8500 not on Denon’s website

V

Vince NC

Audioholic Intern
I was just on Denon’s website. They have updated their site. It is a lot easier to navigate. But I could not find the 8500 AVR anywhere . Wonder what’s going on with that.
 
VMPS-TIII

VMPS-TIII

Audioholic Chief
I was just on Denon’s website. They have updated their site. It is a lot easier to navigate. But I could not find the 8500 AVR anywhere . Wonder what’s going on with that.
Can't image buying an 8500 when I can get a Denon 3600 for $799 and a Monoprice Monolith 7X for $1729... that's $2528 for a great Receiver and an amazing 200-300 watt 7 channel power amp.
 
mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
Can't image buying an 8500 when I can get a Denon 3600 for $799 and a Monoprice Monolith 7X for $1729... that's $2528 for a great Receiver and an amazing 200-300 watt 7 channel power amp.
Or the Denon 3600 for $799 and 3 Outlaw Monoblock 2220's for $999. That's $1798

The Denon can handle the other channels

 
K

Kleinst

Audioholic
That works too! :cool:

For those who have enough amps to even power Atmos/Heigets and maybe even surrounds, is there a benefit to using the more powerful AMP vs using the AVR for those channels? (not considering taking the load off the AVR)

I ask because I have one system with my LCR and surrounds on an amp and Atmos on another AMP. But thinking of cleaning up and just using the AVR for the Atmos. The AMP is twice the power. Would I likely just have to increase the level 3Db to be at the same level as with the AMP and no other difference?
 
VMPS-TIII

VMPS-TIII

Audioholic Chief
For those who have enough amps to even power Atmos/Heigets and maybe even surrounds, is there a benefit to using the more powerful AMP vs using the AVR for those channels? (not considering taking the load off the AVR)

I ask because I have one system with my LCR and surrounds on an amp and Atmos on another AMP. But thinking of cleaning up and just using the AVR for the Atmos. The AMP is twice the power. Would I likely just have to increase the level 3Db to be at the same level as with the AMP and no other difference?
If you are using the Denon 3600, 4500, 4700, 6500, 6700 and other models with Audyssey they will automatically setup the speaker volumes to match correctly no matter how many amps you use. It's not something you have to do manually. In fact, once you run Audyssey you should not alter the volume settings.

The receiver will easily handle the ATMOS speakers.
 
B

Bonscott

Enthusiast
Can't image buying an 8500 when I can get a Denon 3600 for $799 and a Monoprice Monolith 7X for $1729... that's $2528 for a great Receiver and an amazing 200-300 watt 7 channel power amp.
You can image it if you need 13 channels
 
Ponzio

Ponzio

Audioholic Samurai
Can't image buying an 8500 when I can get a Denon 3600 for $799 and a Monoprice Monolith 7X for $1729... that's $2528 for a great Receiver and an amazing 200-300 watt 7 channel power amp.
But, but ... you can get the 8500 in a beautiful silver fascia.

Yes, I'm that superficial. :p
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Or the Denon 3600 for $799 and 3 Outlaw Monoblock 2220's for $999. That's $1798

The Denon can handle the other channels

Agree, I can't understand why people using AVRs as prepros are willing to spend money on 7 channel amps when the internal amps are fine for the surround/height channels. For Denon/Marantz, one should always invest on a $20 fan(s), may as well use the internal amps. For a lot of people their surround/height channels likely cruise at less than 1 W 90% of the time, peaks to 50 W at the most, or 100 W for less than 0.5 s, if that would ever even happen.
 
