiting for over a month now without my Pio SC35. It's sitting in limbo now without an answer on what's wrong with it.

 

[r_malvia]

Receiver is back finally!

I finally got my Pioneer SC35 back from the shop. They repaired a back panel circuit board that was making the subout wacky. Anyways, for all this time I've been using a Pioneer VSX-921. I gotta tell you, it's been serving its purpose quite well. Now that the beast is back, I'll hook up the 921 to a 2.1 system. I'm hoping I'll hear a huge difference between the two units. I've only used the SC35 for about 1.5 months before it was toast, as well, I didn't have the FV12 at that time. Anyways, I'm gonna spend the weekend hooking everything up again and running through the MCACC.

I was skeptical on whether I was going to keep the SC35 or returning it (from Costco) prior to the repair. So I ended up buying a Yamaha HTR-8063. Nice unit, but I'll be returning this since I have the Pio back. If I didn't have any choice, I think I would have kept it. Anyone know how this a/v sounds?

 

[timoteo]

Well to be honest, receivers don't effect the sound much. You may notice a very slight difference because of the class D amps in the SC35. But the job of a good receiver is to replay the source material faithfully. Today's DACs are so much better than 10+ years ago that even the lower end receivers sound great. If your 921 was trying to power some heavy load speakers & was struggling at high volumes then you notice an improvement in dynamics & be able to get more output with less distortion. I didn't see what speakers you have but most these days most are designed with a certain standard (8ohm & 87dB-92dB sensativity).

Whether you do or don't hear a difference just know that the SC35 is a top performing AVR & has so many features to offer. The upgrade is more about all the bells & whistles. One thing that may help improve the sound is the much better MCACC, specially if you have a tricky room!

Congrats on getting the Pio back!!!!

 

[r_malvia]

Another problem.....

Just when I thought it was smooth sailing from here. I hooked everything up nicely with the wire management (about 2 hours) and then run the MCACC....mic problem. I flashes up on screen that there's a mic problem. So, no big deal, I figure it wasn't plugged in all the way. Try again, no can do. So I grab the mic from my VSX-921. Plug that in, same message. Okay, now it must be a problem with the receiver itself. I ready to throw this out the window!!! It was sitting at Pioneer for the past 3 months because they replaced a front panel circuit board, now this. I beginning to think this is not worth the effort here, but sooooo close.

My problem here is because it is not under warranty, even though it brand spanking new. I bought this from Costco.com and because I live in Vancouver, BC this does not fall under Pioneer Canada warranty. I already spent about $150 to get it repaired to this state. I don't know if it's worth it to send it back again. I'm pretty sure that this problem will be covered under the original repair (supposedly 90 days). The problem is the initial diagnostic fee which will be $76 and another $84 to ship. So far it would add up to over $300 I would have put into this receiver. We totally get ripped off in Canada, the MSRP is $2100 here. What a joke! That's why I jumped on it when Costco sold it for $750US. Anyways, I'm thinking of just packing it in and returning it to Costco (at least I can get my money back). Luckily I haven't returned the Yamaha HTR-8063 (identical to RX-A1000). Head to head comparison, the Pio has better specs, but the Yammie is a close 2nd. I personally would prefer the Pio since it has the ICE amps.

Is there a way to calibrate the Pio without the MCACC? I know we get spoiled since all the receivers nowadays come with some mic calibration setup (nothing like that 10 years ago). Can I tape measure the distance from each speaker to my listening position? I've also downloaded a SPL meter app for my Android. Will I be wasting my time going with the manual calibration (I'm sure others on this forum can do this, but I'm totally inexperienced with this method). Would you guys sink any more money into this unit or return it and run with the Yammie? I just got the Yammie in the mail, so I have 14 days for full refund. Any inputs please!

 

[timoteo]

Holy crap man so sorry to hear that!!! That's freakin rediculous!! Man I would be fuming too!!

Well I'm not too familiar with the new MCACC (only experience with older version) but my guess would be to call up Pioneer & raise hell until they fix it & pay all shipping!!!

