Whole-house sound system - basic and simply accessible assembly

[NOKU]

Hi,

I am trying to compile equipment for a whole-house sound system which should be easy enough to use for anybody at the house without great explanation.
In principle I am trying to achieve the following:

1. Same sound throughout the house, but with the option to switch on off / control volume to individual zones.
At this stage I want to make sure any wiring is right, but would rather compromise on flexibility / controls to keep costs down (I am currently refurbishing the whole place whilst trying to include the ‘luxury’ of whole-house sound).

2. One manual radio tuner, ideally with some wall mounted control to tune into local radio stations (otherwise my father will go ape whenever he happens to be at the house).

3. One multizone amplifier for 8 zones, again with some wall mounted control panel to switch the amplifier on, select / switch on and off the 8 zones and control the volume(s).
In addition each one of the zones should have a simple manual volume control / on-off switch so that somebody in a bedroom could override / manually control the volume if the 'master' volume is for example too loud for them.

4. One 'bridge' to a network hard disc to access from my phone or pad any of my digital music as well as internet radio (Sonos or alternative?).
What would be great is if I could control the multizone amplifier / switch on off and control the volume of the 8 zones, but if this requires significantly more expensive equipment I rather rely on manual volume presets and control the overall volume via such bridge / application.

5. Auxilary input to such setup (via USB cable and/ or jack / mini jack ?) so that anybody not that confident with apps could simply plug in their phone / pad / notebook or even old-fashioned disc players, walkman, etc and play whatever music they have on their device with whatever software / setup they are used to.
As above, such AUX connection should be wall mounted and I would locate it next to the amplifier master control and tuner / next to a piece of furniture where one could park and plug in their device.

6. A simple manual input selector would suffice to make it 'idiot proof' (again something wall-mounted) to select between terrestrial radio, digital music collection and the auxiliary input.

This is a totally new setup and I would like to hard-wire all ceiling speakers.

Those are my questions:
1. Does anybody have good suggestions which equipment to combine without spending thousands for de facto background music as described above?

2. Is there one piece of kit / one wall plate which could cater for tuning, access to digital music collection, AUX input as well as manual zone control?
Could one control such panel also via the network / via some app in conjunction with e.g. Sonos? (not essential if this makes the assembly much more complicated and expensive, but I wondered whether there is such thing anywhere on the market)

3. Which ceiling speakers should I be looking at?
Typically I was thinking of 1 speaker per zone; only 3 zones would have 2 or more speakers due to the size of the zone (e.g. garden area).
Am I right to assume that stereo sound in relation to rooms is not an issue and one ceiling speaker is perfectly alright per room?

4. I am not looking for thumping music (I listen typically to jazz, classical, maybe some pop, but overall at levels so that one could still talk). What Wattage would I be looking for the 8 zone amplifier and each respective ceiling speaker (at the moment I am thinking of up to 15 speakers with the garden zone having up to 3 speakers).

Many questions…hopefully somebody can point me in the right direction,

Many thanks,
Norbert

 

[BMXTRIX]

There is no cheap way to deliver what you are asking for.

You can have it easy to control and robust = fairly pricey, or you can have it cheap and typically more difficult to control/less robust.

In a whole home system, zones can only be turned on/off discretely if there is a separate pre-amp for each zone.

Now, I'm not sure what you think 'expensive' is, so something like this is very inexpensive and provides up to 4 sources along with IR remote passthru...

Amazon.com: Russound CA4 Multizone Controller Amplifier System/Kit: Electronics

You can add sources as you want to.

Wiring is really what I would focus on, and while I would look at what separate systems require, generally, you want to run speaker wire from your head end (where the equipment is) to all the rooms keypad location, then up to the speakers in the rooms. You also want to run a piece of cat-5e/6 to each keypad in each room.

Standard systems call for 2 speakers in a room and speakers are sold as pairs. Other than some potential amplifier gains, there is no obvious reason to deviate from the industry standard on this. You will be getting a stereo source and unless you intend to buy stereo to mono converters, then you will need both channels in each room. They do sell stereo to mono adapters if this is the route you want to take, but a typical room often needs 2 or 4 speakers to fill it will sound evenly, regardless of the volume level in that room.

