Decent sound without the rear speakers

C

celticsdiehard

Audiophyte
Look, I know nothing about home theater. Due to space limitations I need help finding a system that does not require rear speakers but one that, I guess, simulates a surround sound environment. I'm no audiophile and I have a limited budget. I know most people hate Bose 321, which is good because they are fairly expensive. I know Pioneer has front stage surround sound, but I really haven't heard much about it. Any guidance from you guys will be greatly appreciated.
 
R

rschleicher

Audioholic
You might want to check out Yamaha's new YSP-1 "Digital Sound Projector".

This is a single amplifier/speaker component that creates 5 channel sound (you still need a separate subwoofer to make it 5.1) by (I'm oversimplifying) "beam-steering" five audio channels to different points in the room, thereby creating front left and right, center, left surround and right surround channels. You need a fairly normal size and shape room for this to work right, in that the steered audio needs walls to bounce off of. From what I have read/heard, the creation of a near-5.1 sound experience is pretty good. One warning is that a demo of this product at an audio/video store might not do it justice, depending on the room set-up at the store, and whether the unit was set up right. It is not cheap (I think MSRP is in the $1,400 range, roughly), but given that the unit contains all of the speakers for the system except the sub, and also has its own built-in amps, it is worth looking into for rooms where it is just too difficult to do a regular 5.1 (or more) setup.

You might also look at some form of wireless speaker approach for the surrounds, if getting wires to them was the main obstacle. The "cheap and dirty" approach of just leaving out the surrounds (i.e., front and center channel only) is not the end of the world, either. For that matter, neither is 2-ch. stereo through a high-quality system. Either will be more satisfying than listening to the TV's speakers, even if not as "enveloping".
 
T

tbewick

Senior Audioholic
I find that a well set up stereo system can provide as an enveloping sound as those Dolby/DTS virtual surround technologies. Get your stereo speakers positioned so that there is lots of space around them, particularly between the speakers, and try to position them as symmetrically as possible with the room (I know this can increase unwanted acoustical effects, but I find that it creates a better stereo field).

You know that you can get away with using fairly cheap and small surround speakers for those matrix (Pro-Logic II/NEO etc.) surround technologies, since they're only there (the surround speakers) to provide ambience. I'd suggest getting a good stereo set up, and then if you want, try seeing if you can get better sound using cheap centre/surround speakers. I wouldn't recommend getting a cheap subwoofer, because that will probably make your system sound worse.

I really don't find the Pro-Logic/NEO/DSP surround settings very good on my Denon receiver for listening to music, but they're okay for Dolby Surround-mixed sources. In saying that my system isn't perfectly matched, as I'm using Tannoy rears and B&W/Celestion fronts.

Getting a good Dolby Digital/DTS discrete set up is expensive but does sound excellent and much better than those matrix technologies.
 
Buckeyefan 1

Buckeyefan 1

Audioholic Ninja
you may be surprised, but...

celticsdiehard said:
Look, I know nothing about home theater. Due to space limitations I need help finding a system that does not require rear speakers but one that, I guess, simulates a surround sound environment. I'm no audiophile and I have a limited budget. I know most people hate Bose 321, which is good because they are fairly expensive. I know Pioneer has front stage surround sound, but I really haven't heard much about it. Any guidance from you guys will be greatly appreciated.
"Limited Budget." Does that mean $350, or $1000? I assume you are looking for a receiver, speakers (L,C,R) , a sub, and dvd/cd player. Getting the bare minimum stuff, you would spend:
Receiver (basic Yamaha): $250
Speakers: (Bic Center/bookshelves) $220
Sub: $200
DVD/CD player: $70
Interconnects: $40
Total: $780

-or-

http://www.4electronicwarehouse.com/products/bose/3-2-1-details.html

It will probably sound better than the Bose 123, but the Bose 123 is a matched system that will probably have better surround capabilities. You can use a dolby pro logic mode for surround with the $780 set up above. How do you like the sound of the Bose? If that's all you need it for, you can see it's about the same price as separates (but much much better separates that are expandable). The issue with the Bose is that it's not. What you see is what you get. Move it into a larger room, and you're shot.
 
Last edited:
C

celticsdiehard

Audiophyte
I'm talking a VERY limited budget (no more than $500). I'm not looking for something to shake my house. Just something halfway decent. Maybe when the kids move out and I have some extra cash I'll invest in something nicer. But, for now, as long as the sound is decent and I can get away with simulating a surround environment, I'll be happy.
 
Buckeyefan 1

Buckeyefan 1

Audioholic Ninja
celticsdiehard said:
I'm talking a VERY limited budget (no more than $500). I'm not looking for something to shake my house. Just something halfway decent. Maybe when the kids move out and I have some extra cash I'll invest in something nicer. But, for now, as long as the sound is decent and I can get away with simulating a surround environment, I'll be happy.
Cool.

