Good 8 inch subwoofers?

[synapsis]

Hey guys, im on my third build now, after completing my two infinity 12.1 perfects for the home theatre, its now on to the computer speakers. Im currently running two energy C-200's for stereo sound. Im now thinking about adding a subwoofer, but i would like to keep the size as small as possible.

Im not looking to get extreme SPL out of the unit, but i would like some extension down to 20Hz or so (i know thats asking alot with an 8 inch driver, but just throw out some ideas, i really have no idea what is good in terms of small subwoofers).

If a 10 inch can be built into a shallow \ small sealed operation, i would also consider that as well.

Thanks alot, you are always a great help!

 

[mike c]

Jl 8w7 :d

-0-

 

[TLS Guy]

Jl 8w7 :d

-0-

Here is the vented alignment for that woofer. It makes an impressive sub!

 

[synapsis]

Hmmm, well ive been looking at it, and i dont see why i should limit myself to a 8 inch driver. I can get away with using a 10 incher for sure. I just dont want too big of a box, im thinking something along the lines of 18x12x12 interior (so what, 1.5 cuft?). I will probably end up doing a ported enclosure so that i can tune that freq nice and low (i dont have another BFD to use on this sub ).

Got any ideas for a (cost effective ), 10 inch driver that doesnt require a huge box and will have good low end? im thinking of putting about 300W plate amp for power.

That JL 8 looks ridiculous, i might as well mount a 10inch at that point!
(id like to get another kappa perfect, but i cant find the 10.1 anywhere, i dont want to spend the extra on the D VQS).

Thanks

 

[mike c]

JL 10W7 lol

 

[synapsis]

Yea, that's a little overkill, im thinking smaller woofer, i dont need to knock my teeth out while im sitting at my PC, i just want something that'll give me some nice low end, doesnt need to be anything that crazy... lol

 

[mike c]

max budget?

 

[synapsis]

Well, i just found a guy on ebay who lives in my town selling infinity 1030W's for 40$ a piece, so im going to attempt to pick up one of those... if not a few, who knows what i'll end up doing with them.

He's also got some 1230W's so i might dabble into those as well

Here's the box im looking at right now...

 

[WmAx]

I just hope you don't expect those drivers to come remotely close to Kappa Perfects....

-Chris

 

[synapsis]

They seem to model quite closely, but either way, this sub will be for my computer setup. Pure stereo, my HT is where the subs really count.

But why do yo usay that these subs wouldn't compare? BassBox pro seems to think they are pretty close, what would be the biggest difference?

Im thinking of putting two 10's in one tall cabinet (something around the size of 36x18x18 exterior), with a slot port at the bottom (1"x17"x36"). Seems to model very well with only 250W.

Anyways let me know, i can post what ive got in bassbox.

 

[Sheep]

They seem to model quite closely, but either way, this sub will be for my computer setup. Pure stereo, my HT is where the subs really count.

But why do yo usay that these subs wouldn't compare? BassBox pro seems to think they are pretty close, what would be the biggest difference?

Im thinking of putting two 10's in one tall cabinet (something around the size of 36x18x18 exterior), with a slot port at the bottom (1"x17"x36"). Seems to model very well with only 250W.

Anyways let me know, i can post what ive got in bassbox.

The Kappa's have less power compression that you can't see in Bassbox pro. They also have superior output when installed in a proper slot ported enclosure.

SheepStar

 

[MidnightSensi]

Also try Image Dynamic. They make a really nice subwoofer driver for the money.

 

[synapsis]

Here is what i think ive finally come up with. A nice size box that isnt too big at all, but uses a bit of height to get some decent volume for lower freqs to jump up.

it comes up with 104db at 20Hz, but then it drops off pretty fast after that.

Then again, it doesn't even come close to my 12.1 perfect , but i wasn't really trying to get something that would !

**note that the box on my 12.1 perfects isnt right in there, it just re-made my box at the specified volume. They are actually 27(l)x18(w)x24(h)

 

[WmAx]

They seem to model quite closely, but either way, this sub will be for my computer setup. Pure stereo, my HT is where the subs really count.

But why do yo usay that these subs wouldn't compare? BassBox pro seems to think they are pretty close, what would be the biggest difference?

Im thinking of putting two 10's in one tall cabinet (something around the size of 36x18x18 exterior), with a slot port at the bottom (1"x17"x36"). Seems to model very well with only 250W.

Anyways let me know, i can post what ive got in bassbox.

Sorry, but you mis-understand what a box modeler can actualy do/predict.

