HELP WITH MY BUILD.. RE xxx or TC lms-r

[frankie2075]

hey guys im new to this fourm and looking for some input. what i have so far is a 10cu ft ported box and a Behringer Europower 4000 amp. now the ? is what driver would u guys uses and y? im thinking of RE audio xxx 15in or TC sounds lms-r 15in. thnaks

 

[lsiberian]

hey guys im new to this fourm and looking for some input. what i have so far is a 10cu ft ported box and a Behringer Europower 4000 amp. now the ? is what driver would u guys uses and y? im thinking of RE audio xxx 15in or TC sounds lms-r 15in. thnaks

How is the box tuned? You're suppose to build boxes for subs not the other way around.

 

[frankie2075]

How is the box tuned? You're suppose to build boxes for subs not the other way around.

box will be tuned to 15hz

 

[lsiberian]

box will be tuned to 15hz

Has the box already been built? If not I would suggest you start with the driver and build an optimal alignment. You might start with a smaller driver/project to get your feet wet.

 

[GranteedEV]

box will be tuned to 15hz

You said you already have a ported box. I'm confused.. The driver is much a part of the tuning.

Anyways, vented boxes with such low tunes are difficult. For example, the LMS-R 15" in 10 cu ft tuned to 15hz needs a 12.5" x 137" port to keep peak air velocity below 17m/s and avoid any noise. That's totally unrealistic. The first issue with that is your vent resonance is all the way down to 51hz. There's also the fact that such a port would add CONSIDERABLE total volume, which shouldn't be confused with internal air volume.

You want your vent resonance more than an octave above your crossover point, so you would need to cross over at 25hz in this scenario. Not happenin. The goal is to get vent resonance above 180hz, and air velocity below 17.3m/s. Otherwise forget using a port. The LMS-R IS an appropriate driver for a low tune helmholtz resontor, but you need passive radiators, not vents. I would presume the same applies to the more expensive Re XXX.

 

[frankie2075]

okay maybe i should of started like this i dont have a phsyical box built what i ment was i was going to go with Elemental designs and they were going to use there box from the A7-450 which is a 10cu ft box internal volume and make it so it fit one of those driver i thought about using.

 

[Warpdrv]

Just have them build a box to spec that you need for whichever driver you pick... that is important

 

[TLS Guy]

hey guys im new to this fourm and looking for some input. what i have so far is a 10cu ft ported box and a Behringer Europower 4000 amp. now the ? is what driver would u guys uses and y? im thinking of RE audio xxx 15in or TC sounds lms-r 15in. thnaks

You have it all backwards. The cabinet and form of loading are determined by the driver parameters.

You do not pull a box tuning frequency out of the air. Again that is determined by the driver.

 

[frankie2075]

i kno that what i done was use bass box pro to get the tuning fq and it was around 15hz i dont have anything built or bought yet im just talking in general to see if anyone has used any these drivers and how well do they work in a home theater. just what ideas and thought about it.. thanks

 

[lsiberian]

You said you already have a ported box. I'm confused.. The driver is much a part of the tuning.

Anyways, vented boxes with such low tunes are difficult. For example, the LMS-R 15" in 10 cu ft tuned to 15hz needs a 12.5" x 137" port to keep peak air velocity below 17m/s and avoid any noise. That's totally unrealistic. The first issue with that is your vent resonance is all the way down to 51hz. There's also the fact that such a port would add CONSIDERABLE total volume, which shouldn't be confused with internal air volume.

You want your vent resonance more than an octave above your crossover point, so you would need to cross over at 25hz in this scenario. Not happenin. The goal is to get vent resonance above 180hz, and air velocity below 17.3m/s. Otherwise forget using a port. The LMS-R IS an appropriate driver for a low tune helmholtz resontor, but you need passive radiators, not vents. I would presume the same applies to the more expensive Re XXX.

