High End CD Changer (Carousel) Options?

[PearlcorderS701]

Why even bother with a changer anymore. You could rip everything to your computer then run it through your stereo. Then you would have your entire collection at your finger tips and it will sound the same if not better than any of the changers on the market.

It's what I did and never looked back.

I don't do anything with regard to my music through the computer -- they're two totally separate entities, and I would never trade using my dedicated two channel system with separate audio devices for listening to/burning music "files" on a computer. I'm kind of a purist when it comes to that.

 

[anamorphic96]

I don't do anything with regard to my music through the computer -- they're two totally separate entities, and I would never trade using my dedicated two channel system with separate audio devices for listening to/burning music "files" on a computer. I'm kind of a purist when it comes to that.

Hmmm. Well if your not into a computer based source then go with one of the usual suspects with the remaining changers on the market. Since your a fan of Onkyo give the 390 a shot. It can usually be found dirt cheap. Then get an external DAC and you can make things as high end as you want.

There was a Rotel and Sony ES model that where quite good and very well built but both where recently discontinued.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Hmmm. Well if your not into a computer based source then go with one of the usual suspects with the remaining changers on the market. Since your a fan of Onkyo give the 390 a shot. It can usually be found dirt cheap. Then get an external DAC and you can make things as high end as you want.

Thanks; indeed, the price on this thing is utterly cheap -- it makes me weary of how good it is, and depending on which owner "review" you read, namely on Amazon, there seem to be a ton of people that had problems with the 390. Still, the 8555 you recommended to me wasn't that expensive, either, and it's doing fine...

As for the DAC -- I have read on Vann's site that the 390 sports Wolfburg (did I get that right?) DACs which are supposed to be high end, and the changer's specs look pretty impressive...would I even need to upgrade the DAC then?

It's weird...my 8555 only accepts RCA analog inputs for source components like CD players, there's no digital ins...does this indicate that Onkyo assumes one would be hooking up a high-end source to the receiver and using its onboard DACs via the RCA/analog outs? Should the 390's analog sound be as rich as if it were sent via its digital outs?

There was a Rotel and Sony ES model that where quite good and very well built but both where recently discontinued.

Hmmm...there are no Sony ES offerings anymore? At all? That would be the only Sony I'd ever consider -- and I discussed this with J. Garcia already. I know there was a Rotel -- no other "boutique" brand makes a carousel?

 

[Pyrrho]

Thanks; indeed, the price on this thing is utterly cheap -- it makes me weary of how good it is, and depending on which owner "review" you read, namely on Amazon, there seem to be a ton of people that had problems with the 390. Still, the 8555 you recommended to me wasn't that expensive, either, and it's doing fine...

As for the DAC -- I have read on Vann's site that the 390 sports Wolfburg (did I get that right?) DACs which are supposed to be high end, and the changer's specs look pretty impressive...would I even need to upgrade the DAC then?

It's weird...my 8555 only accepts RCA analog inputs for source components like CD players, there's no digital ins...does this indicate that Onkyo assumes one would be hooking up a high-end source to the receiver and using its onboard DACs via the RCA/analog outs? Should the 390's analog sound be as rich as if it were sent via its digital outs?
...

Your receiver is at about the level of the CD changers you are considering. You probably will not need to upgrade the DAC, but obviously, if you buy a changer with a digital output, you can use an external DAC if you want.

The DAC in the Onkyo DX-C390 is by Wolfson, which is a well-respected brand used in some pretty expensive units.

And there is nothing weird about a two channel receiver not having any digital inputs, as most do not. It typically is not necessary, as virtually every digital player has its own DAC, and there is no need to have more than one device do that.

 

[Rickster71]

I've always had good luck with Integra's stuff; how about something like this:

http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?class=DVD&m=DPC-7.9&p=i
Or this:
http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?m=CDC-3.4&class=CD&p=i

 

[zumbo]

I've always had good luck with Integra's stuff; how about something like this:

http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?class=DVD&m=DPC-7.9&p=i
Or this:
http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?m=CDC-3.4&class=CD&p=i

That would take care of the Onkyo loyalty issue.

And the higher-end issue as well. Good job.

