French pass law to reduce junk products coming to market

[TLS Guy]

France wants to cut down on built in obsolescence.

The salient features are: -

Manufacturers must disclose expected life span of unit.

Manufacturers must disclose length of time spares will be available.

Mandatory two year warranty.

I would be very interested in members opinions on this legislation.

Whilst I am very much in favor of junk reduction, as do see problems for electronics manufacturers in particular.

For electronic devices, the hardest thing to know is how long it will last. Peter Walker if Quad used to say it was next to impossible. So the best you can do is to try to design for the best reliability possible.

When it comes to chip sets, they are generally only made once, and when they are gone they are gone. So it is very difficult to know how long any given device will be available.

I think this legislation will lead to significant increase in purchase prices.

 

[Irvrobinson]

Following France has always been an economically dumb idea.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

but accepting gifts from France is a OK? lets say for example - large statues...

Something US could learn from UK - is decoupling last mile from ISPs - this measure alone lead to significant growth in competition and as result quality and value of internet service for customers.

 

[Swerd]

On first glance, France's idea seems overdue, but probably too late.

But I'm reminded that France continues to require speaking French instead of other languages, especially English. They hate franglicized terms like l'drugstore, so if you wanted to say "double click on the icon", I doubt if "double-cliquez sur l' icône" would be considered pure enough to pass muster.

And, I'm also reminded that the French continue to believe Jerry Lewis is a comic genius.

 

[highfigh]

This flies in the face of any desire for creative advancement of design for products. When innovation is stifled or generally stagnant, products don't become obsolete- look at tube gear, as an example. It has been over 100 years since the first tubes were made to operate in consumer products and they still work very well for some applications. As electronics become faster/smaller/more efficient/more advanced, their life span becomes shorter. Also, when an industry gropes to increase sales volume and make people pay attention to it, 'The Next Best Thing' becomes more a matter of sparkle than substance. 3d is a great example of this- it died at almost the same time it was introduced, although I guess the display screens made for 3d shortened the time to move from 2K to 4K. Maybe. Manufacturers of TVs don't make the to be repaired, they're made to be replaced and when the warranty is only one year, it means that >1% of all TVs sold will be in land fills and recycling centers in less than a year. Look at CD and DVD players- they're almost obsolete for most people and when a new BD player can be purchased for less than $100, there's no good reason to repair it, especially when the manufacturer doesn't make parts available for this.

Manufacturers are now required to make electronic goods that conform to Energy Star ratings in an attempt to save energy, yet they haven't done anything about the amount of material that has to be recycled or scrapped.

Good thing many of these devices are more air than parts.

 

[3db]

Yeah.. I would like this .... It would make things more expensive to buy but it would also spin off a repair industry as well, limit the amount of waste going into landfills or floating in our oceans.

 

[highfigh]

Yeah.. I would like this .... It would make things more expensive to buy but it would also spin off a repair industry as well, limit the amount of waste going into landfills or floating in our oceans.

We had a repair industry- the bean counters at the manufacturers decided that it was better to make things to sell than to buy parts for servicing their products, training service techs, producing service documentation and dealing with every warranty service claim from all over. They always had regional service centers in addition to dealers that were authorized to service (beyond self-servicing dealers, who were authorized to service what they sold, but either had to get approval to service items bought elsewhere or be selective, because they could easily become inundated), but that's ALL they have, now. Good for the shippers, bad for consumers unless they live in the boonies and don't have local dealers.

I'm using a 25+ year old AM/FM tuner, still have a 25+ year old integrated amp, my turntable is over 30 years old, I still have my original CD player (Luxman) and my newest guitar amp was made in 1959- what does that say about me? (no, I'm not a hoarder)

 

[Irvrobinson]

but accepting gifts from France is a OK? lets say for example - large statues...

That was in the 19th century...

France's unemployment rate is currently over 10%. Their budget deficit is about 4.4% of GDP (the US is at about 2.8%), and they're only spending about $52B per year on defense, which means, as with all of Europe, we're massively subsidizing them. They have one of the world's most inefficient tax systems, one facet of which is a general annual wealth tax if your total taxable assets exceed about EU800,000 (about $1M). Figuring out what tax you owe is a nightmare, and you need appraisals for items like cars, jewelry, and just about any valuable item, like fine wine (I'm not kidding). Of course, that's in addition to the standard VAT of 20% (though there are lower rates for things like food), and a 45% marginal income tax if you are productive enough to earn over EU150K.

I think I'll stick with my original statement. Looking at France every once in a while gives me perspective about the US, and I appreciate it more. Personally, I think Europe is in big trouble in the long run.

 

[KEW]

I say sit back and see how it plays out for France.

I like the idea on principle, but it seems like a double edged sword.

Perhaps if categories were established of "durables" and "non-durables"...actually, France must have some categorization to do this unless they will completely eliminate items like disposable lighters, pens, etc.

 

[TLS Guy]

That was in the 19th century...

France's unemployment rate is currently over 10%. Their budget deficit is about 4.4% of GDP (the US is at about 2.8%), and they're only spending about $52B per year on defense, which means, as with all of Europe, we're massively subsidizing them. They have one of the world's most inefficient tax systems, one facet of which is a general annual wealth tax if your total taxable assets exceed about EU800,000 (about $1M). Figuring out what tax you owe is a nightmare, and you need appraisals for items like cars, jewelry, and just about any valuable item, like fine wine (I'm not kidding). Of course, that's in addition to the standard VAT of 20% (though there are lower rates for things like food), and a 45% marginal income tax if you are productive enough to earn over EU150K.

I think I'll stick with my original statement. Looking at France every once in a while gives me perspective about the US, and I appreciate it more. Personally, I think Europe is in big trouble in the long run.

Yes, Europe is totally dysfunctional, and the Eurozone especially so. If you follow the protracted mess and muddle over Greece, that will be enough to make you very glad you do not live in a Euro country.

 

[Irvrobinson]

That was in the 19th century...

France's unemployment rate is currently over 10%. Their budget deficit is about 4.4% of GDP (the US is at about 2.8%), and they're only spending about $52B per year on defense, which means, as with all of Europe, we're massively subsidizing them...

Well, it looks like the EU leaders read my post, and are considering action to address my defense concerns:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/could-joint-european-army-protect-nato-russia-isis-n322841