Another piece of info for you Bush bashers..

[Davemcc]

I have some cogitatin' to do.

That's why I like having these discussions with you. You always put the thought and effort towards a constructive discussion.

There certainly are a great many factors at play in all these scenarios. For instance, there seemed to be no economic fallout after WWII. I would attribute this to the utter distruction of the European means of food and finished goods production, while at the same time America (which had not fought on it's own soil) still had it's massive industrial potential at it's peak productivity. The Marshall Plan created instant customers in Europe and Asia for as much export as American industry could provide to those nations ravaged by war. Further, unemployment was significantly offset in the late 40's by women who had worked in the wartime economy leaving the workforce to stay at home, being replaced by decommissioned soldiers. Added even to that, the Korean war began just about the time one might have expected an economic downturn, restoring the wartime economy and extending the perceived boom by several years.

While things turned out relatively well after WWII, the end of the Vietnam war coincides with some disastrous economic policies that produced a far more severe and prolonged recession that otherwise might have been expected. There is no excuse in a market economy for wage and price controls. The damning effects should have been foreseen and expected, but we all suffered through that era.

No doubt economics is a complex web of interconnected policies, decisions and events. It does take a lot thinking to work it all out.

 

[bandphan]

That's why I like having these discussions with you. You always put the thought and effort towards a constructive discussion.

Im glad to see that this has stayed civil. The idea behind the thread was to get people to think about our current situation, and who/where blame should be layed or not. With the exception of a couple members spewing garbage, I think most might walk away with something possitive.

 

[darien87]

There certainly are a great many factors at play in all these scenarios. For instance, there seemed to be no economic fallout after WWII. I would attribute this to the utter distruction of the European means of food and finished goods production, while at the same time America (which had not fought on it's own soil) still had it's massive industrial potential at it's peak productivity.

Ummm... it's dEstruction professor.

Ha! I finally found something you're wrong about!!

J/K, what are you guys, a bunch of history teachers??? Good stuff getting thrown around here.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

No doubt economics is a complex web of interconnected policies, decisions and events. It does take a lot thinking to work it all out.

Clearly, the monkey currently occupying the oval office is incapable of such thinking, since the economy has gone to hell in a handbasket during his regime.

 

[majorloser]

Im glad to see that this has stayed civil. The idea behind the thread was to get people to think about our current situation, and who/where blame should be layed or not. With the exception of a couple members spewing garbage, I think most might walk away with something possitive.

Staying civil???

I can't believe that this thread is still open and nobody has got banned.
(must be some weird planatary alignment)

 

[Tomorrow]

Further, unemployment was significantly offset in the late 40's by women who had worked in the wartime economy leaving the workforce to stay at home, being replaced by decommissioned soldiers.

This is just a sidebar addition to to the other conversation and to the above...but it seems worth mentioning. I believe this was the very beginning of the "women's movement" in the U.S. (The movement didn't have a name or focus until Betty Frieden and that group politicized and co-opted the ownership of the natural momentum of the social events of the time.)

In North America, women had primarily played traditional family roles throughout our history. But in the early '40's the need for quickly ramped up production of the war machine and support goods required a huge homeland effort...led by women. I remember my mom building wiring harnesses for transport aircraft at Convair. She ultimately enjoyed working so much, having her own separate means for support and purchasing power, that she continued working and progressing in business until she died. I'd have to guess, in addition to your points, it was that societal female energy which put our economy at the time into overdrive.

 

[itschris]

Clearly, the monkey currently occupying the oval office is incapable of such thinking, since the economy has gone to hell in a handbasket during his regime.

Many intelligent people, even those who vehemently disagree with current policy, will concede that Bush is no monkey. Silly name calling like that is the childish rhetoric of the left wing ignorants and I presume you're not one of those because I've gotten the impression over my months here that you're not a dumb person. When you say things like that, it's hard to recognize let alone honor your credibility... and I mean that more as a blanket statement to all as opposed to any one individual.

No one person, monkey or not, nor country, singularily controls their own economy. It has not been that way for nearly 15 years since global economies became interconnected overnight. I'm degreed in both finance and economics and work for a large international borkerage firm. We look, study, and discuss these thing everyday.

Two of the most obvious impacts to our economy were gas prices and the subprime/housing debacle... neither of which are controlled by the governement lest you think otherwise. Capitalism and free-market capitalism in a free nation are two very very different things. There is a certain self-policing that's assumed and when that breaks down, sometimes the country's economy will be punished. Downturns, even recessions are natural and needed part of the economic cycle. Gas prices are largely driven by two things and two things only: demand and futures trading... not the government and not the "big oil" companies. Most of the stereo equipment you buy has a greater profit margin on it than what the oil companies make.

