Best sounding speakers you have ever listen to..

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Can't claim I heard best speakers in the world and I have auditioned relatively very little , but from speakers I did listed to my favorite were MartinLogan Vantage (or Theos - don't remember exactly), but best speakers I own is my jbl pro monitors

Some top brands I did listed to : couple of B&W, Wilson, Monitor Audio and a few more

Yeah, I thought the ML Vantage sounded pretty good too. They probably don't measure very well, but I think they sound pretty good.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Yeah, I thought the ML Vantage sounded pretty good too. They probably don't measure very well, but I think they sound pretty good.

on axis (very narrow), but off axis the sound was much worse unfortunately..

 

[Nuance AH]

Actually, I knew exactly what you meant. Size of the company, profit, long history, many professional reviews, measurements, advertisements, endorsements, etc.

I was just giving my side of the definition of "underdog".

My definition is based on actual cost to the consumers.

My definition of "underdog" is a speaker that actually costs less, yet measures superbly and sounds superbly as if they cost more.

Let's say we have company X & company Y.

Company X has been around for decades, reviewed/measured by many magazines, and folks can buy speaker X for $1K.

Company Y is up and coming, has never been reviewed /measured by the magazines, and folks have to spend $3K to buy speaker Y.

Why should anyone consider company Y the underdog when folks have to pay more money?

Your example doesn't apply to Salk, as they have been reviewed and measured by magazines, and also cost considerably less than products from the B&M scene that offers the same performance. The only cost no object speaker line they have is the SoundScape line, and as I've mentioned before, even those speakers cost considerably less money than their intended competitors products, and they perform better too. Also, what you purchased your speakers for doesn't apply, because the Salon2's retail for $22,000/pair, Kef 207/2's retail for $20,000/pair and the Orion's go for around $15,000. In the case of the Orions, there is hardly any manufacturing and build costs, so there's no way it should cost that much as a completed product. The SoundScape 12's cost $1000 more than the Orions, sound better and are far more costly to manufactuer/produce. You simply get more speaker for the money with the SS's, and the price isn't highly inflated like it is with the Orions. Your own purchase price doesn't reflect everyone else's, ADTG. Nice try, though.

As for our definitions of underdog, I like mine better because it's more universal, but to each their own.

As I hope you'll soon experience, speaker price doesn't always reflect performance. In fact, in this hobby it hardly ever does. Hopefully you'll understand that once you receive your Philly 3's. If you hate them - fine by me, but I don't think you will. Do I expect you to declare them superior to the Revel's or Kef's? No. Just remember, though, they cost far far less, and I'll bet they'll be very similar, perhaps even a little better. I don't expect you to admit that, though, as I am sure it'll hurt your ego. We'll know soon enough.

on axis (very narrow), but off axis the sound was much worse unfortunately..

Once electrostat/planar style designers figure out how to resolve off-axis performance, they'll be tough to beat IMO.

 

[cpp]

AcuDefTechGuy

Kind of like the Denon 4311. Did you know Electronics Expo is selling the 4311 for $1330 + $30 s/h

yep I saw that, but it's been 3 months since I got my 4311 and back then there were no real deals.


AcuDefTechGuy

Let's say we have company X & company Y.

Company X has been around for decades, reviewed/measured by many magazines, and folks can buy speaker X for $1K.

Company Y is up and coming, has never been reviewed /measured by the magazines, and folks have to spend $3K to buy speaker Y.

Why should anyone consider company Y the underdog when folks have to pay more money?

Well, regardless of X or Y. Marketing can do wonders for sales of any product regardless how it looks or sounds. Purchasing at lower cost from a company like X gets into the rules of supply and demand, material cost reductions due to purchase quality and the ability to shop for reductions in labor cost and then there is the sales and marketing expense these companies have that gets their product in front of the reviewers and magazines, which usually means complimentary comments since X did pay a fee to put their product in this magazine. A magazine usually never trash talks a company like X which is providing incoming revenue for the publishing company that owns the magazine.

Company Y a small underdog might very well build a much superior product than X, and their marketing is mostly driven by internet chatter which to them is low expense.

If the cost of Y is more than X, in most cases Y is using a better components than X and in most all cases Y has taken the time to measure and supply measurements to support their product, where in a lot of cases X could care less about providing product performance results since they supply their product to reviewers and pay for advertisements not to mention push their product in those fancy magazines which if you haven't noticed most always gives a glowing report at the end.