Sources for these types of systems are entirely up to you, you can pick any four, from any manufacturer you would like, and they will all be controllable from any of the rooms using the IR remote pass-thru capabilities of the keypads.

Better/more expensive keypads include integrated IR controls on the keypad directly which will allow for presets to be recalled right from the keypad. Those must all be programmed.

I use a higher end system, but still, the concept is the same - speaker wire to speakers, cat-5e to the keypads. Since I know exactly what keypads I would be using, I did not run my speaker wire to the keypads first. I use separate amplifiers and separate preamps, and separate controllers, unlike the fully integrated unit above which I linked to, but in principle it works the same.

You do (really) want to be careful with your outdoor zone as it may require more speakers/amplification to satisfy your needs and typically keypads can't be located outside conveniently. Once again, the unit I linked to provides a single output (per unit) which can be connected to an external dedicated amplifier which can handle multiple channels/speakers. The main unit can only handle one pair of speakers per room - and is designed for a speaker pair.

I use these speakers throughout my home for background music, and have been very happy with them...
For only $54.67 each when QTY 50+ purchased - 8 Inches Kevlar 2-Way In-Ceiling Speakers (Pair) - 80W Nominal, 160W Max

They are extremely inexpensive, and work very well.

I'm less than thrilled with their outdoor speakers...
For only $52.20 each when QTY 50+ purchased - 5-1/4 Inches 2-Way Indoor/Outdoor Waterproof Speakers (Pair) - 40W Nominal, 80W Max

There are some better outdoor speakers available at www.outdoorspeakerdepot.com which you may want to check out.

 

[NOKU]

Thank you for many useful hints!

To summarise:

1. would I combine 2 Russound units to achieve my 8 zones, or should I be looking at one 8-zone unit to achieve my 8 zones? Or would I combine 2 zones to work with the suggested Russound (as long as I can still install 8 wall plates for the sake of switching on-off / volume control all 8 zones individually)?

2. Is a Russound unit set up in such way that each zone could select it's own sound source (which would be great and more than I was hoping for!), or would this entail a further 7 amplifiers when reading through the Russound description? Could, say, bedroom 1 listen to Sonos whilst bedroom 2 tunes into the radio? What happens when bedroom 3 starts tuning the radio too on their wall pad when there is only one tuner?

3. I take it that some Sonos system would just plug into the Russound unit as another source, but ultimately controlled via some app / one Wifi device controlling the actual content on that “channel”?

4. I will check on Russound whether any mini-jack or maybe even USB can connect (I mentioned pad, phone or even as simple as a Walkman / disc player)

5. I take it that the remote would be the only central control when opting for Russound which would access the system via any wall pad of the 8 zones?

6. If choosing Russound, would it be o.k. to wire directly to min. 2x speakers per zone as your suggest, and have a separate cat-5e cable from the wall pad location to the central location? When would one ever need a speaker cable run past such a wall pad within a zone?

7. RE power / amplification: I am not sure I fully understood that aspect. Continuing from the previous speaker numbers, what sort of power would I need for de facto up to 30 speakers for in a stereo sound arrangement (i.e. min. 2 speakers per zone)?


It sounds simpler than I thought, but I have a feeling that I am still misunderstanding in particular “sources” and “amplifiers”…

 

[BMXTRIX]

1. would I combine 2 Russound units to achieve my 8 zones, or should I be looking at one 8-zone unit to achieve my 8 zones? Or would I combine 2 zones to work with the suggested Russound (as long as I can still install 8 wall plates for the sake of switching on-off / volume control all 8 zones individually)?

Yes, you would get two of those units. They offer a connection capability which allows the four sources to be shared by a total of two Russound units which means 4 sources to up to 8 rooms. You wouldn't double up on rooms, but would dedicate one speaker pair per room/zone. In an area with more than 2 speakers (outside?) then you will need to use an external amplifer for that one specific area and it must be on output four of the Russound.

2. Is a Russound unit set up in such way that each zone could select it's own sound source (which would be great and more than I was hoping for!), or would this entail a further 7 amplifiers when reading through the Russound description? Could, say, bedroom 1 listen to Sonos whilst bedroom 2 tunes into the radio? What happens when bedroom 3 starts tuning the radio too on their wall pad when there is only one tuner?

