AVR rec 9.2 ATMOS

[PENG]

Ok, I thought you were talking about the YPAO. Denon is it now let see if I can find a better deal.

If you can't find a better deal then you really should wait if you could, because they are now on sale in Canada for $1199, about $900 brand new and more than one person were able to get the $799 deal not too long ago in the US.

I have recently tried the X3400H too, both of them sound better than my separates with Audyssey on but that's based on my own subjective experience. The RX-RX-A2070 is a little more powerful, perhaps more reliable, except I don't know how YPAO compares and it costs more. It also has higher distortions than the Denon, in the S&V bench tests, though both so low that it shouldn't make any difference in the real world, when operating well below their output limit.

 

[Bookmark]

There is nothing wrong with the YPAO or much different from the Audyssey. YPAO may garner a better result with a bit of manual post tweaking over the auto setup, but unless the room has serious problems either should be fine.

I don't think the Yammys get much of a discount until the new models turn up where as the Denon/Marantz seem to be on offer a lot more of the time. It is just a matter of picking the point where you are happy with the price.

If you like it really loud or have difficult to drive speakers then get the model with pre-outs so at least there is an option to add an external amp in the future if required.

Here in the UK the 4400 goes for about £800 and the 3400 can be got for £550. The Marantz 7012 is around the £1K mark and the 6012 is £750. A lot of the time its $=£ for us but I saw the US listing for 6012 at just under $1500 which I think could be got a lot cheaper. The Yamaha 2070 is roughly £1K.

 

[DigitalDawn]

Can you sell him the X4400H for around $799? Apparently some member(s) bought it from you not long ago for that price. I am just curious..

For some strange reasons, we can get a better deal in Canada right now for that particular model, CAD1199.99 (=USD900) from Gibbys and CAD1240 (=USD950)

https://gibbyselectronicsupermarket.ca/product/denon-avrx4400h-receiver/
https://www.amazon.ca/Denon-AVRX4400H-Channel-Network-Receiver/dp/B072Z6VT1C
https://www.bestbuy.ca/en-ca/product/denon-avr-x4400h-9-2-channel-4k-ultra-hd-network-av-receiver/10885711.aspx

yet in the US, it is USD1,599.98 at bestbuy.com and USD1,599.0 at amazon.com

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/searchpage.jsp?st=avr-x4400h&_dyncharset=UTF-8&id=pcat17071&type=page&sc=Global&cp=1&nrp=&sp=&qp=&list=n&af=true&iht=y&usc=All+Categories&ks=960&keys=keys
https://www.amazon.com/Denon-AVRX4400H-Channel-Network-Receiver/dp/B072Z6VT1C/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1530733193&sr=8-2-spons&keywords=avr-x4400h&psc=1

99% of the time, US gets much better price than Canada.

Wish I could help, but that one isn't on sale right now.

 

[PENG]

Here in the UK the 4400 goes for about £800 and the 3400 can be got for £550. The Marantz 7012 is around the £1K mark and the 6012 is £750. A lot of the time its $=£ for us but I saw the US listing for 6012 at just under $1500 which I think could be got a lot cheaper. The Yamaha 2070 is roughly £1K.

Thank you for the information, but can you clarify the following:

$=£?, isn't it about 0.75 so £800 = USD1060?
Also, is the £800 from authorized dealer and is at the lowest/or near lowest outgoing model clearance price you have seen so far?

In the US the X4400H's discounted price is expected to be around $800, currently not on sale so still at $1599

The RX-A2070 is also at around $1599.

Regarding Denon vs Marantz pricing, the price gaps between the comparable models in the US and Canada are typically much larger. People seem to be willing to pay 15-40% premium most of the time probably because they believe what they were told by the hearsay generators (sales reps, internet forum talks..) that Marantz has a better sound quality due to HDAM, the inherited legendary Marantz warm sound since ancient times etc.

In the far East, Japan and probably even parts of Europe such belief seems less popular and the price gap is much smaller, and justifiable because comparable models (e.g. 4400 vs 7012),Marantz typically comes with only a touch more features. So in the UK, those who believe in the HDAM and a "voiced" warm sound, should definitely go with Marantz even if they don't need that couple of additional features.

Oh, just for example:
D&M list price for the AVR-X4400H is $1599, vs Marantz SR7012's $2199

The only extra feature the SR7012 offers is the 7.1 analog input, unless I missed something else.

 

[PENG]

Wish I could help, but that one isn't on sale right now.

Thank you, by the way, if a D&M AVR is purchased from an US authorized dealer, would the warranty be still valid in Canada, or it has to be sent to Denon US for repair within the warranty period? I don't want to assume, because there is a thing called international warranty.

