audyssey flat or reference, subwoofer

R

RTG

Audioholic
I’ve been using Audyssey now for years. I’m on my 4th AVR that features it, currently have the Denon 4300. Prior to my Denon I had the Marantz 7009. I went with the 4300 because I wanted 4K pass through and DTS X. My speakers are Klipsch RP’s. Ive had them 1.5 years. I was strictly using the Flat curve with these speakers and recently decided to try Reference for a bit and to my surprise I much prefer it over Flat. I’ve calibrated many times in the last few weeks, moving my speakers and subs in different locations etc. My reason for trying the Reference curve was because I was considering mounting my 140sa because the Atmos effect wasn’t that impressive. I recalibrated and watched the Superman UHD in Atmos and wow, what a difference. The above effect sounded much more realistic and precise in the Reference curve. I’ve watched a bunch of 4K titles recently and the Reference curve sounded better. Skyscraper sounded incredible, even my wife asked what changed. It just sounds more balanced and realistic. My speakers now disappear into my room. I switched to the Flat curve years ago since modern BD’s are EQ’d for the home and I didn’t want midrange compensation thinking the Flat curve was correct. My theatre room is in basement and has plenty of absorption with carpeting, a thick shag between my front sound stage and a large fabric sectional with 2 ottomans and thick curtains on the side. I switched back to Flat today while watching the Hateful 8 and immediately noticed that the Flat curve draws too much attention. The sound was detailed and crisp but also sterile. It didn’t sound cinematic. Switched back to Reference and bingo, my speakers disappeared once again I was back into the movie. I was regretting getting rid of Marantz since I missed the warmth but now consider the Denon to be superior with more prowess and detail and now with the Reference curve soundtracks have that warmth I was missing.
 
D

Danzilla31

Audioholic Samurai
Go ahead and run it again. You will get a different result more likely than not and a different result as many times as you care to run it. Which one will you believe? I have just spent a couple of weeks exploring Audyssey Multi EQ/XT. It is a total slayer of audio fidelity. This is a very nasty product indeed and Dynamic Eq being particularly evil. I have just spent an intensive two weeks with this product and have come to understand how really dreadful it is.

I guess I should have anticipated it, as it sounds too good to be true and it is. To have even thought a tiny featherweight mic connected to a device with an unbalanced cable thinner than a piece of spaghetti would lead to audio nirvana was absurd. It can't and does not.

I will give a full report in a few days or so documenting how bad a system this is.

If it is accurate reproduction you want then leave Audyssey and all its additions, especially Dynamic Eq firmly switched to off, and make sure it is, as if you don't set the set up lock to on, it has a habit of continuing to haunt your system. Just an incredibly awful program.
I'm really looking forward to your findings I too have had a lot of issues with Audyssey as of late and once I switched it too off noticed a big improvement in both music movies bass midrange and treble. I now just use to calibrate the subs get distances right and set channel levels Which it does really well. then I just turn the whole thing completely off. All eq period. And then I adjust channel levels and crossovers on my own from there till it sounds just right

I also really really noticed the issues in treble. And I even noticed a big improvement in the bass. Couldn't tell you why but it's there like I said really interested to hear more feedback from you on this might help me to understand why.
 
S

smallsmx3

Audiophyte
I’ve been using Audyssey now for years. I’m on my 4th AVR that features it, currently have the Denon 4300. Prior to my Denon I had the Marantz 7009. I went with the 4300 because I wanted 4K pass through and DTS X. My speakers are Klipsch RP’s. Ive had them 1.5 years. I was strictly using the Flat curve with these speakers and recently decided to try Reference for a bit and to my surprise I much prefer it over Flat. I’ve calibrated many times in the last few weeks, moving my speakers and subs in different locations etc. My reason for trying the Reference curve was because I was considering mounting my 140sa because the Atmos effect wasn’t that impressive. I recalibrated and watched the Superman UHD in Atmos and wow, what a difference. The above effect sounded much more realistic and precise in the Reference curve. I’ve watched a bunch of 4K titles recently and the Reference curve sounded better. Skyscraper sounded incredible, even my wife asked what changed. It just sounds more balanced and realistic. My speakers now disappear into my room. I switched to the Flat curve years ago since modern BD’s are EQ’d for the home and I didn’t want midrange compensation thinking the Flat curve was correct. My theatre room is in basement and has plenty of absorption with carpeting, a thick shag between my front sound stage and a large fabric sectional with 2 ottomans and thick curtains on the side. I switched back to Flat today while watching the Hateful 8 and immediately noticed that the Flat curve draws too much attention. The sound was detailed and crisp but also sterile. It didn’t sound cinematic. Switched back to Reference and bingo, my speakers disappeared once again I was back into the movie. I was regretting getting rid of Marantz since I missed the warmth but now consider the Denon to be superior with more prowess and detail and now with the Reference curve soundtracks have that warmth I was missing.
Have you turned it completely off?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
 
R

RTG

Audioholic
Have you turned it completely off?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
I’ve gone back to the Flat curve with Dynamic EQ engaged. I like both curves but the midrange compensation and high frequency roll off doesn’t sound as good on my Klipsch RP’s. I love the detail and clarity of the Flat curve.
 
