Any of you guys into headphones?

[warpdrive]

I've rediscovered the joys of headphone listening for music. And even started to use headphones so I can watch movies later at night without disturbing the wife. It's not surround, but my Yamaha receiver gives a good sense of ambience with its Silent Surround headphone circuit.

 

[WmAx]

I've rediscovered the joys of headphone listening for music. And even started to use headphones so I can watch movies later at night without disturbing the wife. It's not surround, but my Yamaha receiver gives a good sense of ambience with its Silent Surround headphone circuit.

I am a regular headphone user[how else would I get great sound when away from home?]; I regularly try out headphones in an attempt to find better ones for my preference(s)/use(s). So... I'll gladly talk about headphones!

-Chris

 

[warpdrive]

Are you a fellow head-fi member? I'm suffering from supreme headphone upgraditis....I'm tend to want to try new headphones. It's so much cheaper experimenting and upgrading headphones than anything else, and it's like speakers, every headphone has something unique to offer.

Right now, I'm using my new Etymotics ER-4S plugged into a Airhead amp for portable use, or my Grado SR-60's when I don't want isolation.

At home, I'm using Grado SR225's. Their supreme detail works really well for movies, I find I can understand dialogue more clearly with these headphones while watching movies. They don't go terribly deep in the bass, but explosions and stuff are rendered with lots of impact. Very nice.

 

[Sleestack]

Very much into headphones. I have 2 setups:

Sennheiser HD650 w/ Equinox cable + maxed out singlepower MPX3/

AKG K1000s w/ Equinox cable + EAR Yoshino V20.

I also have a bunch of canalphones and the ATH W1000s.

Headphones are reat for a mor intimate listening experience and if you love detail. I do prefer my speaker setup, but headphone setups are a definite must for late night listening.

 

[warpdrive]

That's one nice setup!

 

[WmAx]

Are you a fellow head-fi member?

Yes, I am a head-fi member, though I do not post often on the forum. The site has too much snake-oil and bull_hit for me. However, I do regularly go to head-fi meets, in order to hear the newest headphone offerings in my search for a headphone that better fits my preferences.

-Chris

 

[warpdrive]

Yeah, I know what you mean about snake oil.....however.

What I like about headphones is that every model has something different to offer and I can switch models depending on what kind of music I'm listening to, and changing amplification seems to have bigger effect for me than changing amplification with a full sized stereo. I can clearly hear differences in the music when driven out of my computer, iPod, receiver, portable amp etc. I have tried a few of the pad changes on my Grado's, and because they the very small acoustical environment is sensitive to changes in distance and seal, the differences can also be heard quite readily.

 

[WmAx]

, and changing amplification seems to have bigger effect for me than changing amplification with a full sized stereo. I can clearly hear differences in the music when driven out of my computer, iPod, receiver, portable amp etc.

Just as in the case of loudspeaker amplification, such percieved changes in sound with headphone amplification are likely psychological, as opposed to being physical. It would take a significant difference in output source impedance between amplification stages to change the frequency balance[audibly] on most headphones. Alternatively, a frequency response curve could be built into the amplification device[not unheard of in hi-end equipment], or a technical deficiency could cause a low frequency roloff that is premature[insufficient output coupling capacitors on amplification device, when used with a low impedance headphone]. Noise level is a difference that is not uncommon; but this is easily identified/obvious.

-Chris

 

[Sleestack]

Just as in the case of loudspeaker amplification, such percieved changes in sound with headphone amplification are likely psychological, as opposed to being physical. It would take a significant difference in output source impedance between amplification stages to change the frequency balance[audibly] on most headphones. Alternatively, a frequency response curve could be built into the amplification device[not unheard of in hi-end equipment], or a technical deficiency could cause a low frequency roloff that is premature[insufficient output coupling capacitors on amplification device, when used with a low impedance headphone]. Noise level is a difference that is not uncommon; but this is easily identified/obvious.

