Energy Veritas 2.4i vs. Axiom M80ti - a blind listening test.

[Sheep]

Go Energy Go!


Sorry, was jsut at a canucks game...

SheepStar

 

[craigsub]

Sheep - As stated earlier, I am pretty sure "B" is the Energy pair. They are a really good speaker, for sure. At first glance, comparing a $4500 speaker pair to a $1240 speaker pair places the $4500 speaker in a tough place. If it does not mop the floor with the less expensive set, the less costly speakers look pretty good.

But ... The Energies come with a real wood finish (or real Piano Gloss), and when you consider one should be able to find a pair for appx. $3000-$3500, the difference shrinks.

Besides, this is kinda fun ...

 

[rolyasm]

Craig,
You asked about the price of the Veritas. Maybe I should but an emphasis on the I of the I can get the speaker for about $2,000-$2,200 pair. If anyone lives in the Utah area, stop by and we can chat about birds, music, whatever, but certainly we can't talk about online sales of goods, especially since a lot of companies frown on internet sales, even from dealers. Thanks for the test. I think, if anyone is interested, I could probably do a similar test with the Earthquake, Polk, Axiom and maybe Rocket and Def. Tech. Keep up the good work Craig.

 

[craigsub]

After a couple more nights of some very thorough listening, here is an update.

This will likely come as no surprise, but both speakers continue to excel. One of my favorite discs for discerning a speaker's overall performance is Tony Bennett's Live MTV SACD.

This disc has pretty much everything - Male and female vocals, Piano, Brass, Drums, Stand Up Bass, ... the works. A good speaker will place the stage in front of you. For example, in the duet with KD Lang, She and Bennett should be slightly left of center of the stage, and they should be singing about 5.5 feet of the floor.

Both speakers got it right here, With KD's voice being displayed with power and grace. In the meantime, the drums stayed center and back, just where they are located. And when Tony decides to ham it up by working the crowd, you can "see" him walking around the stage. And you NEED to hear the Brass section done through good speakers. We attend a live jazz session at our country club a couple times per month, and the ability of (particularly "A") these speakers to get all the dynamics of properly done brass is borderline astonishing. Most speakers let you know brass is playing: These let you hear the different instruments. Wonderful stuff !

Then there is the Stand up Bass - EVERY note comes through crystal clear. This is with just the speakers, no eq applied, period. If you are listening to this disc through a good speaker, and are not smiling and tapping your feet a bit, see a doctor.

If one word described these speakers, it would be "linearity". All frequency bands come through with little standing between the listener and the performance.

Then, for a very tough test, it was time for Roger Water's "In the Flesh". At the beginning of "Perfect Sense", "HAL", the computer from 2001 speaks to "Dave". Speaker "A" does something almost eerie with this: "HAL" is off to your right, well out into the room. It was an unusual experience for 2 channel.

Once again, The bass in both speakers is fantastic - Another Brick in the Wall, of course, has Graham Broad's Kickdrum in spades, and both speakers deliver, big time. This is bass centered around 35-40 Hz, and it is both audible and tactile. Simply put, you WILL feel both kick you in the chest when "The Wall" is cranked up.

The dynamics of these speakers is close to effortless, at no time, regardless of how hard I pushed them, did either become harsh.

Finally, "Money" is a song that never did much for me, but Waters managed to breathe (pun intended) new life into it. The guitar work here is good, old fashioned, Rock and Roll FUN ! And both speakers give you that rawpower and occasional grunge from the disc.

Next up, and quite the change, was FourPlay's "Between the Sheets". Nathan East's opening bass line and Harvey Mason's drum work has become a staple by which to measure (hear) bass power, quality, and low 30's extension.

If your speakers can deliver this with a visceral sense of presense, and can do so sans subwoofer, you have serious performance. Again, both speakers will PUNCH you with the kick drum, while the soothe you with that fantastic bass line. And they both do so with no bloat. And, again, the mids and highs are all there - nothing gets special attention, because it seems everything is getting special attention.

These are 2 speakers that know how to make music, for sure.

 

[Sheep]

Are you trying to rub in the fact that I can't afford these speakers?

SheepStar

 

[craigsub]

Are you trying to rub in the fact that I can't afoord these speakers?

SheepStar

Hmmmmmmm .. This makes me feel a bit like Mr. Scrooge ...

 

[Duffinator]

Hmmmmmmm .. This makes me feel a bit like Mr. Scrooge ...

You can always give him the pair that finishes second.

 

[craigsub]

You can always give him the pair that finishes second.

These speakers are good enough that there won't be a "first" or "second" place given. As stated earlier, I think "A" is the Axiom pair, but regardless which speaker pair is which, one of these is a $1240 pair of speakers with exceptional sound quality.

On the surface, this could look like the Axioms must "win", due to price. However, the 2.4 i's have been around for quite some time, and it is likely there are better "value plays" within the newest Energy lines.

I do know the M80's are the "latest and best" from Axiom. Tomorrow night, it will be time to unveil these speakers.

 

[Sheep]

You can always give him the pair that finishes second.

Listen to duff!

SheepStar

 

[Wid]

Very good reading. I was wondering where you were Craig.

