DO NOT BUY anything from AV123

[T2T]

I can't wait for all the birthday greetings to start showing up on AV451's site. I'm sure people like mfig, Dane, Techfan (I could've sworn that both he and his mother invested with MLS?), Larry D, all the members of TADG, and a few others will weigh in. But how exciting would it to hear from his 'brother' Santiago? And maybe Zeng Ming? What if Mr. Pu would say a few kind words? Maybe some former workers like Quintana, Sean, Ozmai, and some others? How nice it would be to see his wife, his sister and step-sister say something nice. Maybe even HWSNBN would be a treat that can't be beat. And all those orphans he helped in Khabarovsk? Why, here they are standing in abject reverence before the picture of Santa Shifty!

Nobody has started a Birthday thread over at VA321. Just a lot of posts by former employee, Luis Gerena, selling off his gear in what appears to be attempts to keep the lights on in his house.

 

[Chu Gai]

Over 15,000 satisfied customers I've heard.

 

[fanuminski]

I can't wait for all the birthday greetings to start showing up on AV451's site. I'm sure people like mfig, Dane, Techfan (I could've sworn that both he and his mother invested with MLS?), Larry D, all the members of TADG, and a few others will weigh in. But how exciting would it to hear from his 'brother' Santiago? And maybe Zeng Ming? What if Mr. Pu would say a few kind words? Maybe some former workers like Quintana, Sean, Ozmai, and some others? How nice it would be to see his wife, his sister and step-sister say something nice. Maybe even HWSNBN would be a treat that can't be beat. And all those orphans he helped in Khabarovsk? Why, here they are standing in abject reverence before the picture of Santa Shifty!

I think these are the new cabinet workers ....here they are holding up
one side of the new LS-12's
-M

 

[Jed M]

Well, it doesn't appear that he got a birthday wish, but strangely enough he got a "girthday" wish.

 

[penpitt]

New subwwofer

Well it looks like they want to market what I am sure will be another killer sub. I can't wait to get one. Hopefully I can preorder it or pay to be a beta tester.

http://forums.av123.com/showthread.php?t=43973

 

[Jed M]

I saw that when I was over there too. All the world needs is another sub from AV123. Their last sealed 12" was a real contender. If I was owed a product like the RSL it would be pretty disheartening or infuriating seeing them piss their remaining money away.

I also like how they got called out on their ".97 cents" promotion. They just jack up the regular prices and give you "free" shipping. I know companies do that all the time and personally I prefer the shipping to be built into the price or at least clearly displayed and a reasonable rate, but to do it and call it a promotion/sale? Uh, no that is just changing your pricing methods. Good stuff as always.

 

[T2T]

Well it looks like they want to market what I am sure will be another killer sub. I can't wait to get one. Hopefully I can preorder it or pay to be a beta tester.

http://forums.av123.com/showthread.php?t=43973

Two things come to mind when I see that sub.

1) Why isn't the baffle thicker so they could have recessed that driver? Now, they're going to have an extra thick grill to cover that driver and accommodate for the excursion.

2) I see the inputs for the amp are of the "VCR style" as another individual pointed out. They're using Yellow, Red and White. Yellow for the LFE instead of another color. Apparently, this all goes back to the supply being easier to achieve rather than waiting on purple (or something similar) to match the LFE output color that receivers use.

Assuming this sub gets ready to "sell" within 90 days, does anyone want to start to guess how long it will take to see a manual for it? 1 Year? 2 Years? Never?

Edit: If I were an individual in the market for a 12" sealed sub today, I'd hop all over that Emotiva sale this weekend. $399, shipped. Plus, if you buy a pair, another $50 gets taken off the price.

 

[T2T]

I also like how they got called out on their ".97 cents" promotion. They just jack up the regular prices and give you "free" shipping. I know companies do that all the time and personally I prefer the shipping to be built into the price or at least clearly displayed and a reasonable rate, but to do it and call it a promotion/sale? Uh, no that is just changing your pricing methods. Good stuff as always.

Yeah, I noticed that earlier, too. $.97 to ship an MFW-15 - which they claim is a savings of $143 in shipping. Yet, the current shipping amount displayed for a regular MFW-15 is only $99 via UPS Ground - as displayed on their page. It seems as though they've inflated their "estimate" by $44.

 

[gonk]

The RSS500 does look a lot like the Axiom design, except for the trim pieces at every seam.

Does anybody else think that their new "rail system" looks sloppy? I don't think we've seen veneer on any of them yet, but even in a painted finish they strike me as being kind of unfinished - like they can't figure out how to brace well internally or finish exterior joints cleanly.

 

[Jed M]

Yeah, I noticed that earlier, too. $.97 to ship an MFW-15 - which they claim is a savings of $143 in shipping. Yet, the current shipping amount displayed for a regular MFW-15 is only $99 via UPS Ground - as displayed on their page. It seems as though they've inflated their "estimate" by $44.

Not to mention they raised the price of the MFW-15 by $100 too. So that $143 you are saving is actually a lot closer to $0.

 

[MinusTheBear]

Not to mention they raised the price of the MFW-15 by $100 too. So that $143 you are saving is actually a lot closer to $0.

AV123 has always been honest in the pricing/MSRP of their products and the value received.

What they really liked to do over the years was to promote a substantially inflated MSRP. Take that MSRP and put a slash through and drop the price 50% or more. Consumers were always bragging about a deal of the century. Now what they didn't realize was AV123 was substantially inflating the MSRP and shipping charges on the products and recouping their margins and still at the same time bragging how the MSRP can't be touched for the price. You also have to realize AV123 gets a special price from the shipping companies they work with such as ups.

