Head to Head Review: Ascend Acoustics CBM-170 SE vs Wharfedale Diamond 10.1

[anamorphic96]

Considering the speakers are positioned in a compromised fashion just sitting on the desk. I'm gonna take the review with a grain of salt.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I wasn't aware of the E41s. It looks like they aren't being made anymore.

Not E41-B, just E41. The difference is woofer material. E41-B was beryllium, while E41 is aluminium.
EMP Tek E41 Bookshelf Speaker

E41-B is discontinued, while E41 is still in production afaik
I could add them to card and see the price at everything

 

[2ndammendment]

Considering the speakers are positioned in a compromised fashion just sitting on the desk. I'm gonna take the review with a grain of salt.

I would take every review with a grain of salt.

 

[shadyJ]

Considering the speakers are positioned in a compromised fashion just sitting on the desk. I'm gonna take the review with a grain of salt.

+1 this. Every bookshelf speaker or monitor I have heard just resting on a desktop was subject to a peak from a first reflection from the desktop. Instead of solving that peak with EQing, a better solution would be to raise the speaker off the desktop and turn the speaker upside down so the tweeter is closer to ear level. The further the speaker is from nearby surfaces, the better it should sound. Do an image search for just about any studio monitor setup at their mixing consoles to see what I mean.

 

[2ndammendment]

+1 this. Every bookshelf speaker or monitor I have heard just resting on a desktop was subject to a peak from a first reflection from the desktop. Instead of solving that peak with EQing, a better solution would be to raise the speaker off the desktop and turn the speaker upside down so the tweeter is closer to ear level. The further the speaker is from nearby surfaces, the better it should sound. Do an image search for just about any studio monitor setup at their mixing consoles to see what I mean.

I see what your talking about. I know my placement isn't ideal, I've done the best I can for now. This is a temporary location for these speakers and hopefully I'll have access to a better room and desk in the future. In the context of my review - from what I understand the primary issue with secondary reflections is messing up the stereo image. While that's important it's going to mess things up equally for both speakers, and this is a comparison after all. The other issue I know of is comb filtering. I'm not sure If that's happening but if it was I figure it would happen to both speakers equally no? It sounds like my review agrees with what others have heard. The Ascends are great speakers and have the attributes I mentioned. The Wharfedale are also great but have what seems like a subdued mid-high range(as others have mentioned). Since my findings agree with what others have heard I think my review is valid and my results would be the same even if I changed the listening environment. I'm not claiming to have the perfect setup needed to review these speakers and make them sound at their best. I'm just putting out there what my findings are in my application.

 

[ImcLoud]

I don't think there is anything wrong with his review, sure placement is not ideal but the more important fact is that it is where his speakers are going. I want to know what it sounds like where I am putting it.... Sure I will move them 5 inches left or right or an extra few inches from the wall ect.. but I'm not redesigning my house to conform with where my speakers sound best, nor am I putting egg crates on my ceiling, and so on...

All reviews are what that person thinks when it comes to likes and dislikes, what sounds bright to me might be exactly what you want, they are a baseline to pay attention to when making your own decision...

Shady, you would seriously turn a speaker upside down? I guess it would be fine for a few models but some b&w, my evo2's, and a few others would have a hard time with that... I never tried it lol, most speakers have some sort of feet on the bottoms be it rubber rings, spikes, ect. It would look pretty silly with them sticking up, lol...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

If your explanation is correct, then I've been misunderstanding "bright" and "fatiguing" for years now! I've long understood those terms to describe a loudspeaker's performance which refers to how it reproduces its highest frequencies. I've also understood it to be synonymous with "sibilant" - a characteristic of its fr curve. In other words, a bright speaker (like a classic horn, for example) produces sound that is emphasized in the highest frequencies, as opposed to a "smooth" speaker, which drops off at the high end.

ADTG, what you're describing with regard to the sounds' position relative to the front of the monitor, sounds more like imaging and soundstage characteristics, not sibilance or brightness. Am I misreading or misunderstanding you here?

I think "forward", "in-your-face", "bright", "aggressive" tend to go hand-in-hand.

But these are just subjective descriptions, not exactly accurate.