-Chris

No offense, but if someone wasn't able to hear the difference between the headphone jacks on my various amps, they would have to have ears made of mud. I have headphone amps ranging from $500 - $5000. The differences are not psychological in any way.

 

[WmAx]

No offense, but if someone wasn't able to hear the difference between the headphone jacks on my various amps, they would have to have ears made of mud. I have headphone amps ranging from $500 - $5000. The differences are not psychological in any way.

If your amps have audible differences, then they will meet one of the qualifications[thus being easily measurable and coorelated with known human JNDs] as I stated in the last reply. It is irrelevant if your headphone amp costs $100 or $5000. Driving a headphone, linearly, is simple. When you start spending several hundreds of dollars for a headphone amplifier[that does not have an exclusive sound processing/effects ability], it would appear that more issues than just sound quality are a factor to the individual purchasing this product. I will not comment on this issue further, in the thread, in response to you, as it would be thread-jacking. If the original poster wants to go into this topic in the thread, then I will continue[with his authorization]. However, if this is a subject of interest to you, and you want to discuss it further, please open a new thread that is specifically targeted towards this subject and I will participate.

-Chris

 

[Sleestack]

If your amps have audible differences, then they will meet one of the qualifications[thus being easily measurable and coorelated with known human JNDs] as I stated in the last reply. It is irrelevant if your headphone amp costs $100 or $5000. Driving a headphone, linearly, is simple. When you start spending several hundreds of dollars for a headphone amplifier[that does not have an exclusive sound processing/effects ability], it would appear that more issues than just sound quality are a factor to the individual purchasing this product. I will not comment on this issue further, in the thread, in response to you, as it would be thread-jacking. If the original poster wants to go into this topic in the thread, then I will continue[with his authorization]. However, if this is a subject of interest to you, and you want to discuss it further, please open a new thread that is specifically targeted towards this subject and I will participate.

-Chris

They are all tube amps using different tubes. Surely you would agree that might be a reason they sound different? Without even knowing what equipment I am using, how can you make the assumption that they basically all sound the same and that their relative prices do not correspond to some appreciable improvement in sound quality.

 

[warpdrive]

Just as in the case of loudspeaker amplification, such percieved changes in sound with headphone amplification are likely psychological, as opposed to being physical.

If you can't hear the differences of the amp from my computer sound card, iPod, and my portable amps, I'd have to question your sense of hearing. The differences in just frequency response, distortion are very clearly measurable, and definitely audible.

I would not presume to assume that Sleestack's amps don't have an audible sound signature from amp to amp especially driving the very high end cans he owns. Did you ever meet Ray Samuel at the head-fi meets? He likes to do is have an A/B comparator on hand to demo his new amps, and you can try it for yourself whether you can identify which amp he has switched on.

Edit:
Why would he do that if he doesn't believe his own amps aren't an improvement in sound quality? Wouldn't he be shooting himself in the foot if you couldn't tell the difference and you couldn't identify his $1200 amp to his own $400 one?

 

[Sleestack]

If you can't hear the differences of the amp from my computer sound card, iPod, and my portable amps, I'd have to question your sense of hearing. The differences in just frequency response, distortion are very clearly measurable, and definitely audible.

I would not presume to assume that Sleestack's amps don't have an audible sound signature from amp to amp especially driving the very high end cans he owns. Did you ever meet Ray Samuel at the head-fi meets? He likes to do is have an A/B comparator on hand to demo his new amps, and you can try it for yourself whether you can identify which amp he has switched on.

Ahh Ray. What a great designer and audiophile. I just ordered his new XR-10B phone stage.

For the record my headphone amps:

Musical Fidelity X-can v3
Maxed Singlepower MPX3
EAR Yoshino V20

 

[warpdrive]

I was considering the Musical Fidelity XCAN. How do you like it? I don't intend to spend a fortune on an amp, so I want something that is good, and get me an noticeable improvement over my portable amps, and can drive any headphone I might buy in the future. I'm considering taking back my AKG K340's I permenantly lend to my father-in-law.