S

smallsmx3

Audiophyte
I’ve gone back to the Flat curve with Dynamic EQ engaged. I like both curves but the midrange compensation and high frequency roll off doesn’t sound as good on my Klipsch RP’s. I love the detail and clarity of the Flat curve.
That's where I'm at. Just got my first Denon. I have Klipsch RPs and I feel like allot of detail is lost or dialogue is muddy on reference

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
 
R

RTG

Audioholic
That's where I'm at. Just got my first Denon. I have Klipsch RPs and I feel like allot of detail is lost or dialogue is muddy on reference

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
I’ve been using the Flat curve for a few years, on my last Marantz and now my Denon 4300. I was trying the Reference curve for about a month and initially was very impressed which is why I posted my thoughts but then started to miss the clarity of Flat. I also noticed bass and dialogue sounded muddier in the Reference curve. I watched Fallout UHD yesterday and the clarity and detail of the RP’s are front and center in the Flat curve on the Denon. I love the sound of Klipsch RP line and don’t want them rolled off.
 
S

smallsmx3

Audiophyte
I’ve been using the Flat curve for a few years, on my last Marantz and now my Denon 4300. I was trying the Reference curve for about a month and initially was very impressed which is why I posted my thoughts but then started to miss the clarity of Flat. I also noticed bass and dialogue sounded muddier in the Reference curve. I watched Fallout UHD yesterday and the clarity and detail of the RP’s are front and center in the Flat curve on the Denon. I love the sound of Klipsch RP line and don’t want them rolled off.
Still tweaking. Haven't really watched a action packed movie yet. So far for my every day listening flat seems to be the best. I'm digging reference for games as it adds that extra oomf

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
 
R

RTG

Audioholic
Still tweaking. Haven't really watched a action packed movie yet. So far for my every day listening flat seems to be the best. I'm digging reference for games as it adds that extra oomf

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
It’s funny you bring up gaming because that’s where I really noticed the high frequency roll off and why I switched back to Flat.
 
S

smallsmx3

Audiophyte
It’s funny you bring up gaming because that’s where I really noticed the high frequency roll off and why I switched back to Flat.
I'll have to check it out. First time gaming with it and it was on reference. I'll switch and see if I like it. I don't use a sub at the moment so my rp8000fs are set to large.

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lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Slumlord
The reference curve is specifically aimed at movie soundtracks fwiw. Games could be a different experience. Or music.
 
R

RTG

Audioholic
Right, I think a high frequency roll off or even midrange compensation found in the Reference curve was ideal for older home releases that weren’t mastered for the home. Blu-rays/UHD’s are mixed for the home environment now so for me personally I don’t see the benefit of rolling off the highs and the dip in the Midrange. Obviously it depends on the room and speakers as well. I sit 9 feet away from my towers and center, I also have a good amount of soft furnishings, a large sectional with ottomans, shag rug, carpeting and thick curtains in my room. The Reference curve is too dull in my dedicated room. When I was living in apartments with more reflective surfaces the Reference curve sounded better.

It’s good to see Audyssey give the option to turn off MRC now with the app at least.
 
B

bradymartin

Full Audioholic
well ive still been experimenting and cant decide flat or audyssey off, i like both.

side note, i just noticed source volume select. i upped that all the way to +12

that seems to have fixed my problem of always needing to turn the volume up very high to my liking.
 
S

smallsmx3

Audiophyte
well ive still been experimenting and cant decide flat or audyssey off, i like both.

side note, i just noticed source volume select. i upped that all the way to +12

that seems to have fixed my problem of always needing to turn the volume up very high to my liking.
Where's that ?

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
 
R

RTG

Audioholic
Decided to try the app for my Denon X4300. Wow. What a difference. I’ve been using the Flat curve to avoid MRC but never liked the idea of a Flat EQ. I’ve had many AVR’s that use Audyssey but it’s always sounded processed to me. I avoided Reference due to MRC. Using the App it looks like my levels are more accurate. Before my subs were set at -5, now -3.5. I limited the MultiEQ to 300hz, turned off MCR. Chose Reference 1 and left DEQ engaged since it sounds excellent in my room. Pumped up the XO to 100hz for my mains and 150hz for my surrounds, surround backs and Atmos modules. The difference is substantial. I have Klipsch RP’s and felt Audyssey has always choked the top end. Limiting to 300hz has put me into sonic bliss. Clarity and detail is significantly better but also smoother and not as fatiguing. My speakers now have the warmth back.
 
B

bradymartin

Full Audioholic
Decided to try the app for my Denon X4300. Wow. What a difference. I’ve been using the Flat curve to avoid MRC but never liked the idea of a Flat EQ. I’ve had many AVR’s that use Audyssey but it’s always sounded processed to me. I avoided Reference due to MRC. Using the App it looks like my levels are more accurate. Before my subs were set at -5, now -3.5. I limited the MultiEQ to 300hz, turned off MCR. Chose Reference 1 and left DEQ engaged since it sounds excellent in my room. Pumped up the XO to 100hz for my mains and 150hz for my surrounds, surround backs and Atmos modules. The difference is substantial. I have Klipsch RP’s and felt Audyssey has always choked the top end. Limiting to 300hz has put me into sonic bliss. Clarity and detail is significantly better but also smoother and not as fatiguing. My speakers now have the warmth back.
what do you mean by MCR? ive never tried the app on my denon 3300
 
S

smallsmx3

Audiophyte
Midrange Compensation. It’s an intentional dip. I highly recommend trying the app. My room has never sounded this good.
Which RPs? And which app?

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