 

[Bookmark]

Yes those prices are from an authorised dealer and have been for at least a month. My new Marantz 6012 is with a 5 year warranty.

Yes you are quite right I think the US dollar/pound is currently $1.3/£1. Canadian is worse $1.74/£1. I mentioned the £=$ equivalent only because we have 20% vat and we usually get stuffed when it comes from the US. We would also get hammered on import if we tried that.

 

[Bookmark]

The 6012 has full set of 11 pre-outs and 7.1 in. The only difference I have spotted is the claimed 125W per channel as opposed to 110W and the Auro 3D decode. Both are 9 channel amps

 

[PENG]

The 6012 has full set of 11 pre-outs and 7.1 in. The only difference I have spotted is the claimed 125W per channel as opposed to 110W and the Auro 3D decode. Both are 9 channel amps

I wouldn't compare the SR6012 to the X3400H though, the X4400H unless it is for 7 channel use. In early models, it was easy to compare, but not since the 3300, 6011 when Marantz started to bump their 6000 series up one notch.

Since that time, we have them in the following ascending order in terms of specs and price, to a point:
The X4400H vs SR6012 is that the Marantz had the 7.1 analog in but other than that the Denon is more comparable to the SR7012 so I would put the Denon half a notch above.

X2300H/X2400H
SR5011/SR5012
X3300H/X3400H
SR6011/SR6012
X4300H/X4400H
SR7011/SR7012
X6300H/X6400H
X7200WA
SR8012
X8500H

 

[PENG]

Yes those prices are from an authorised dealer and have been for at least a month. My new Marantz 6012 is with a 5 year warranty.

Yes you are quite right I think the US dollar/pound is currently $1.3/£1. Canadian is worse $1.74/£1. I mentioned the £=$ equivalent only because we have 20% vat and we usually get stuffed when it comes from the US. We would also get hammered on import if we tried that.

In Canada we have the HST, currently at 13%. I was in the UK for a couple of years so I do know about the VAT, it might have a few % point lower back then but I also remember they had some discount stores, similar to our Bestbuy here, one of them sounded like Larsky, or something like that, it was so long ago, don't really remember...

 

[Bookmark]

The comparison was between the Marantz 7012 and 6012 and the reason I went with the 6012. Specs wise they both compare with the Denon 4400 rather than the 3400 which is only a 7 channel amp. Obviously what the claimed output per channel is differs.

https://www.crutchfield.com/S-IgXnInxVuVx/compare_642SR6012_642SR7012/Marantz-SR6012-vs-Marantz-SR7012.html

Richer and Superfi would be our equivalents by the sound of it.

 

[PENG]

The comparison was between the Marantz 7012 and 6012 and the reason I went with the 6012. Specs wise they both compare with the Denon 4400 rather than the 3400 which is only a 7 channel amp. Obviously what the claimed output per channel is differs.

https://www.crutchfield.com/S-IgXnInxVuVx/compare_642SR6012_642SR7012/Marantz-SR6012-vs-Marantz-SR7012.html

Richer and Superfi would be our equivalents by the sound of it.

Exactly, that's why I used the term "half a notch", it's a matter how you weight the pros and cons of each. In Canada, I think they sell a lot more Denon 4400 than Marantz 7012 due to the huge price gap and that means the dealer can get even more aggressive on discounting the Denon because of the volume, sort of a vicious circle.

For D&M, there is a little tell tale sign about whether they have the same amp section, it's the THD and the so called power consumption specs. Note that for Denon, you get to 0.05% (125W) from the 4400 up, whereas for Marantz you have to get to the 7012. I am quite sure the 4400 and 7012 has the same amp section. In the real world, 0.05 and 0.08% THD specs means nothing though, in my opinion anyway. In fact, I did not find the 4400 sound any different than the 3400 at all, and I have tried very hard to listen for differences using the exact same setup playing the same music files. I'll be moving it into the HT room today and don't expect it to sound any "less" than the Marantz AVP that it is replacing either, but I actually hope that I'll be wrong.

 

[Bookmark]

Well hopefully the best or worst of luck in that regard then

 

[PENG]

Well hopefully the best or worst of luck in that regard then

You're mind reader right? Yep I figure either way I should be happy, because the AV8801 will let me "dial in" my two channel set up downstairs. The 4400 did just that, took care of a few huge room mode related bumps and even a couple dips (just partially though), and it is for two channel that I am much more critical on sound quality.

 

[DigitalDawn]

Thank you, by the way, if a D&M AVR is purchased from an US authorized dealer, would the warranty be still valid in Canada, or it has to be sent to Denon US for repair within the warranty period? I don't want to assume, because there is a thing called international warranty.

I'm pretty sure that the Warranty is for the US only when purchased from a US dealer.