Headphones have spoiled me!

Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
Headphones have spoiled me!

I bought a pair of Headphones some time ago because they where cheap and had the noise canceling feature that every headphone manufacturer seemed to have at least one set of. I thought I would give noise canceling a shot (I realize that cheap headphones with noise canceling are not likely to compete with higher cost noise canceling headphones). I put two AAA batteries in the in line plastic noise canceling electronic's box and turned them on with a portable CD player. At this time I was only critiquing the set for noise canceling ability, and they didn't do much aside from +6dB and alter the natural sound of the headphones in a fashion I found to be quite unfavorable, so I put them away and forgot about them.

Well about a week ago I was rummaging through things, probably looking for some other thing that I had purchased and decided it wasn't worth using and "forgot" about it, and I found these, the Maxell HP.NC.III headphones. I thought, "You know Seth, you never gave these a critical listen." So I decided to give them one more shot and I was immediately dumbfounded as to how these Maxell headphones sounded better (with the NC feature off) than my Sony's or Koss headphones, and not just a little better, worlds better.

I was listening to Cranberries "Faithfully Departed" CD, the last track "Bosnia" on the Maxells in the bedroom and decided to listen to them on my main system in the living room because I hadn't listened to that CD for some time, or at all with my present setup.

It was a major let down, let me tell you. The highs where harsh and the detail I was getting on the headphones was completely lost. This is largely due to the poor acoustics of the room, or rather horrible acoustics. Since I have not gotten around to researching acoustics or setting a budget to treat the room it makes perfect sense why it would sound so wrong. Certain parts of the bass where boomy or lacking, the only advantages to that system is it can go louder and I don't have anything on my head hindering my movement (not that the Maxells are unconfortable, they are actually quite well designed and constructed).

I think it is pretty sad when a pair of $20 cans sound so much better than my much more expensive full scale sound system. So now that I am spoiled on the headphones I want better speakers and acoustical treatments, and virtually no money. After a few months I could do acoustic treatments, but speakers are far into the future for me.

I feel happy that I am getting better sound, but also feel a little ashamed of my expensive rig, well expensive to me, that sounds pale in comparison.:eek:
 
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mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
Now listen to the same song on these



or these



or these

 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
Now listen to the same song on these
I don't want to, they will ruin me for sure.

adam said:
Alright, Patrick. Where is Seth=L, and what have you done with him?!?

I did wrap them in ERS paper, the soundstage was 34.7 kilometers wide.

I am being serious about the SQ though, it really is better on the Maxells.:)
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
I don't really like listening to headphones and only do it when I have to. Like you, though, I am surprised at how little price and sound quality have to do with each other in headphones. The best sounding ones I have are mid priced Grado. I think they were about $80 or maybe the model number is 80. I forgot. At any rate, they were inexpensive and are truly amazing.
 
Wafflesomd

Wafflesomd

Senior Audioholic
The above headphones suck.

You just chose the highest models from those venders...

AKG 501's. Best ever.
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
The above headphones suck.

You just chose the highest models from those venders...

AKG 501's. Best ever.
Please excuse my ignorance, but are you serious? Do the ones listed not present a good sound for the money? As you might have guess headphones are not my forte.;)
 
obscbyclouds

obscbyclouds

Senior Audioholic
Are those AKG 501's significantly better than the AKG 701's that Mazer posted? If so, why?
 
Haoleb

Haoleb

Audioholic Field Marshall
If you havent yet give some open type headphones a listen. I have the grado sr125 and the sennheiser hd280's and both have their strengths. The grados have a more natural open sound but lack comfort after an hour or so and have zero isolation from the outside world. The Sennheisers on the other hand have excellent noise isolation, up to 32db IIRC which is more than even alot of noise cancelling phones provide. They dont sound quite as natural as the grado's but you can hear even the slightest nuances and they are quite comfortable.
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
If you havent yet give some open type headphones a listen. I have the grado sr125 and the sennheiser hd280's and both have their strengths. The grados have a more natural open sound but lack comfort after an hour or so and have zero isolation from the outside world. The Sennheisers on the other hand have excellent noise isolation, up to 32db IIRC which is more than even alot of noise cancelling phones provide. They dont sound quite as natural as the grado's but you can hear even the slightest nuances and they are quite comfortable.
I used to use open air headphones, but now I can't stand them next to closed ones. I also hate ear buds, I don't understand how anyone can like those.
 
WmAx

WmAx

Audioholic Samurai
It will be difficult to achieve the same clarity on a loudspeaker system as compared to high quality headphones. However, it is possible.