As far as using it without running MCACC, yes you can get just as good of performance normally without needing the auto calibration. That is IF it allows you access to the EQ to manually adjust (if there is one). Most auto EQ systems are made for the average joe who just wants to do a one button fix. If you have a REAL SPL meter (like RadioShack or others, NOT an app) then you can get everything dialed in great! You would need a test signal disc such as the one free from RealTraps.com & the SPL meter. Look into whether there is some sort of parametric EQ that you could adjust like I mentioned. My RX-A2000 has one & that's how I calibrated my system so I'm hoping the Pioneer is set up similar.

I'd try to call Pioneer to get what you need but in the meantime try to dial in the 35 I case they are hardheaded. In the end it comes down to what they will do for you, IF you can dial in the SC35 manually & if it's worth getting your money back (-$150 spent)

 

[r_malvia]

Holy crap man so sorry to hear that!!! That's freakin rediculous!! Man I would be fuming too!!

Well I'm not too familiar with the new MCACC (only experience with older version) but my guess would be to call up Pioneer & raise hell until they fix it & pay all shipping!!!

As far as using it without running MCACC, yes you can get just as good of performance normally without needing the auto calibration. That is IF it allows you access to the EQ to manually adjust (if there is one). Most auto EQ systems are made for the average joe who just wants to do a one button fix. If you have a REAL SPL meter (like RadioShack or others, NOT an app) then you can get everything dialed in great! You would need a test signal disc such as the one free from RealTraps.com & the SPL meter. Look into whether there is some sort of parametric EQ that you could adjust like I mentioned. My RX-A2000 has one & that's how I calibrated my system so I'm hoping the Pioneer is set up similar.

I'd try to call Pioneer to get what you need but in the meantime try to dial in the 35 I case they are hardheaded. In the end it comes down to what they will do for you, IF you can dial in the SC35 manually & if it's worth getting your money back (-$150 spent)

Thanks for the input. Any advice from anyone now is much appreciated!!! I actually saved my MCACC output file from a previous setup before I sent it out for repairs. I used the measured settings from that and it's sounding OK. I just found out that I'm getting no AM or FM. It shows on the screen that the signal is present, but no sound. I'm really thinkin that this unit is a pure lemon! I'll call Pio Canada on Monday and see what they say. I'm guessing that they won't do much for me. My other choice is to drive back across the border and leave with my buddy there to send it out to Pio USA to fix and then drive it back. What a hassle! Anyways, if they won't repair without additional costs, I think I might return and run with the Yammie. How do you like your RX-A2000?

BTW, the Pio does have the parametric EQ. I'm just not that experienced on what will sound good or not.

 

[TulsaSKD]

I have had subs from Polk, klipsch, outlaw and Cambridge sound works sub. All have there good points but late last year I found a velodyne optimum 10 sub and took a chance since they didn't have one unboxed but said I could return if I didn't like it. Man I can't believe how good it Sounds for a 10 and like it even more then the outlaw EX. It even has a setup mike like my onkyo receiver. After I ran the setup it really blew me away and had to turn the volume down.

 

[timoteo]

I absolutely LOVE the RX-A2000!! At first I was using the internal amps & loved it. Now I use it as a Pre-pro & let the XPA-5 power the speakers...still love it! It has so much user flexability. The Parametric EQ for each channel INCLUDING both sub channels is awesome & has allowed me to really fine tune the response. There are a handful of great AVRs, from Yammie, Denon, Marantz, Integra etc. I loved the way the Advanced YPAO sounded, how the new GUI looks & the top notch reputation that Yamaha has with how long their receivers last. I highly recommend their Aventage (A/V Entertainment for the new Age) line.

 

[r_malvia]

Back from the shop!!!

Just picked up my Pio SC35 yesterday. It finally came back with an unbelievable amount of repairs done to it. This must a been a "super" lemon to begin with. They replaced 5 circuit boards on it!!! Anyways, I managed to hook up all the speakers and components last night. So far, so good. AM/FM even works this time. Haven't got a chance to run MCACC since the kids were asleep. Try and dial it in tonight.

At least Pioneer honored their initial repair at no charge. I'd probably buy another Pio when the time comes. They have redeemed themselves!!!