HELP with amp for Paradigm Studio 100

[cfrizz]

Biamping with a receiver is a waste of time. You are still using the same inadequate power supply of the receiver so it's useless. Nothing beats the improvement that comes from separate power.

Get the cheapest receiver that you can that has preouts & all the other bells & whistles that you want it to have, then as more money becomes available get an amplifier of at least 200wpc.

This pretty much ensures that a distinct & better difference will be heard & you will know that your current & any future speakers you buy will have all the power they need to operate to their full potential.

If you have a HT setup then get a 5-7 channel amp so that you will be done with this particular upgrade once & for all.

Amps last a very long time, so don't be afraid to purchase a used one from Audiogon, this will allow you to get more bang for your buck. Some good brands to look at are: Rotel, Parasound, Sunfire Adcom, Outlaw, B & K.

I have Studio 60 v.5's biamped with a Onkyo TX-NR906 (140 wpc into 8 ohms) and they sound great to me. If the 100's require more power, it might not be so great as my 60's eat up the power of my receiver pretty good in my small room. I guess it depends how loud you want to play them. I don't know if you would be better with 200 watts per speaker from a power amp or having them biamped with a good receiver amp. The Emotiva XPA-3 looks like a good deal but if you can get away with a higher end receiver instead of lesser receiver and a amp, you get cool things like networking and hd radio and satellite radio capability.

 

[pongagt]

Biamping with a receiver is a waste of time. You are still using the same inadequate power supply of the receiver so it's useless. Nothing beats the improvement that comes from separate power.

Get the cheapest receiver that you can that has preouts & all the other bells & whistles that you want it to have, then as more money becomes available get an amplifier of at least 200wpc.

This pretty much ensures that a distinct & better difference will be heard & you will know that your current & any future speakers you buy will have all the power they need to operate to their full potential.

If you have a HT setup then get a 5-7 channel amp so that you will be done with this particular upgrade once & for all.

Amps last a very long time, so don't be afraid to purchase a used one from Audiogon, this will allow you to get more bang for your buck. Some good brands to look at are: Rotel, Parasound, Sunfire Adcom, Outlaw, B & K.

I already have a original Nelson Pass designed Adcom GFA555 on a 2 channel system that is set up alongside the surround system. I might get rid of that system and use the Adcom amp for the fronts and maybe a Outlaw Audio 2200 for the center channel. I wonder however if the amp in the Onkyo TX-NR906 is underestimated though. It is promoted to have 2 toroidal transformers for a high current power supply.

 

[PENG]

I already have a original Nelson Pass designed Adcom GFA555 on a 2 channel system that is set up alongside the surround system. I might get rid of that system and use the Adcom amp for the fronts and maybe a Outlaw Audio 2200 for the center channel. I wonder however if the amp in the Onkyo TX-NR906 is underestimated though. It is promoted to have 2 toroidal transformers for a high current power supply.

As Cathy said biamping with a receiver is a waste of time. As expected she recommended a 5 channel amp for a 5.1 system, but you seem to think that your 906 may be powerful enough. It probably is if it has to drive a couple of surround speakers only. Since you already have the GFA555 you can always try using it with an Outlaw 2200 first and then add a XPA-3 later if necessary.

 

[Lordoftherings]

I already have a original Nelson Pass designed Adcom GFA555 on a 2 channel system that is set up alongside the surround system. I might get rid of that system and use the Adcom amp for the fronts and maybe a Outlaw Audio 2200 for the center channel. I wonder however if the amp in the Onkyo TX-NR906 is underestimated though. It is promoted to have 2 toroidal transformers for a high current power supply.

The Onkyo TX-NR906 has ONE toroidal transformer (not two).
In addition, it has two additional smaller E core transformers (located on top of each box that covers the fans. These are for 1. the front panel display exclusively and 2. for the digital video section in the rear.

* Just do like you said, use your other power amps to power the three front speakers, the 906 would even probably be sufficient for all your speakers, but for only powering the four surrounds, it would do no sweat.
-> Just give your Studio 100s a good dose of power adrenaline, that's all.