The housing issue was created by overzealous lending due to low interest rates. This in turn caused priced to skyrocket because suddenly you could borrow more money for the same cost than you could the year before, so people didn't care that they may have been paying more for a house than it was worth. As this continued, speculators entered the fray and drove prices even higer... again... a supply and demand phenom. Oddly enough, the institution in most peril right now is the Fanny Mae/Freddie Mac institutions because they were far more irresponsible than most other lenders and circumvented the conversative principles they were governed by for profit's sake. If you want to point fingers, you may want to keep them in your pocket if you're a Bush Basher because many on the boards of those agencies are populated with several high ranking former Clinton advisors.

There are many to blame for our current economic situation. To some degree, the Adminisitration, to some degree the Congress who can actually exert quite a bit of infuence (yet this current congress by all accounts is the most inactive in nearly 20 years), private industry, and individuals (like my neighbor who paid $500K for his house and is losing it because he can't understand how his $900/month pmt went to $2800 after 3 years. He thinks it's unfair and is owed something. He's a perfect example of what's wrong with all of this.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

Silly name calling like that is the childish rhetoric of the left wing ignorants and I presume you're not one of those because I've gotten the impression over my months here that you're not a dumb person.

Left wing, definitely. Ignorant, just as definitely not. There are a lot of things I could have called him, "monkey" is one of the nicest ones. Would you prefer "scum", perhaps?
At least we are almost rid of him. Hopefully, we can get some Democrats in to fix his many mistakes.

 

[rnatalli]

At least we are almost rid of him. Hopefully, we can get some Democrats in to fix his many mistakes.

And make a mountain of their own. Frankly, I don't trust either party anymore.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

And make a mountain of their own. Frankly, I don't trust either party anymore.

Now that I can agree with!
My dad once said "Never trust anyone capable of getting elected".

 

[itschris]

Left wing, definitely. Ignorant, just as definitely not. There are a lot of things I could have called him, "monkey" is one of the nicest ones. Would you prefer "scum", perhaps?
At least we are almost rid of him. Hopefully, we can get some Democrats in to fix his many mistakes.

Like what specifically? What do you think a Obama is going to do? And what mistakes is he going fix and how... specifically.... is he going to fix them? I'm not trying to take you task, but I'm genuinely interested. I have found most people really cannot detail nor support the rhetoric they so often speak as pure truth... so I'm genuinely interested in your thoughts.

I'm a fairly ardent conservative and I'm no fan of the Bill Clinton, but I can recognize the positive things he did and would never reduce him to name calling. I don't know the man.... I met him once and I can tell you that I was floored by the charisma the guy has... and that only left me feeling more disappointed in his presidency because he really could have been something great, but seemed too overly concerned about his celebrity.

The truth is, most of us, especially the outspoken detractors, really don't know anything about the person they so matter of factly speak of. You don't know what motivates a president, nor do you have any clue what's behind the decisions or acts that are made or done. We have zero concept of the complexity of running a country, so while you may disagree with the choices, at least have the forethought to understand that many of them are made because they are believed in and are thought to be the right ones at the time.

Having dealt with differing levels of governement on issues like healthcare, you'd be surprised by the deep belief some lawmakers have in the most misguided and outright wrong thought process. They may be wrong, but some times, the thought behind it is genuine. Until I know a person, and no there's something more sinister behind the curtain, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.

 

[bandphan]

Left wing, definitely. Ignorant, just as definitely not. There are a lot of things I could have called him, "monkey" is one of the nicest ones. Would you prefer "scum", perhaps?
At least we are almost rid of him. Hopefully, we can get some Democrats in to fix his many mistakes.

you have had democrats in for a while

 

[bandphan]

Staying civil???

I can't believe that this thread is still open and nobody has got banned.
(must be some weird planatary alignment)

Lets just say " I Have A Dream" or "Change"

 

[Audioholics]

It's kind of silly to ban people over a political thread, but I'll go ahead and close it.

Last parting shot: Some people in here are tools. You can identify a tool by the fact that they repeat themseleves over and over, call people names and never actually make any valid points. You know who you are (actually you probably dont, but everyone else does...)

 

[mike c]

i've got nothing to do with this one

closed political threads tally
mike c : 1
Clint DeBoer : 2,456,987