 

[Ajax]

Craig, I went back over your first post, but if you mentioned which room you're in, I missed it. Are you upstairs or down in the basement?

 

[craigsub]

Craig, I went back over your first post, but if you mentioned which room you're in, I missed it. Are you upstairs or down in the basement?

Jack, This is in the basement. I know you have seen it, but here is a pic for those who haven't ...

The speakers shown are the Onix Ref 3's, but the 2.4 i's and M80's are there now.

 

[Tomorrow]

Jack, This is in the basement. I know you have seen it, but here is a pic for those who haven't ...

The speakers shown are the Onix Ref 3's, but the 2.4 i's and M80's are there now.

Simply gorgeous, Craig! Good work by you and the missus.

 

[Wid]

Very nice indeed

 

[craigsub]

Thanks, Guys. You may rest assured the only things I added to the decor was the audio products. My wife did all the decorating.

 

[Ajax]

I love how that room sounded. Or, rather, how it didn't sound. That's a very dead, but not completely dead, room. And, when we did some listening to music down there a month ago, I was very impressed how little the room affected what I was hearing. IMHO, it gave me a really accurate idea of how the speakers sounded.

We were listening to a really good pair of ACI monitors paired with twin Rocket UFW-12 subs. The package sounded TERRIFIC! It was a really pleasant listening experience.

 

[Tomorrow]

We were listening to a really good pair of ACI monitors paired with twin Rocket UFW-12 subs. The package sounded TERRIFIC! It was a really pleasant listening experience.

I still await someone's ACI review....tap..tap..tap..

 

[craigsub]

I still await someone's ACI review....tap..tap..tap..

Ok, Ok ... I have been doing some posting on AudioCircle, as that is where ACI's forum is, but over the Holidays I will get some stuff here.

For now, I will tell you they are silky smooth, very musical, wonderful speakers.

 

[rolyasm]

Better comparison??

Thanks for all the hard work, hehe, I'm sure you are exhausted. Perhaps a better comparision would be the Energy Connosuer line, about the same price, or perhaps the newer Ref. Conn. line, listed at $2,000 pair for the RC70 and $1,500 for the RC50. Me myself, I am actually more interested in the Veritas vs. Axiom because these are two speakers I am looking at. Unfortunately, I will have to buy the Veritas in order to try them, without a return policy like Axiom has. I can always use them in my demo room.

 

[craigsub]

It turns out that speakers "A" were the Axioms and "B" the Energy pair. It also turns out that overall, I preferred the Axioms - which was somewhat a surprise. Here is where they did much better than expected:

1. Bass Extension
2. Sound Staging and Imaging
3. Lack of harshness
4. Microdynamics
5. Macrodynamics

Ok - They surprised me pretty much everywhere. Axiom's constant work on improving their designs through research at the NRC and double blind testing on products to ascertain if the "improvements" really are seems to be paying off.

I am not going to get into a "this vs. that" between speakers now. BUT, I have has the following high end speakers in this same room as the M80 V.2's:

PSB Strata Goldi's, Legacy Classics, VMPS Super Towers, Klipschorns, Onix Ref 3's, Infinity IRS Sigma's, and Paradigm Studio 100 V.3's.

These speakers all have an average retail of about $5500 per pair.

In "lesser" speakers, I have had Rocket ELT's, 550 Mark II's, Ascend 170's and 340's, Axiom M22's.

The "lesser" speakers are VERY good loudspeakers, but they cannot reproduce the macrodynamics of the larger, "high end" speakers.

The Axiom M80's DO fit in with the better tower speakers on the market.

They have solid 30 Hz bass, image like monitors, yet have a large, expansive soundstage. I never sensed a hint of harshness, nor brightness. In fact, I found them to be quite neutral, with the ability to get out of the way of music.

As played against the Energies, the 2.4i's matched the dynamics of the M80's, but did so with a somewhat "mellow" signature - think original PSB Strata Gold's, and you will get the picture. As Roly has suggested, the 2.4i's are not going to be the "value" speaker in the Energy line, and there are likely a couple of better choices for a direct comparison to the M80's.

Getting back to the M80's - They will excel in both a 2 channel or a home theater system.

One Caveat with these speakers: I am driving them with the $4500 Emotiva DMC-1/MPS-1 pre-amp/power amp combo and a highly modded Denon 2900 Universal player.

Make sure, if you are interested in these speakers, that you get amplification and front end worthy of them. I can easily understand why people could consider them "bright" when using a $700 receiver.

Finally - Soundstage recently did a review of the M80 V.2's and had done a review of the 2.4i's last year. Here are some NRC graphs of both speakers. Feel free to chime in, and questions are welcomed !

This is the response curve of the M80 V.2 - note the almost uniform response across the 200 to 10,000 Hz range. They are also +/- 3 dB from 60 to 19,000 Hz, and - 5 dB at 32 Hz. With typical room gain, they will be flat to 30 Hz.

Here are the 2.4i's. Rather than a +/- 3 dB curve, they are closer to a +0/-6 dB curve - which matches the somewhat mellower curve mentioned. In a perfect world, both the Axioms and the 2.4i's would b +0/-0 db - but staying within a 6 dB total window, especially with NRC style measurements, is remarkable.