That's assuming a lot of the amp he's hooking up to it. I doubt he is going to get max power to that driver and the high speeds will be on material not really used. Passive radiators are preffered for the LMS drivers when porting. However porting this driver is unnecessary. It is designed to be sealed and eqed. If you have the space for a big ported sub why not just go with a pair of Dayton reference drivers. I assure you a proper alignment will give you all the bass you could want. You really only need huge motors for sealed applications or pro-audio. I suggest this driver and alignment for you.
http://www.drmarksays.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/dayton-rss390hf-4-15-slot-vent.pdf

It really is a great sub for any setup not limited by size. If I built it I would be a single man so I'm forced to use the big TC drivers and seal my sub.

 

[GranteedEV]

That's assuming a lot of the amp he's hooking up to it. I doubt he is going to get max power to that driver and the high speeds will be on material not really used.

It is an amp capable of clean 4000 watt bursts. I only modeled with 2500 watt peaks.

I would expect someone tuning to 15hz to expect full performance at 15hz.

 

[frankie2075]

so then for the lms driver it should be in a sealed enclosure? and what about the re xxx? im looking for deep bass..

 

[frankie2075]

i can do a 10cu ft box but dont want to go bigger.. and r those dayton subs any good?

 

[GranteedEV]

so then for the lms driver it should be in a sealed enclosure? and what about the re xxx? im looking for deep bass..

I don't see the issue with using an LMS in a bass reflex box. I recommend dual 18" passive radiators, ultimately equalized flat.


If you want ultra deep bass and meaningful levels out of sealed boxes, multiples are almost a necessity. At least four LMS-Rs in sealed boxes, equalized appropriately, will get you there.

Sealed boxes just aren't very efficient down low and require a lot of boost and excursion.I mean if you want to go sealed by all means do it but it will be expensive. Then again so are passive radiators. Vents start to compress with these type of high output subs so i wouldn't recommend them.

I consider the Re XXX drivers to be pretty pricey relative to performance. I think the TC sounds drivers are a better deal.

Some other 15" drivers you should consider are for the deep stuff are the Exodus Tempest X2, and CSS SDX15 Mk II.

 

[frankie2075]

dont think there selling exodus anymore.. SDX15 Mk II.. is the lms driver mad more for sq then the lows? or will they be able to play pretty low?

 

[GranteedEV]

dont think there selling exodus anymore.. SDX15 Mk II.. is the lms driver mad more for sq then the lows? or will they be able to play pretty low?

Playing low is all about displacement, and the LMS drivers have tons of displacement. Not only that, but it's really low distortion, linear displacement, so they sound good doing it.

 

[frankie2075]

okay i gotcha so now u deff push me towards TC sounds driver because i was leaning towards RE but there super expensive and dont think there worth $400 more then TC.. now i been trying to use bass box pro 6 to model an enclosure for that driver but im not sure which is better ported or closed? im having trouble modeling it.. im looking for it to play deep and tuned to as low as possible with the max size of 10cu ft.

 

[frankie2075]

"64ft organ stop notes" seen u say this and also i always here plp talking about an organ and subwoofer in the same sentence im guessing its because organs play low? real low. so i want my sub to be an organ player lol if that even make sense.

 

[GranteedEV]

okay i gotcha so now u deff push me towards TC sounds driver because i was leaning towards RE but there super expensive and dont think there worth $400 more then TC.. now i been trying to use bass box pro 6 to model an enclosure for that driver but im not sure which is better ported or closed? im having trouble modeling it.. im looking for it to play deep and tuned to as low as possible with the max size of 10cu ft.

Your best bet, in my opinion besides brute force with a lot of drivers and amps, is this:

6 cu ft
1 TC Sounds LMS-R 15"
2 TC Sounds VMP 18" with 150g of added mass
14hz 2nd order high pass filter

And finally you need to equalize FLAT once it's IN your room.

With that said, you want two, three, or four subwoofers if you want clean bass above the lowest room mode. otherwise you may experience suckouts and ragged response.

 

[frankie2075]

kk thanks granteedev