Seth, If you are interested in my opinion on specific headphones, I have tried the vast majority of high end headphones, with as accurate as possible reference(always to a stable headphone reference with the same tracks over many years, level matched as close as possible, and I regularly attend non-amplified acoustic performances to listen with eyes closed to keep a somewhat good idea of what unamplified music should sound like). My opinions are based strictly on perception of realistic sound, however. I reference carefully with tracks consisting only of high quality far field miced recordings of acoustic instrument performances and vocals miced in the same way. I can only provide limited opinions/impressions on synthetic and studio produced music over these same headphones, however. I will reply if you so request.

-Chris
 
mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
Here comes the "Can of Worms Flame War". :eek:

"Unlike speakers" where two equal cost, equal quality amps will have a very small to no difference in sound quality. A headphone amp can change the sound quality of headphones. Two different (equal cost, equal quality amps) will have different sound characteristics.
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
It will be difficult to achieve the same clarity on a loudspeaker system as compared to high quality headphones. However, it is possible.

Seth, If you are interested in my opinion on specific headphones, I have tried the vast majority of high end headphones, with as accurate as possible reference(always to a stable headphone reference with the same tracks over many years, level matched as close as possible, and I regularly attend non-amplified acoustic performances to listen with eyes closed to keep a somewhat good idea of what unamplified music should sound like). My opinions are based strictly on perception of realistic sound, however. I reference carefully with tracks consisting only of high quality far field miced recordings of acoustic instrument performances and vocals miced in the same way. I can only provide limited opinions/impressions on synthetic and studio produced music over these same headphones, however. I will reply if you so request.

-Chris
Sorry, I seem to have some difficulty understanding what you are saying. Are you saying that headphones don't adequately represent a realistic sound space?
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
Here comes the "Can of Worms Flame War". :eek:

"Unlike speakers" where two equal cost, equal quality amps will have a very small to no difference in sound quality. A headphone amp can change the sound quality of headphones. Two different (equal cost, equal quality amps) will have different sound characteristics.
Wait, what? I am so confused by this post.:confused:
 
WmAx

WmAx

Audioholic Samurai
Here comes the "Can of Worms Flame War". :eek:

"Unlike speakers" where two equal cost, equal quality amps will have a very small to no difference in sound quality. A headphone amp can change the sound quality of headphones. Two different (equal cost, equal quality amps) will have different sound characteristics.
It's simple to convince me that your statement is true. Just mention comparing a crossfeed enabled amplifier with a straight amplifier. Crossfeed filter will, of course, cause a substantial audible difference between units. Another way to have real audible differences is by built in non linear functions to cause coloration(s), or by comparing amplifiers with drastically different output impedance.

Any headphone amplifier designed to operate in a linear, low noise fashion, will sound identical to one another in a bias free(blinded, level matched) listening comparison, given that they have a similar output impedance and are both operated below the point where they begin to clip. This is the only conclusion that can be ascertained, based on credible perceptual research as it relates to the actual performance parameters.(and other simplistic devices such as loudspeaker amplifiers or pre-amplifiers).

One can cheaply obtain linear headphone amplifiers that do not cause audible coloration(s) for well under $100.00. Given a headphone with sufficient sensitivity and impedance, many portable sources can transparently amplify.

-Chris
 
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WmAx

WmAx

Audioholic Samurai
Sorry, I seem to have some difficulty understanding what you are saying. Are you saying that headphones don't adequately represent a realistic sound space?
Well, that is true (unless one uses special bin-aural recordings, or a special DSP processor on normal recordings). But that is not what I meant. I meant to lay out my particular experience settings of how I have compared headphones. I was offering to give my opinions of specific different headphone models that you may want to know about, if you so desired. Just be specific concerning what you want to know about.

-Chris
 
mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
It's simple to convince me that your statement is true. Just mention comparing a crossfeed enabled amplifier with a straight amplifier. Crossfeed filter will, of course, cause a substantial audible difference between units. Another way to have real audible differences is by built in non linear functions to cause coloration(s), or by comparing amplifiers with drastically different output impedance.

Any headphone amplifier designed to operate in a linear, low noise fashion, will sound identical to one another in a bias free(blinded, level matched) listening comparison, given that they have a similar output impedance and are both operated below the point where they begin to clip. This is the only conclusion that can be ascertained, based on credible perceptual research as it relates to the actual performance parameters.(and other simplistic devices such as loudspeaker amplifiers or pre-amplifiers).

One can cheaply obtain linear headphone amplifiers that do not cause audible coloration(s) for well under $100.00. Given a headphone with sufficient sensitivity and impedance, many portable sources can transparently amplify.

-Chris
What I am saying is with the same pair of headphones, using this headphone amp

Headamp GS-1 Headphone

http://www.headamp.com/home_amps/gs1/index.htm





Will sound different then using this amp

Emmeline HR-2 Headphone Amp

http://www.raysamuelsaudio.com/products/hr-2

 
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