VMPS-TIII

VMPS-TIII

Audioholic Chief
Agree, I can't understand why people using AVRs as prepros are willing to spend money on 7 channel amps when the internal amps are fine for the surround/height channels. For Denon/Marantz, one should always invest on a $20 fan(s), may as well use the internal amps. For a lot of people their surround/height channels likely cruise at less than 1 W 90% of the time, peaks to 50 W at the most, or 100 W for less than 0.5 s, if that would ever even happen.
Multi-channel Stereo mode is another story. It can easy place a strain on the receiver. That's not the case with external amps in place.
 
mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
Multi-channel Stereo mode is another story. It can easy place a strain on the receiver. That's not the case with external amps in place.
I think that percentage on straining a receiver is very low
 
VMPS-TIII

VMPS-TIII

Audioholic Chief
I used multi-stereo mode about 20% of the time on my Denon 4500 with just Center, Heights and Rear Surrounds on the receiver. It broke down in less than 9 months even WITH ECO mode in use. :D

Your experience may be different? But there's no doubt multi-channel mode places a much larger load on the receiver. The channels that broke on my Denon 4500 receiver were the Height channels.
 
mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
Are your Height channel's the same as your mains?

Has this happened to you multiple times or is it a one time thing maybe you just had a bad receiver
 
M Code

M Code

Audioholic General
Denon has pulled back the 8500.. :rolleyes:
As their flagship it required some updates for HDMI 2.1, Denon advised an update will be announced in January, 2021...

Just my $0.02... ;)
 
S

snakeeyes

Audioholic Ninja
Denon has pulled back the 8500.. :rolleyes:
As their flagship it required some updates for HDMI 2.1, Denon advised an update will be announced in January, 2021...

Just my $0.02... ;)
Are we looking at all AVRs with the Panasonic based HDMI2.1 being recalled from Denon and Yamaha? Or will they just give an option of repairs?
 
VMPS-TIII

VMPS-TIII

Audioholic Chief
Are your Height channel's the same as your mains?

Has this happened to you multiple times or is it a one time thing maybe you just had a bad receiver
The Front Left and Right used the preamp out on the Denon 4500 to an Adcom external amp. The Height channels were used simply with Height speakers.
 
mazersteven

mazersteven

Audioholic Warlord
I'm just trying to figure out what stressed out your receiver that bad in Multi Channel to fail. Hard speakers to drive?
 
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M Code

M Code

Audioholic General
Are we looking at all AVRs with the Panasonic based HDMI2.1 being recalled from Denon and Yamaha? Or will they just give an option of repairs?
Don't know... :(
Difficult situation under internal review by Sound United..
Will post more info when I get some updates...

Just my $0.02... ;)
 
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P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Multi-channel Stereo mode is another story. It can easy place a strain on the receiver. That's not the case with external amps in place.
I used to think that but now I think that is actually overrated.

Think about this, in a small, medium to medium large room you can typically get 3 dB more from the 2nd and 2 dB for 3rd speakers, and then another 1.5 to 1.0 dB for additional speakers up to 7 speakers.

So going from 2 channel stereo to 7 channel stereo, you will gain another 5.5 dB, so if you need 10 W to get the spl you want for 2 ch stereo, if you set to 7 ch stereo, you will need only 2.8 W total for the same spl, say you want to double the volume/spl/loudness when playing 7 channel stereo mode, you still only need a little more than half total watt of that require for two channel stereo. People normally listen to 7 channel stereo for the effects, not really about wanting louder because then they can just crank it up.

In a large room, it may be a little different, otherwise, it really doesn't mean you need more power for the surround channels when in 7 ch stereo mode unless you have speakers for those channels that have relatively lower sensitivity, impedance and higher power handling capability.

An external power amp will make no difference if you are not actually going to come close to needing the extra power, and yes I am talking about peaks too, not just average spl/power requirements.

Measurements will show that I am right.:D By the way, you do know I have my fair shares of external power amps so I am not being sour grapes, it is about scientific facts that are easily provable, not hearsay that are often there due to misconceptions..;) Again, to be clear, my comments are based on the conditions I specified, there are always conditions under which an external power amp will contribute to less distortions at the spl the user needs, but then even under those exceptional conditions, we all know, 200 W (Monolith) vs 120 W (AVR) isn't quit 3 dB more and that's why for people who is after more power, I would tend to recommend 300 W amps, and those that could do much better in terms of dynamic output, in order to make a real/significant difference.
 

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