"Nelson Pass designed", nice. And Oulaw Audio 2200, again very nice.

*** Man, you are already all set.

 

[pongagt]

I'm going to use the Onkyo amp for my Polk CS2 center channel and Paradigm Phantom surrounds until i find a used Paradigm CC-570 or CC-590 center at a good price. I want to make sure the center amp is good for music because i watch mostly concerts rather then movies. I don't know how musical the Outlaw Audio is because there is not many opinions out there on them.

 

[Lordoftherings]

I'm going to use the Onkyo amp for my Polk CS2 center channel and Paradigm Phantom surrounds until i find a used Paradigm CC-570 or CC-590 center at a good price. I want to make sure the center amp is good for music because i watch mostly concerts rather then movies. I don't know how musical the Outlaw Audio is because there is not many opinions out there on them.

I also listen to a lot of music concerts on Blu-ray (I'm a huge fan of those).
I have the Onkyo TX-SR876 (great with those) and I also have a Paradigm center speaker (the older CC-300) and used the Paradigm Titan as my main (A) side surrounds, and Paradigm Atom as my rear surrounds.
Everything is just sweet and marvelous.

Your Outlaw Audio amp is a great amp, it will sound very good (as in musical) with your system, for a fact.

And a Paradigm CC-570 or CC-590 center speaker would be a very nice upgrade.

* I must have over 50 Blu-ray only Music Concerts, and over 300 DVD Music Concerts. I also love multichannel SACD and DVD-Audio. So, a good center speaker with clear and articulate voicing is of prime importance for me too.
And I even run my Paradigm CC-300 center speaker Full Range for these occasions (useable bass down to 25hz).

Cheers,
Bob

 

[Seth=L]

I saw that you where looking at the RX-V2700. Is the RX-V2700 new in box? If so it's not a bad deal at all. It's a fair market price and it's a great preamp. It's got more grunt than the Onkyo you have now and will certainly get you by until you get an external amplifier. If you aren't going to be listening to the speakers at insane levels of output you will definitely be fine until you get some more power going to them.

The Onkyos that LOTRs suggested are good for power and features as well. They are certainly more powerful than the Yamaha RX-V2700 but they have their dissadvantages too, they run very hot for receivers. This is just a characteristic of the design, which is unfortunately not very efficient. When you put THX Ultra power into a package thats selling for the prices they sell for, you are paying for that cost elsewhere. Don't get me wrong though, they are great for the money and they are very powerful receivers for the price paid.

 

[Lordoftherings]

Some simple facts.

^ Well about some receivers from Denon with THX Ultra2, like the AVR-4806 at the same weight than the Onkyo TX-SR805 receiver?

The bench tests are about exactly the same, with a small edge going to the Onkyo.
(All figures into 8 ohms.)

#1. Onkyo TX-SR805 -> 50.9 lbs / List price: $1,099 / 7 channels = 152 watts (1% THD) /
7 channels = 120 watts (0.1% THD) / 2 channels = 212 watts (1% THD) /
2 channels = 182 watts (0.10% THD).

#2. Denon AVR-4806 -> 50.8 lbs / List price: $3,500 / 7 channels = 114 watts (0.06% THD) /
2 channels = 182 watts (0.14% THD).

*** Check the difference in price (MSRP): $2,401 more for the AVR-4806 receiver!!!

I got others comparisons like this between the Onkyo TX-SR875 and the newer Denon AVR-4308ci, and again the Onkyo beats the Denon in power output into 8 and 4 ohms across the board. And the Denon AVR-4308ci is exactly $1,000 more (MSRP) than the Onkyo TX-SR875. Plus that Denon model is 10 lbs lighter.

Plus, the street prices on the Onkyos are much better than the Denons.