 

[sholling]

Gone With The Dinosaurs

Changers are sooo last century. Seriously rip your collection to flac and access it from any room in your house. If you use the right tools it's relatively painless to rip even a huge collection and everything that you need for 2 rooms and your computer room will cost you less than a high-end changer. I would never go back to CDs and rip every CD the minute I get it home.

 

[anamorphic96]

As for the DAC -- I have read on Vann's site that the 390 sports Wolfburg (did I get that right?) DACs which are supposed to be high end, and the changer's specs look pretty impressive...would I even need to upgrade the DAC then?

All DAC's sound the same now a days as they are a mature technology. So yes the DAC's in the Onkyo will sound the same as any other.

But you asked for a high end option so I mentioned the outboard DAC and inexpensive changer path as no one makes a higher end changer anymore and this would achieve what you where looking for.

 

[j_garcia]

It was an ES piece?

Yes, forgot to mention that. That one is a CD changer and my other one is an ES SACD changer (multichannel). I had put the CA70ES up for sale here some time back and got no interest, so it has been sitting in the box in near brand new condition for over a year and I am using only the SACD player.

I know this is probably a rhetorical question, but do you see it outperforming the CC4001?

I am sure it will be as good if not better. I've never owned an Onkyo changer, but from the ones I've worked with they seem well built. As Zumbo mentioned, they aren't going to sound much better than a typical DVD player these days, so I wouldn't expect a dramatic difference even via analog. You'd have to drop some serious coin to get a player where you would start to really notice a difference IMO.

 

[anamorphic96]

Changers are sooo last century. Seriously rip your collection to flac and access it from any room in your house. If you use the right tools it's relatively painless to rip even a huge collection and everything that you need for 2 rooms and your computer room will cost you less than a high-end changer. I would never go back to CDs and rip every CD the minute I get it home.

I totally agree with you. But I understand where the OP is coming from. I fought the music server route for quite awhile as I thought it was superior to my computer based system. I was wrong. They sound identical when set up properly.

 

[j_garcia]

I totally agree with you. But I understand where the OP is coming from. I fought the music server route for quite awhile as I thought it was superior to my computer based system. I was wrong. They sound identical when set up properly.

Pretty much. I am actually impressed with the quality you can get with FLAC too. HDD space is cheap these days, so it isn't such a big deal to have large file sizes to have the entire library easily accessible. I don't have the right tools to do it with my desktop out of commission, but I will get around to putting it back together or more likely just replace it.

 

[anamorphic96]

Pretty much. I am actually impressed with the quality you can get with FLAC too. HDD space is cheap these days, so it isn't such a big deal to have large file sizes to have the entire library easily accessible. I don't have the right tools to do it with my desktop out of commission, but I will get around to putting it back together or more likely just replace it.

With hard drive space being so cheap you don't need to use any lossless or lossy compression anymore.

I just move my laptop in to the living room when I want to play music. Then I run everything into a NuForce USB uDAC2 and out to my receiver.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Take a look at this leaflet...what are your thoughts on this thing's specs?

http://www.intl.onkyo.com/downloads/product_info/pdf/dx-c390_leaflet.pdf

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Your receiver is at about the level of the CD changers you are considering. You probably will not need to upgrade the DAC, but obviously, if you buy a changer with a digital output, you can use an external DAC if you want.

Well, let's not get into the whole "level these components are at based on price" debacle right now -- I've always felt, after Anamorphic put me onto it, that the 8555 is an underpriced, overbuilt and underrated serious machine that shouldn't be discounted by the audiophile community; they seem to be doing the same with these C390s, though I've never heard it.

The DAC in the Onkyo DX-C390 is by Wolfson, which is a well-respected brand used in some pretty expensive units.

Yes -- Wolfson is what I meant...thanks...

Does that mean it should, theoretically, crank out some decent sound?

And there is nothing weird about a two channel receiver not having any digital inputs, as most do not. It typically is not necessary, as virtually every digital player has its own DAC, and there is no need to have more than one device do that.

Yes, I understand that, but then one can argue why do they include it on multichannel receivers? I mean, digital DVD and BD players have their own onboard DACs as well, and they also offer digital outs to match to AVRs and processors -- is the difference just between the multitude of separate cabling needed to connect DVD/BD players as opposed to the left/right stereo audio jacks from a CD player?

