Help with calculating treatment volume for room with vaulted ceiling

R

resqguy

Audiophyte
I have had good success with my own HT room setups for more than 20 years. I have studied and followed the tools that are available for room response and measurement. Lots of incredible innovation over the years.

It is time to focus on my HT listening room. My listening room is ~22ft x 40ft with a 22ft x 28ft section (listening area) vaulted. The base ceiling is 9ft and the ridge height is ~17ft. The ceiling and end walls are currently all drywall and make for a very lively (echo) response. My concern is the frequencies in the mid and upper range. I normally use AMROC for treatment calculations but it is set up for rectangular rooms with flat ceilings. I am looking for an alternative way to calculate the amount of treatment needed to reduce the amount of echo coming from my vaulted ceiling.

My HT system is designed for large rooms, plenty of power and (speaker) drivers to cover.

TIA
 
everettT

everettT

Audioholic Spartan
I have had good success with my own HT room setups for more than 20 years. I have studied and followed the tools that are available for room response and measurement. Lots of incredible innovation over the years.

It is time to focus on my HT listening room. My listening room is ~22ft x 40ft with a 22ft x 28ft section (listening area) vaulted. The base ceiling is 9ft and the ridge height is ~17ft. The ceiling and end walls are currently all drywall and make for a very lively (echo) response. My concern is the frequencies in the mid and upper range. I normally use AMROC for treatment calculations but it is set up for rectangular rooms with flat ceilings. I am looking for an alternative way to calculate the amount of treatment needed to reduce the amount of echo coming from my vaulted ceiling.

My HT system is designed for large rooms, plenty of power and (speaker) drivers to cover.

TIA
Have you taken measurements yet to see where the issues are outside of the spreadsheet? Those calculators, like AMROC, are useful a lot of times, but are no substitution for measurement software in rooms with a lot of variables.
 
R

resqguy

Audiophyte
Have you taken measurements yet to see where the issues are outside of the spreadsheet? Those calculators, like AMROC, are useful a lot of times, but are no substitution for measurement software in rooms with a lot of variables.
I haven't taken measurements yet but the echo is really apparent just from normal conversation. I actually have had the opposite experience. I find the measurements reinforce the calculations. I spent hours measuring the bass response once only to find that the calculations were spot on. After making the corrections I confirm the results with REW. It is just a different approach where I use the calculations for the major corrections, then fine tune with measurements. In this case I will apply sound panels based on calculations then use drapes and room accessories to dial in from there.
 
R

resqguy

Audiophyte
Since I haven't received any responses I will assume that I am on my own. I am certain that someone has calculated or measured the reflection characteristics of a wall/plane and has determined a ratio of treated to untreated area in order to achieve the desired reflective reverb energy. I guess I will just take a guess and go from there. I was hoping to prevent multiple iterations of the placement of treatment on my ceiling. I don't want it to look like swiss cheese and cost more than necessary.
 
ski2xblack

ski2xblack

Audioholic Samurai
If normal conversation reveals apparent echoes, is it safe to assume that this room is at this stage completely undecorated? It seems that this is early stage, and that you want to incorporate dedicated treatments as a fundamental part of the decor. Also curious about the kit you're working with (large, lively rooms might benefit from controlled directivity speakers). Lotsa questons.

I think we would need to know a heck of a lot more about the room and your plans before offering any suggestions. And anything you get here would be a far cry from a professional consult (we have some pros here that do this).
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
Since I haven't received any responses I will assume that I am on my own. I am certain that someone has calculated or measured the reflection characteristics of a wall/plane and has determined a ratio of treated to untreated area in order to achieve the desired reflective reverb energy. I guess I will just take a guess and go from there. I was hoping to prevent multiple iterations of the placement of treatment on my ceiling. I don't want it to look like swiss cheese and cost more than necessary.
The answer is you have given us minimal data to help you.

I will say that most of this talk about treating rooms is "BOGUS"!

In general it is much more a speaker problem than a room problem. Now some rooms do need treatment, but the solution are empric and only trial an error will help you.

in my experience ambient rooms can still sound very good.

The speaker issue comes into to play when the off axis response does not closely mirror the on axis response except for a gentle smooth roll off at the top end.

Most of these problems arise because of drivers being driven into their break up range where they really start to beam. Tweeters can also be problematic. So if you have an ambient space then you need to select your speakers with extreme care.

In our former home these speakers were in a very ambient space, but sounded excellent.



In our new home they are not is a space with a discernible echo. But I am honestly uncertain as to where they sounded best.



I personally have never placed any so called "sound treatments" as such in any of my spaces. For one thing they often look awful and I don't think my wife would tolerate them for an instant.

However, I do use furnishings and and decor to my advantage. But none of my rooms have looked obviously "acoustically treated". I also use room dimensions when I had the luxury of a new build in our current home. So the main AV has optimal dimension ratios and a rear that is relatively dead by careful design, but there are no treatments as usually understood.
 
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everettT

everettT

Audioholic Spartan
Since I haven't received any responses I will assume that I am on my own. I am certain that someone has calculated or measured the reflection characteristics of a wall/plane and has determined a ratio of treated to untreated area in order to achieve the desired reflective reverb energy. I guess I will just take a guess and go from there. I was hoping to prevent multiple iterations of the placement of treatment on my ceiling. I don't want it to look like swiss cheese and cost more than necessary.
Sorry for the delayed response but as @ski2xblack and @TLS Guy mentioned we would need a little more info, and pictures would help. Taming an echo can be simple but that additional info is necessary. What type of flooring, rugs, furniture, window treatments, etc.?
 
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