Price doesn't mean a lot in the search for what pleases a person, if you like it, buy it, if not move on.


PS: If I paint my speakers RED, will they sound better

 

[Nuance AH]

PS: If I paint my speakers RED, will they sound better

You know it!

 

[haraldo]

Best speakers I heard.... probably the Adyton Imagic 2.0 with Burmester S8 subwoofers....

Imagic 2.0 Loudspeakers

A level of detail and dynamics that goes unsurpassed from my experience....

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

If I paint my speakers RED, will they sound better

You know it!

Don't kid yourself boys. Colors do matter!

Sight and sound. Sight and sound. We ain't no robots.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I don't expect you to admit that, though, as I am sure it'll hurt your ego.

That is completely false accusations without any facts.

It's like having 4 kids. If one of them excels beyond the other 3, it will not hurt your ego one bit. You would just be happy for the one that excels, but love all 4 kids just the same.

 

[jayelwin]

Had a boss when I was in college who had a set of custom handmade speakers that were powered by McIntosh. Definitely had a laxative effect to the bass.

 

[Nuance AH]

That is completely false accusations without any facts.

It's like having 4 kids. If one of them excels beyond the other 3, it will not hurt your ego one bit. You would just be happy for the one that excels, but love all 4 kids just the same.

Did you just compare speakers to human beings?

I meant your ego because you're an owner. Don't deny it, you know it would sting a little if a $3000 pair of speakers (well, your cost more, but the extra cost won't make them sound different) bested the $22,000 Revels. I know it would sting if I was in your position. Besides, I was only goofing with you; I goof a lot...it's one of the things I do best.

 

[Lordhumungus]

That is completely false accusations without any facts.

It's like having 4 kids. If one of them excels beyond the other 3, it will not hurt your ego one bit. You would just be happy for the one that excels, but love all 4 kids just the same.

Most "normal" people would only keep the over achiever and sell off the other 3 kids, right?

 

[LAB3]

Most "normal" people would only keep the over achiever and sell off the other 3 kids, right?

No you stand one in each corner of the room. they sound better that way.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Honestly, I'd be tickled if my "$3K" speakers sounded better than my "$22K" speakers.

That's just the way I am.

If anyone wants to order what I ordered, I think it will be this:

Phil3 base price: $3,000
Mahogany veneer & red lacquer: $100
Grills fronts/TL ports: $160
Shipping: $175
Piano High-gloss: $1,500

Total: $4,435

 

[MidnightSensi2]

All the FR measurements of Wilson Audio I've seen looked pretty bad. Really bad.

Dynaudio FR looked pretty good. Really good.

Yeah, I actually found the Wilson's to be fatiguing. I was a serious buyer, tried different demo days, different amplifiers. I wanted them for the sex appeal for a kickass two channel system. But, simply didn't like the way they sounded. I mean, I really walked into the room thinking I'd buy them.

 

[DS-21]

I cannot find any objective measurements on the Tannoy's. Do you have a link?

They don't seem to be reviewed much, unfortunately. Here are sound power measurements I found from HTMag for a Tannoy Sensys system, with the top line is a tower, the middle one shows the glaring flaws one expects from a horizontal center channel, and the bottom line is a bookshelf.

***The DC2's listening-window response (a five-point average of axial and +/–15-degree horizontal and vertical responses) measures +0.77/–1.59 decibels from 200 hertz to 10 kilohertz.***The DC1's listening-window response measures +0.88/–1.26 dB

They also measured the Arena eggs, of which I own two pair, but found in a blind test I didn't like as much as the KEF HTS3005SE (the best-sounding small "designer" speaker out for my tastes, and subsequently purchased), John Krutke's Bargain Mini design, or a Behringer B2031P.

***The satellite 's listening-window response (a five-point average of axial and +/–15-degree horizontal and vertical responses) measures +2.23/–2.83 decibels from 200 hertz to 10 kilohertz.***

Also, I'd love to see objective measurements of your speakers.

Here is someone else's unsmoothed on-axis in-room measurement for a Tannoy System 12 DMT II, my reference LCR main, with the caveat that an in-room measurement will not be as clean as a quasi-anechoic one.

Note that they have an "Audyssey notch" built in, which is perhaps one reason I liked Audyssey better on them than I did on the KEF eggs.