So, for me, this speak large volume. And forget about the SN Ratio, or DSPs, or Dacs, or whatever else, even not considering the HQV Reon from the Onkyo; Onkyo is the big new leader in my book, running hot or not.
And I don't really care if the Denons run cooler.
At $400, the Onkyo TX-SR805 is the champ of overall performance + value, by quite a large margin too.
The Denons (any Denons) don't even compete at that price.
Same for all Onkyos higher than the 805 (the 875, 876, 905 & 906).
Heck, the Denon AVR-3808ci is selling at $1,000 street price.
The Onkyo TX-SR876 (a much much better receiver) is selling for $100 less!

Ummm... What we say?

 

[Lordoftherings]

And the Yamaha RX-V2700 for $799.99 right now, for using as a pre/pro is $100 more than the Onkyo Pro PR-SC885P pre/pro!

Oups!

 

[pongagt]

I also listen to a lot of music concerts on Blu-ray (I'm a huge fan of those).
I have the Onkyo TX-SR876 (great with those) and I also have a Paradigm center speaker (the older CC-300) and used the Paradigm Titan as my main (A) side surrounds, and Paradigm Atom as my rear surrounds.
Everything is just sweet and marvelous.

Your Outlaw Audio amp is a great amp, it will sound very good (as in musical) with your system, for a fact.

And a Paradigm CC-570 or CC-590 center speaker would be a very nice upgrade.

* I must have over 50 Blu-ray only Music Concerts, and over 300 DVD Music Concerts. I also love multichannel SACD and DVD-Audio. So, a good center speaker with clear and articulate voicing is of prime importance for me too.
And I even run my Paradigm CC-300 center speaker Full Range for these occasions (useable bass down to 25hz).

Cheers,
Bob

I have about 200 concerts but no bluray or sacd capabilities. I will buy a ps3 if the price comes down next month. My Paradigm dealer wanted $1000 for a CC-590 v.5. I have seen used v.4's for around $500 so there is no way i will pay $1000 for a v.5 center speaker.

 

[cfrizz]

An Outlaw monoblock will really kick it up a knotch for your center channel. It certainly did for mine when I had one running my Boston VR920.

Use it, you'll see.

 

[Lordoftherings]

I have about 200 concerts but no bluray or sacd capabilities. I will buy a ps3 if the price comes down next month. My Paradigm dealer wanted $1000 for a CC-590 v.5. I have seen used v.4's for around $500 so there is no way i will pay $1000 for a v.5 center speaker.

I can see now why you are a music concert lover as much as I am.

WoW! That's a lot of dough for that CC-590. I would check prices around.
Yes, $500-$600 is more like it.

*** By the way, Blu-ray music concerts and multichannel SACDs are the two very best mediums. The Sound is soooo goooood.

 

[pongagt]

I do love concerts and i have a pretty diverse collection of them. It is pretty rare that i can sit through a whole movie.

My $400 Onkyo DX-7555 won't play sacd's but i am just learning that i will be able to play all sacd's with a PS3 through the hdmi input of my receiver. I guess you need the bandwidth of hdmi for the multichannel ones to work although the other types will work with a optical output. I can't wait to watch some Blu-ray concerts, especially the Hall and Oates one. I watch some HD concerts now on Palladia and they are awesome.

I'm watching audiogon for a CC-590 v.4. There was one for $450 from someone with no feedback but they said they got a offer already. I told him i would buy it through escrow.com if the sale falls through. My Polk CS2 is not worthy of a separate amp but the Paradigm should definitely be.

 

[Lordoftherings]

Not all PS3 will allow you to play SACDs through their HDMI output.
Only a few models will. Make sure the one you choose, does.

 

[pongagt]

Not all PS3 will allow you to play SACDs through their HDMI output.
Only a few models will. Make sure the one you choose, does.

This is true. Here is a website on the subject.
http://www.ps3sacd.com/

 

[Lordoftherings]

Ty

This is true. Here is a website on the subject.
http://www.ps3sacd.com/

Thanks, that's nice of you to provide a link, which might help also other people in the same situation than yours.
As for me, I already have 3 Blu-ray players, and I'm trying to get a fourth one, the Oppo BDP-83.
No PS3 for me. Sony is my poison, just like Monster Cables. It's just the natural course of reality. I got no antidote.
But I respect other decisions.

Cheers,

Bob