Regardless, let's talk more about this -- sure, digital players like CD changers and single disc units have their own DACs, but stereo receiver/integrated amp manufacturers take the stance then that the players will definitely offer better DACs than the receiver or amp's digital interfaces would preface, would they not? Why not offer the option?

In other words, what I'm saying is, why do stereo connection devices like receivers or integrated amps only offer analog inputs for connecting devices like CD players? Isn't this assuming that the player must employ "better" conversion methods/internals?

 

[j_garcia]

Yes, the higher model Onkyo 85xx stereo receivers like that one are definitely overbuilt and are actually a bargain for the performance you get.

Take that one step further and there are integrated amps which have literally no processing, no digital and are basically a pre- and an amp in one box, and you can get serious performance compared to what you would get in a comparably priced multichannel receiver IMO. Yes, an integrated amp has NO DACs.

They give you the option of analog mainly because they know a lot of people have analog gear out there, and in particular the 2ch only people are generally analog.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Yes, the higher model Onkyo 85xx stereo receivers like that one are definitely overbuilt and are actually a bargain for the performance you get.

I would have to agree.

Take that one step further and there are integrated amps which have literally no processing, no digital and are basically a pre- and an amp in one box, and you can get serious performance compared to what you would get in a comparably priced multichannel receiver IMO. Yes, an integrated amp has NO DACs.

I see...

They give you the option of analog mainly because they know a lot of people have analog gear out there, and in particular the 2ch only people are generally analog.

Thanks for clarification here -- so, you would say it's perfectly "okay" to listen to music (CDs in particular) via the analog RCA connections of a player/changer, as opposed to running a player's digital outs to a comparable receiving unit? I ask because if you read all the owner comments on sites like Vann's or Amazon, you'll see so many references to how these guys' CD changers "sounded so much more amazing" when they connected them through the digital connections rather than the analog RCAs...

Don't know if there is any profound science behind these "claims," I'm just saying...

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I've always had good luck with Integra's stuff; how about something like this:

http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?class=DVD&m=DPC-7.9&p=i
Or this:
http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?m=CDC-3.4&class=CD&p=i

Sorry for the delay in getting back to you, Rick -- thanks for those suggestions and links!

Indeed, I did consider the Integra -- on paper, it would seem like this would be the beyond-perfect match for my needs, right? An Onkyo product AND one from a higher-end line: However, knowing that there is always an Integra counterpart to an Onkyo component raised some flags for me...first of all, I could have gone with the Integra version of the Onkyo stereo receiver I bought, but I just thought you weren't really paying for anything beyond the custom integration features (which I didn't need) and the brand name. Now, with regard to the Integra changers, something just makes we weary of paying substantially more for an Integra than the Onkyo counterpart when it seems they may deliver comparable performance...

Does anyone else have any thoughts on which of these would actually "perform" or possibly sound better?

http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=DX-C390&class=Compact Disc&p=i

vs.

http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?m=CDC-3.4&class=CD&p=i

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I've always had good luck with Integra's stuff; how about something like this:

http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?class=DVD&m=DPC-7.9&p=i
Or this:
http://integrahometheater.com/model.cfm?m=CDC-3.4&class=CD&p=i

BTW -- the first product linked here is a DVD changer, which of course could be used as a CD changer, but I'd rather a dedicated Compact Disc Changer, which would leave the only changer in Integra's lineup, the one in your second link and which I cited...

 

[zumbo]

Thanks for clarification here -- so, you would say it's perfectly "okay" to listen to music (CDs in particular) via the analog RCA connections of a player/changer, as opposed to running a player's digital outs to a comparable receiving unit? I ask because if you read all the owner comments on sites like Vann's or Amazon, you'll see so many references to how these guys' CD changers "sounded so much more amazing" when they connected them through the digital connections rather than the analog RCAs...

Don't know if there is any profound science behind these "claims," I'm just saying...

It depends on which unit has better DAC's. For the most part, you probably wouldn't hear a difference either way.

Do cd players have digital outputs?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Do cd players have digital outputs?

Is this a serious question?