If you overtoe them such that all three cross ahead of and in front of the listening position, as I've found optimal for the types of speakers I generally like, then the overall response profile smooths out on top to a more gradual shelf. (That is to say, the listening-axis response doesn't come back up in the upper mids.)

When the 8x8 miniDSP-in-a-box comes out and I start playing with measurements of them for active crossover design, I'll probably set up a small website/blog to help other people with these speakers who may be considering going active.

I will for sure check out the KEF's, thanks for the recommendation! Do they have an active monitor version of the new Uni-Q? I couldn't find one on their website.

Not to my knowledge.

Here's Dennis Murphy's measurements of some $35,000 Tannoys:

MurphyBlaster Productions



That said I liked the 5 minutes I spent with some $400/pr Tannoys

Seriously, I can't believe nobody has yet noticed the most obvious thing visible in Dr. Murphy's nearfield measurement: the Westminster Royals he measured are miswired! (No, that does not speak well to Tannoy's quality control.)

Just look at that deep null, right where one would expect the crossover to be, indicating one of the drivers is wired in the wrong polarity!

That said, I didn't like the Westminster Royals, or Churchills, when I heard them. Or any 15" Dual Concentric I've ever heard. (Never heard the Glenair 15, though I've been told it was the best of 'em...by a Tannoy dealer who had previously exposed me to the D700's, D500s, and Saturn S10's, all of which I loved; the Glenair 10, which I thought good-not-great; and the TD12, Westminster Royal, and Churchill, none of which were my thing.) Or any of the TD line with their paper coned Duals and that infernal power-response-destroying supertweeter. (Didn't like the supertweet'ed KEF References at all, either. So glad both KEF and Tannoy left that silliness behind. The KEFs were not as badly affected by the supertweet as the Tannoys, though.)

I've found the 15's to be markedly more colored in the lower mids than the 10's and 12's. And the poly-cone ones just seem smoother than the paper cone ones. (I also have a set - soon to be a trio - of CPA-12s, which have a deeper paper cone and narrower pattern. I don't like them as much. However, they'll be great mains for my sister's forthcoming basement theater, so when I found a stray one available I jumped on it.) While I didn't take measurements, I compared a set of 15 DMT II's I was considering purchasing directly against my 12 DMT II's...and happily didn't buy the 15's.

There's IMO a reason their flagship Kingdom speaker used a 12" Dual Concentric.

 

[DS-21]

Best speakers I heard.... probably the Adyton Imagic 2.0 with Burmester S8 subwoofers....

I'm pretty sure those subs use the best 12" woofer around, the Aurasound NS12-794-4A.

Price is a bit of an ouch, though, even when one considers the woofers alone cost $500+ in small quantities. I thought the MSRP of my two M-Design Eleganza Bellas ($3500 ea), which use the same woofer and a 500W Class G amp, was high!

 

[GranteedEV]

Seriously, I can't believe nobody has yet noticed the most obvious thing visible in Dr. Murphy's nearfield measurement: the Westminster Royals he measured are miswired! (No, that does not speak well to Tannoy's quality control.)

Just look at that deep null, right where one would expect the crossover to be, indicating one of the drivers is wired in the wrong polarity!

That is one rather narrow reverse null (1/4 octave)... I doubt they were miswired.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Is it possible for a speaker to be that bad?

-20dB down on the FR? Even Bose is not that bad.

 

[Nuance AH]

Is it possible for a speaker to be that bad?

-20dB down on the FR? Even Bose is not that bad.

I bet some Bose speakers are.

 

[haraldo]

I'm pretty sure those subs use the best 12" woofer around, the Aurasound NS12-794-4A.

Price is a bit of an ouch, though, even when one considers the woofers alone cost $500+ in small quantities. I thought the MSRP of my two M-Design Eleganza Bellas ($3500 ea), which use the same woofer and a 500W Class G amp, was high!

Price of the Burmester's are oooouch, but there are quite good other sub's that can probably match them

The Adyton line source speakers are ouch priced tooo... It is made using quite normal vifa fullrange drivers, I don't think they are really expensive, not sure which tweeter is used, but from what I can see probbaly a quite normal ribbon tweeter, raven or something similar....

Not sure the Vifa drivers can be bought off the shelf, but I believe it is something like this:
Vifa TG9FD-10-08 3-1/2" Woofer 299-269

The full range drivers are run without filter at all in series, but with some components in parallel with drivers, while tweeter use a simple 1st order around 10KHz....