I have compared what UPS quotes me and what AV123 charges for shipping on products and AV123 is always more expensive than what UPS would charge. It showed me how much they actually pocket on the back end of purchases over the years, instead of being upfront and honest about the actual MSRP and real value you are receiving. I find deception in that way to conduct business.

 

[Jed M]

AV123 has always been honest in the pricing/MSRP of their products and the value received.

What they really liked to do over the years was to promote a substantially inflated MSRP. Take that MSRP and put a slash through and drop the price 50% or more. Consumers were always bragging about a deal of the century. Now what they didn't realize was AV123 was substantially inflating the MSRP and shipping charges on the products and recouping their margins and still at the same time bragging how the MSRP can't be touched for the price. You also have to realize AV123 gets a special price from the shipping companies they work with such as ups.

I have compared what UPS quotes me and what AV123 charges for shipping on products and AV123 is always more expensive than what UPS would charge. It showed me how much they actually pocket on the back end of purchases over the years, instead of being upfront and honest about the actual MSRP and real value you are receiving. I find deception in that way to conduct business.

No, No, you got it all wrong. That was the handling.

 

[MinusTheBear]

No, No, you got it all wrong. That was the handling.

Sure thats a way to spin it and it would still be a inflated handling charge. Wouldn't handling charges be a fixed cost and actually be included into the MSRP price?

Does anyone have any numbers on the rates shipping companies charge business and those compared to individual rates. It would be interesting to get an idea on the margins they were getting on the shipping costs.

 

[Jed M]

We actually had a discussion on the forum before it closed when we discovered they were charging "handling". I remember quite a few of us, Seth probably being most vocal, telling Mark it was a pretty lousy thing to do. I even took it to private email with Mark and eventually he tried a free shipping promotion for about a week and then never did it again to my knowledge. There were a lot of little things that started falling apart in late summer of 08 and that was one of them. I was already one foot out the door at that point but I did voice my negative feelings about excessive "handling" charges.

 

[Stereodude]

It looks a bit like a rehash of a UFW-12. The driver looks near identical with the stitching in the surround, etc.

Here's the UFW-12 driver for comparison.




Now if you'll recall one of the many delays to the UFW-12 Hotrod kit was the fact that the driver manufacturer moved overseas and they couldn't source the driver they wanted anymore which led Mark Seaton to source a new 12" driver from AE. So, either they can suddenly source drivers from that manufacturer again, or they're cooking up vaporware with parts from deep storage.

On a slightly unrelated yet related note, I bet we'll see versions these amps (the 500W special used in the rev 3 MFW-15 / Rocket 12) again soon in another companies products in the not too distant future.

 

[Stereodude]

We actually had a discussion on the forum before it closed when we discovered they were charging "handling". I remember quite a few of us, Seth probably being most vocal, telling Mark it was a pretty lousy thing to do. I even took it to private email with Mark and eventually he tried a free shipping promotion for about a week and then never did it again to my knowledge. There were a lot of little things that started falling apart in late summer of 08 and that was one of them. I was already one foot out the door at that point but I did voice my negative feelings about excessive "handling" charges.

Indeed we had quite the lengthy thread on it. They tried to explain that warehousing costs, overhead, packaging, etc were all in the handling. I argued that those all belonged in the product cost and they needed transparent shipping costs because inflated handling only hurt customer when it came time to resell the product since no one values "S&H". Somehow they couldn't wrap their head around the idea that business like Monoprice, Newegg, & Amazon who charge real shipping (or less) had the right idea. Like Jed, I also took it to MLS in e-mail. Never got a reply though.

Here's a perfect example... In July 2008 I bought a b-stock X-CS for $59 and was charged $51 to ship it to me in xxxxxx, Michigan 48xxx. In July 2008 the UPS website showed that a 41lb 22x14x26" (I rounded up on the dimensions) box worth $59 from Longmont, CO 80501 to a business in xxxxxx, MI 48xxx is $38 and some change if someone were to bring it a UPS store and ship it (paying there). However, If I had a UPS account (excluding any sort of volume / quantity discount) and gave it to the driver (or dropped it off pre-paid) it was only $24.87.

 

[mziegler]

Once again, if the price looks too good to be true, it is.

By the way, I feel sorry for those who paid $1,500 for the Ref 1. The sales on speakers like these usually represented a fair market value. Of course Shifty was in fact a middle man on these, which means they were never ID in the first place.

 

[MinusTheBear]

And take your quotes from UPS and I would guess AV123 actual cost to ship that X-CS is peanuts in comparison to even the lowest quote given from UPS.

 

[tesseract]

Rocket 12 Subwoofer

http://forums.av123.com/showthread.php?t=43973

Nice of them to come out (still in development) with this at the same time as the v3 replacement for the MFW-15 which seems to be crap. All they had to do was continue the MFW-15 with this amp and the Seaton EQ, and maybe they would have had something this time around. Not that I would recommend it even if it was the bee's knees.

Stupid to try and introduce yet another sub without having successfully fixed the former ones, no one will buy this.

 

[T2T]

Sadly, there was a pretty good response in the MFW-15 amp thread by one of their members (with 2 posts). I was going to scrape the screen and post a link to it here. However, the iron-fisted government of the VA321 forum deleted that wonderful post.

In summary (from what I can recall from memory) the poster criticized VA321 for pushing out V.3 of the amp with the red, white and yellow inputs - among other great comments. He went on to state that VA321 should be ashamed for using the wrong-colored inputs just because that's all that was available to the amp vendor at the time. He even questioned that if S-Video inputs were only available, would VA321 have used those for the audio inputs instead. All in all, I loved it. Sorry y'all couldn't have read it.