 

[j_garcia]

I see what your talking about. I know my placement isn't ideal, I've done the best I can for now. This is a temporary location for these speakers and hopefully I'll have access to a better room and desk in the future. In the context of my review - from what I understand the primary issue with secondary reflections is messing up the stereo image. While that's important it's going to mess things up equally for both speakers, and this is a comparison after all. The other issue I know of is comb filtering. I'm not sure If that's happening but if it was I figure it would happen to both speakers equally no? It sounds like my review agrees with what others have heard. The Ascends are great speakers and have the attributes I mentioned. The Wharfedale are also great but have what seems like a subdued mid-high range(as others have mentioned). Since my findings agree with what others have heard I think my review is valid and my results would be the same even if I changed the listening environment. I'm not claiming to have the perfect setup needed to review these speakers and make them sound at their best. I'm just putting out there what my findings are in my application.

Just angling them up a bit will help with the first reflection issues, but the reality is, in a near field situation it will be a bit less of an issue. I was going to make that comment myself, that angling them up or raising them up might give you some minor benefits, but all one can generally expect to do really is minimize the effects of the first reflection at the listening position, not eliminate it.

 

[shadyJ]

Shady, you would seriously turn a speaker upside down? I guess it would be fine for a few models but some b&w, my evo2's, and a few others would have a hard time with that... I never tried it lol, most speakers have some sort of feet on the bottoms be it rubber rings, spikes, ect. It would look pretty silly with them sticking up, lol...

I would't use a speaker upside down if it was an eyesore. All the bookshelf speakers and monitors I have do not have feet. It won't affect the sound as long as the tweeters remain at the same height, unless your speaker had a very strange design.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

The end goal should be tweeter height at ear level, if this is achieved by flipping speaker vertically it shouldn't affect the sound, but would look weird imo

 

[zieglj01]

Some speakers already come with the tweeter on the bottom
DCM TFE60 - use to sell on line for $249 ea - now on close-out for $154 ea

 

[cschang]

Off topic: The recessed baffle on those DCM's isn't acoustically very smart.

Just sayin'...

 

[cschang]

The end goal should be tweeter height at ear level, if this is achieved by flipping speaker vertically it shouldn't affect the sound, but would look weird imo

Unless the grille was on.

When I had CBM-170SE as surrounds...I mounted them upside down to get the tweeter at a better level and away from the ceiling.

 

[zieglj01]

Off topic: The recessed baffle on those DCM's isn't acoustically very smart.
Just sayin'...

DCM TFE (time frame evolution)
dcm tfe 200

 

[zieglj01]

The Boston E60 speaker was made to be placed vertical-up or
vertical-down >> they have placement stands on top and the
bottom of cabinet, that can be turned in or out. The grill logo
can also be turned > plus they can be used horinzontal.

 

[cschang]

DCM TFE (time frame evolution)
dcm tfe 200

Not as big as of an issue with the floor stand and where the tweeter is placed.

 

[zieglj01]

Not as big as of an issue with the floor stand and where the tweeter is placed.

The bookshelf also has a nice review - however, life goes on.

 

[theJman]

I like laid back, neutral, speakers with defined highs, smooth mids, and undistorted bass. So the highs should be crisp and separated {soft domes are nice for this but ribbon, planar are growing on me}, the mids should be sultry and smooth {seems to be better with a 2 way design vs a midrange and tweet}, and the lows should just be accurate, play how they sound in real life, no mechanical sound, no extra vibration, ect... {A subwoofer will do this best for me}....

You should try the other speakers David Fabrikant was involved in; the Wave Crest Audio HVL-1. You pretty much described them to a T right there. They may even be better for surrounds than the Fluance, assuming monopole would work for you of course.

Curtis (cschang) probably knows a thing or two about them as well...

 

[ichigo]

The end goal should be tweeter height at ear level, if this is achieved by flipping speaker vertically it shouldn't affect the sound, but would look weird imo

Shouldn't it be ear level between tweeter and woofer?

 

[ImcLoud]

You should try the other speakers David Fabrikant was involved in; the Wave Crest Audio HVL-1. You pretty much described them to a T right there. They may even be better for surrounds than the Fluance, assuming monopole would work for you of course.

Curtis (cschang) probably knows a thing or two about them as well...

I am familiar with the wave crest speakers, still not giving them away at $230 a pair... I think I would rather have the 200se's, oh yeah, I do have a couple sets, lol...