 

[Sleestack]

I was considering the Musical Fidelity XCAN. How do you like it?

I really like it. I think it holds its own against any amp in its price range. It has plenty of power and a touch of tube warmth. It isn't quite as crisp as my high end amps in the upper ranges, but it very capably drives my HD650s.

Which portable amps doyou use? I have had the SR-71 (fantastic sound) and the SM v3 (excellent sound and fantastic features). I would say that the SR-71 actually was my favorite out of the 3.

 

[WmAx]

Without even knowing what equipment I am using, how can you make the assumption that they basically all sound the same

Read what I stated in the posts. I was very specific.

and that their relative prices do not correspond to some appreciable improvement in sound quality.

No one has ever demonstrated such and published such in a reliable and credible listening test.

-Chris

 

[WmAx]

If you can't hear the differences of the amp from my computer sound card, iPod, and my portable amps, I'd have to question your sense of hearing. The differences in just frequency response, distortion are very clearly measurable, and definitely audible.

Nice statment. Read my posts, where I carefully qualify my statements.

I would not presume to assume that Sleestack's amps don't have an audible sound signature from amp to amp especially driving the very high end cans he owns.

True, they can sound different. The amps could have severe[audible] frequency response irregularities, as one example. However, an amplifier should amplify a signal linearly, which is a trival task. You can adjust the tonal balance(and with far grater precision) using a precision equalization device.

Did you ever meet Ray Samuel at the head-fi meets? He likes to do is have an A/B comparator on hand to demo his new amps, and you can try it for yourself whether you can identify which amp he has switched on.

1. It is a sighted test. Flawed from the start.

2. If you want to know the actual variables, even in a double-blind test, you have to measure/verify that all response characteristics were below known human JNDs, if a positive result is achieved in such a test.

Why would he do that if he doesn't believe his own amps aren't an improvement in sound quality? Wouldn't he be shooting himself in the foot if you couldn't tell the difference and you couldn't identify his $1200 amp to his own $400 one?

It's immaterial what he believes. That is another subject. What matters, is what one can prove, using rational procedure(s).

-Chris

 

[warpdrive]

Read what I stated in the posts. I was very specific.
No one has ever demonstrated such and published such in a reliable and credible listening test.

If Ray Samuels shows up at a head-fi meet, Try an A/B comparator yourself.
You don't need to wait for a credible report. If you can identify the amp in a statistically significant fashion, then that's all the proof you need. You can do whatever it takes to make it fair and objective test.

 

[Sleestack]

Read what I stated in the posts. I was very specific.



No one has ever demonstrated such and published such in a reliable and credible listening test.

-Chris

I see that you qualified your statement by essentially saying that certain high-end gear purposely introduce specific sound signatures, so I am assuming that you are referring to things such as tube amps that use different tubes. If so, I apologize for not reading more carefully.

I definitely don't think price always correlates to better sound. I'm not saying my $2500 MPX3 sounds 5 times better than my X-can, but IMO, the improvement it offers was worth paying $2100 more.

 

[warpdrive]

I really like it. I think it holds its own against any amp in its price range. It has plenty of power and a touch of tube warmth. It isn't quite as crisp as my high end amps in the upper ranges, but it very capably drives my HD650s.

Which portable amps doyou use? I have had the SR-71 (fantastic sound) and the SM v3 (excellent sound and fantastic features). I would say that the SR-71 actually was my favorite out of the 3.

I have an Airhead, and tried the Go-Vibe. Was pretty happy with the improvement those made compared to my computer and iPod output. The output of my Yamaha receiver sound noticeably cleaner than my portable setup, and I wonder how much of an improvement can be had from a outboard amp.

I want to try something that is considered good like the VCAN, and see how much of an improvement it makes, if any. I have Grado's so a mellower warmer sound isn't a bad thing.