Rank the components that are most important to you.
Speakers, receiver, dvd/cd player, subwoofer. We'll help you find the best bang for your buck. Is there anything you can do without to up your budget for a given componenet?
 
C

celticsdiehard

Audiophyte
The receiver doesn't need to be that powerful. I have a fairly small living room (15x20). Also, the smaller the speakers the better. Due to my wife's decorating, getting a home theater is contingent on the ability to hide the speakers behind picture frames, etc. Hey, if it was up to me I'd be looking at the biggest, baddest system out there. However, if you're married, you will understand.
 
Buckeyefan 1

Buckeyefan 1

Audioholic Ninja
celticsdiehard said:
The receiver doesn't need to be that powerful. I have a fairly small living room (15x20). Also, the smaller the speakers the better. Due to my wife's decorating, getting a home theater is contingent on the ability to hide the speakers behind picture frames, etc. Hey, if it was up to me I'd be looking at the biggest, baddest system out there. However, if you're married, you will understand.
Yep, married with two kids. Somehow, I've been able to convince the wife early on HT is very important to me. I think she's convinced me she gets to drive the better vehicles as a consulation. Anyhow, if you need "low profile" type audio, and have to hide speakers behind picture frames, why not consider something like this? It's going to sound as good or better than the Bose, and you can pack the two surround speakers away if you don't use them.
http://www.ubid.com/actn/opn/getpage.asp?AuctionId=10419240

If you would like to spend closer to your $500 budget and get better sound, go this route.

That same site has great deals on receivers that can be had for under $150.

The speakers, being the most important part of this setup, should be your number one item. How about a nice set of BIC Muro in walls, with a BIC center channel?
http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:BIC America VI38 In-Wall Speaker:1990300696;_ylt=AlGfwwsfjjTohl4iMK.7.cqRxI4C;_ylu=X3oDMTBvdjByaDNuBF9zAzc4NDcwMjUwMARsdAM0BHNlYwNzcg--?clink=dmss//ctx=sc:cspeakers_in_wall,c:cspeakers_in_wall,mid:59,pid:1990300696,pdid:59,pos:1

http://shopping.yahoo.com/p:BIC America DV-52CLRS Center Speaker:1991712171;_ylt=AqqoSpuwIZ_zfPrRGpTt9z_IxI4C;_ylu=X3oDMTBvdjByaDNuBF9zAzc4NDcwMjUwMARsdAM0BHNlYwNzcg--?clink=dmss//ctx=sc:cspeakers_center,c:cspeakers_center,mid:59,pid:1991712171,pdid:59,pos:7
 
C

celticsdiehard

Audiophyte
I've heard good things about Onkyo. Will it still "simulate" a surround environment? I know there is a lot of technology that will do that (front stage surround, virtual surround, etc.). I'm sorry if that's a stupid question. I just want to make sure it will do what I want before I fork over the cash.
 
C

celticsdiehard

Audiophyte
I see Circuit City has the HT-S580 on sale ($270)...
 
Buckeyefan 1

Buckeyefan 1

Audioholic Ninja
celticsdiehard said:
I've heard good things about Onkyo. Will it still "simulate" a surround environment? I know there is a lot of technology that will do that (front stage surround, virtual surround, etc.). I'm sorry if that's a stupid question. I just want to make sure it will do what I want before I fork over the cash.
As long as it has some type of Dolby Pro Logic options on the receiver, it will simulate surround sound. What's great about Circuit City is you can take it home, listen to it for a few weeks, and return it if you don't like it for a full refund. Sounds like a win win trail and error. (you'll probably get addicted to the rear surrounds if you hook them up, so avoid hooking them up) If not, there's plenty of other options. You certaintly can't beat the price.

If you get a chance, run over to Best Buy and listen to these slim Yamaha speakers. I was blown away when I heard them, especially for the price. It might be enough to sway you to "build" the system rather than get a "HTIB". It's possible two of those will sound better than three of the Onkyo's, but will cost slightly more. At least you'll have fun demo'ing!
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7034611&type=product&cmp=++&id=1099395730320
 
C

celticsdiehard

Audiophyte
Checked out the Onkyo at Circuit City Friday night but couldn't really get a good feel for how it sounds. Our Circuit City store is pretty crappy (only a handful of home theaters set up, mismatched components, etc.). I think I'll hold off and wait until the Pioneer HTP-2550DV is available at Best Buy and then compare. Any of you guys work at Best Buy? If so, any idea when this thing should come out? I've heard June.
 
C

celticsdiehard

Audiophyte
I finally ordered the Kenwood HTB-s610. I've been looking at it since March and the reviews I've read have been excellent. I heard a rumor that Kenwood is going out of business. Not sure how true this is, but I found such a good deal on this thing I had to pull the trigger. We'll see how it sounds...
 

Latest posts

newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top