Yes, each zone would have a keypad and would independently be able to turn on/off a source of their choosing and adjust their volume locally.
Each source is a single item, so if you have multiple rooms using the same source then that's what that source is. If you want more sources than 4, you will need a different product, and you should expect to pay more. I use a 16x8 source product for my home. Lots of sources = better IMO, but it has a hefty price.

3. I take it that some Sonos system would just plug into the Russound unit as another source, but ultimately controlled via some app / one Wifi device controlling the actual content on that “channel”?

Any Sonos I believe can plug in as a source, and control of the Sonos itself can be run through a iOS/Android device. Likewise, if you have Apple stuff, you can throw an AppleTV w/Airplay onto it if you want. Lots of options.

4. I will check on Russound whether any mini-jack or maybe even USB can connect (I mentioned pad, phone or even as simple as a Walkman / disc player)

USB is not a audio source, it is a data source. Some products now support reading certain data streams from USB devices, but it is not a 'standard' under any circumstances at all. If you want a standard audio connection, then that would be a 1/8" mini jack or two RCA plugs.

5. I take it that the remote would be the only central control when opting for Russound which would access the system via any wall pad of the 8 zones?

I'm not even sure if the remote is a 'central' control point. I have not used their remote and it may just be a universal remote to control gear on the other end. On the other hand, it may act as a full system remote control to handle all zones... That would actually suprise me a bit. Getting a single remote that controls multiple zones starts getting into higher end gear which is often more specialized. I know Crestron, and I know I can do it - but it was thousands of dollars to get there.

6. If choosing Russound, would it be o.k. to wire directly to min. 2x speakers per zone as your suggest, and have a separate cat-5e cable from the wall pad location to the central location? When would one ever need a speaker cable run past such a wall pad within a zone?

You should follow the instructions with whatever you buy. Some wall pads have internal amplification and can power speakers right off the wall pad. Others just need a cat-5e cable at the wall pad. Depends on what you end up getting, but I run my speakers straight to the amplifier, and typically would follow that mentality.

7. RE power / amplification: I am not sure I fully understood that aspect. Continuing from the previous speaker numbers, what sort of power would I need for de facto up to 30 speakers for in a stereo sound arrangement (i.e. min. 2 speakers per zone)?

Not sure what you mean with 30 speakers. The Russound system only supports 2 speakers per zone, and the amps built into the system only support an 8 ohm load at fairly low volume. It's ideal for some nice background audio. If you have one zone with more than 2 speakers - like 8 or 16 or more, then you will need an external amplifier with enough power/channels to support your specific needs. Speakercraft, Niles, Sonance, and others all make multi-channel amplifiers designed for audio distribution. If you have a more specific area that needs a lot more speakers, then you will need to figure out exactly what you intend to do and amplify accordingly.

It sounds simpler than I thought, but I have a feeling that I am still misunderstanding in particular “sources” and “amplifiers”…

Sources are what you want to play across your home.
For example, in my home my audio (only) sources include AppleTV, XM Radio, and FM radio. We have a bunch of rooms available as destinations. I use external amplifiers for everything, but the Russound system has a built in 8 channel amplifier which can power up to 4 rooms with stereo sound (2 speakers per room, 8 speakers total). In my case, I have a bunch of 8 channel amplifiers which accomplish a very similar setup.

Should I be listening to XM radio in the kitchen, and my wife turns on XM radio in the master bathroom, and she changes the channel, then the channel changes in the kitchen as well.

If I didn't want that to happen, I would need to put a second XM radio onto my system so that I would have available to me 2 XM radios, AppleTV, and my FM tuner.

XM radio - AppleTV - FM tuner - Those are the sources.

Amplification matters a great deal in the fact that you need enough amplification for the speakers which will be used. Generally a room is a zone, and any single room will have a stereo speaker pair in it. If you go with that as your standard, then the Russound has enough amplification built in to support 4 rooms (8 speakers) per unit, and up to two units may be utilized with up to four sources total.

It's not a very complex setup that you asked for, but you could certainly ask for a lot more which will significantly change what you are required to purchase.