The bass modeling program works on an assumption that a driver has a linear motor and suspension and no power compression throughout it's rated x-max and power rating. Nothing could be further from the truth! The vast majority of drivers, and I can practically guarantee you those Infinities you linked are included, have substantially different performance at mid to higher power input of the rated level! Typically, the driver BL(motor force) changes radically on woofers as they exceed just 25 percent of their rated x-max! And they quickly enter suspension(spyder and surround) non-linearities also. This is the just the result of a speaker designed at a very low price point. The lowest price speaker of which I know actually is nearly identical in characteristics at full rated power and xmax as low power/xmax, is the Kappa Perfect x.1 and Perfect VQ models. The JL W6v2 has at least as good performance a the Kappa Perfects, though it costs a little bit more. The bottom line is that lower model Infinity will not sound anything like the Kappa Perfect at high power - sorry. Now, if you keep it low power, it will sound identical if you get the same frequency response from both side by side, and only IF you get it identical. You can even get drivers with massive motors(looks impressive, eh?) that break up in SQ at moderate SPL, but can get really high max SPL. This is actally the most typical woofer design - since most people only care about loud and not sound quality. That Kappa Perfect is a rare type of woofer that can get to a moderately high SPL and keep all of it's sound quality in the process. As soon as you get to moderate SPL level, the lesser quality driver is going to fall apart sound quality wise.

-Chris

 

[synapsis]

Chris,

I could not agree with you more, i listened to a set of the 1030's, and they werent even close to what my setup is at home with the perfects. It just so happens that the guy that i was gong to buy the 1030's off of, also had a set of two 12.1 perfects!! Now, how "perfect" is that. So now im working on making a new set of subs, so i will have 4 12.1 prefects running in my system.

Ah sweet bass, i can't wait to have all 4 of those badboys pumping out some sub 20Hz bass!

I dont understand why people would want to put these in a vented enclosure, when you put some EQ and power to them in sealed box, the linearity is unreal! Right down to like 15hz!

For spending a total of about 750$ (minus the ep2500), i couldn't have asked for more out of these subs! Best damn speakers on the market for the price!

 

[WmAx]

Chris,

I could not agree with you more, i listened to a set of the 1030's, and they werent even close to what my setup is at home with the perfects. It just so happens that the guy that i was gong to buy the 1030's off of, also had a set of two 12.1 perfects!! Now, how "perfect" is that. So now im working on making a new set of subs, so i will have 4 12.1 prefects running in my system.

Ah sweet bass, i can't wait to have all 4 of those badboys pumping out some sub 20Hz bass!

I dont understand why people would want to put these in a vented enclosure, when you put some EQ and power to them in sealed box, the linearity is unreal! Right down to like 15hz!

For spending a total of about 750$ (minus the ep2500), i couldn't have asked for more out of these subs! Best damn speakers on the market for the price!

I'm glad you got to experience what I talked about; that similar T&S parameters do not mean the speakes have any real similarity in real use! Very few speakers have a linear motor and suspension at these extremes. The Kappa Perfects are one of the rare units that do. Most speakers even at moderate SPL, sound complete different, and not for the better! The Kappa Perfect even at it's specified maximum power and excursion limits sound almost precisely the same as it does at low power.

As for a sealed enclosures, it's a massive waste of the capability of the drivers to use them in a sealed system.

A properly engineered ported enclosure will trump the sealed enclosure in distortion, acoustic output power(BY A VAST DEGREE), and will at very minimum match the SQ of the sealed system. Now, if you do not need or want more LF output power, then the sealed system will be fine. Just know that it can never come close to the ported system in performance limits under about 35 Hz.

-Chris

 

[Hipnotic4]

8in w7 is an unbelievable sub..

Kicker L7 8in. also a good sub..check Digital Design/Audio Que and TC sounds too..

 

[gus6464]

Here is what i think ive finally come up with. A nice size box that isnt too big at all, but uses a bit of height to get some decent volume for lower freqs to jump up.

it comes up with 104db at 20Hz, but then it drops off pretty fast after that.

Then again, it doesn't even come close to my 12.1 perfect , but i wasn't really trying to get something that would !

**note that the box on my 12.1 perfects isnt right in there, it just re-made my box at the specified volume. They are actually 27(l)x18(w)x24(h)

Yowza! 2in front with 1in sides plus bracing is going to make one heavy *** sub. You going to use 1in MDF or something else?

 

[Exit]

I think you already ruled out an 8" subwoofer but just for the record I have a Cambridge Soundworks 8" sub that goes down to 20 Hz. What I never realized was for an 8" to play that low, you have to keep the volume nearly off or the cone bottoms out on any deep bass. Totally worthless purchase.

 

[WmAx]

8in w7 is an unbelievable sub..

Kicker L7 8in. also a good sub..check Digital Design/Audio Que and TC sounds too..

The Kicker, though, is simply loud. They have rather poor motors for SQ applications. Even then, it is doubtful it could match the W7 8" in SPL either.

TC had a superb 8" sub that was probably very close to the W7 8". But not anymore. TC is dead, and the 8" sub that was once available is sold out from it's source. I do not know if the TC actually matched the W7 motor, as the TC 8" at subject appears to have used one of the TC's lower end motor designs, though even that is still a superior motor to most in existence. Based on 3rd party tests of distortion vs. SPL in sealed cabinets, it appears that a W7 is slightly superior to a TC2000 series motor. I'm pretty sure the TC 8" sub at issue here did not use any better than a TC2000 motor. However, a TC3000 motor would probably be dead equal to, or superior, to a W7 motor.

I have yet to find an 8" unit that is currently made that matches the JL 8" W7 device.

-Chris