Time to buy a gun ... again

bandphan

bandphan

Banned
sorry mike too much bait in the water, Im gonna drag mine:eek: leaves out entire life history with firemans, calls dad, step dad, channels granddads call them all stupid, turns in whats left of arsenal ( after med fire sale) to BSO and joins democratic party Whew I feel better:eek: EDIT: wait isnt a clone in charge of this thread:cool:
 
m-fine

m-fine

Audioholic
I have personally seen multiple stove pipes from a novice shooter limp wresting a Glock 19 and 26, as well as several other non-glock polymer autos. I have intentionally done it myself with a Kel-Tec and witnessed someone I was teaching struggle with it repeatedly using my Kel-Tec. If you know how to shoot it won't happen. It also happens less with heavier bullet weights for the caliber, hotter loads, and heavier guns.
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
and since the topic has taken some uninformative turns, lets go back to the N.W.A 80's and get the MAC:D

 
JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Ninja
Actually, this is quite common. I currently own or recently owned S&W revolvers chambered in 9mm (Model 940), 10mm (Model 610), and 45acp (Model 625). Of these, the S&W Model 625 is especially popular, and one of Smiths best selling revolver models.
I stand corrected. Revolvers are far from a speciality for me. Every one I own is rim-fire and so would not work in a semi-auto.

The 610 is one of my personal favorites. The 10mm is roughly equivalent ballistically to the 41 Mag. But the 610 also shoots 40 S&W (just like a 357 Mag also shoots 38 specials).
Yes. The 10mm and .40 are approx the same width. There's a considerable difference in length and muzzle pressure.

One nice thing about a revolver is that it can shoot short loads. autos have difficulty loading under that circumstance.

Most Glocks are double stack models, which by design necessitate a fairly thick grip. But these are no thicker than lots of other double stack models by other manufacturers, especially metal framed guns like the Beretta 92/M9 (which is military issue), or the Sig double stack models like the P226 or P229. Additionally, Glock makes single stack models that are significantly thinner than the mentioned Sigs and Beretta.
I did not say there were not other thick-gripped handguns, I only said that the Glock was thick and that many people with small hands dislike them for that reason. You seem to agree with me.

Just the opposite is true. You can find a good old 1911 chambered in 45acp in several different barrel lengths. The 3" barreled gun kicks more (and has more muzzle blast) than the 4' gun, which kicks more than the 5" gun, which kicks more than the 6" gun. All things being equal, the longer barrel (and slide) cause the gun to weigh more, which translates to less felt recoil (as you also stated).
We now move into a very subjective term "felt kick".

A longer barrel imparts more momentum (all else being equal) on the bullet. Basic Newtonian physics will tell you that the weapon experiences the same amount of force on an opposing vector. Therefore longer barrels kick harder.

For a really good example of this, get a hipoint carbine. It fires a pistol round and is light so you get to really experience the extra kick.

You are correct that, and I've never said otherwise, the feeling of "hitting your hand" will be more offset by a longer slide (which tends to be found on weapons with longer barrels). For me at least, that actually impedes maintaining aim. The full-length Glock 9mm, as an example: hits my hand less than the subcompact but, since the slide pulls at a different angle than the bullet, throws off my aim more. (which is to say the delay between the first shot and second shot is longer because I need to bring my hand back in line)

A fast small bullet is much more susceptible to deflection than a slow large bullet. Forget the 45 GAP. It is the answer to a question/problem that no one asked. That is why it will soon be obsolete. It's currently very difficult to find guns and especially 45 Gap ammo.
.45 vs .357 on body armor.

The 10mm is nothing more than an elongated 40 S&W case with more powder. Revolvers and semi-auto guns chambered in 10mm are basically no larger and have the same round capacity as other guns chambered in major hand gun calibers.
Apples to apples
Glock 9mm 17 rounds: http://www.glock.com/english/glock17_tech.htm
Glock .40 / 10mm 15 rounds: http://www.glock.com/english/glock20_tech.htm
Glock .45 13 rounds: http://www.glock.com/english/glock21_tech.htm

No. Not all major calibers have the same capacity.

The 25acp is a terrible choice if it is not a self defense gun (or actually, even if it is). 25acp ammo is very hard to find, actually more expensive than 9mm, and no more effective in a self defense situation than 22 Long Rifle.
It's easy to shoot for people who want to target shoot and don't like kick.

But there is also some good advice in your post. Avoiding light weight guns because of punishing recoil and renting different guns (try before you buy) are both good ideas.
I stand corrected on the revolver ammo statement. I was wrong in stating that none used auto ammo.

I did not recommend the .25 on anything other than kick. I agree with your statements why it is a poor choice.

Other than that, I believe my post was correct: though it's possible I was less clear than I should have been. Thank you for the response.
 
m-fine

m-fine

Audioholic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsewsolPyBU&feature=youtube_gdata_player

This is one guys test, and may be biased by a lot of factors, but it shows the issue. If held and fired properly I am sure all of the guns would have been 100% reliable, hence this is not an issue for an experienced shooter, but would be for a new to shooting wife.

Edit: this one is better because he starts with the glock and shows it functioning perfectly and failing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jh9JhCyFFxA&feature=youtube_gdata_player
 
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JerryLove

JerryLove

Audioholic Ninja
I have personally seen multiple stove pipes from a novice shooter limp wresting a Glock 19 and 26,
Perhaps it's a difference between the 9mm and .40... or there's some other factor I'm unaware of. It's not something I've run into with my own 23.
 
m-fine

m-fine

Audioholic
Perhaps it's a difference between the 9mm and .40... or there's some other factor I'm unaware of. It's not something I've run into with my own 23.
Well, if the recoil springs are the same, it would be less likely to happen with the .40. My current KT is a .40 but it is way smaller than any Glock so no real comparison there, other than it can be made to jam just like the G17 in the video.
 
GlocksRock

GlocksRock

Audioholic Spartan
The 10mm is nothing more than an elongated 40 S&W case with more powder.
Actually you have it backwards, the 10mm came first, and since it was breaking guns and FBI agents couldn't handle it's recoil, and also for overpenetration reasons, the 10mm was shortened and the .40 S&W was created.
 
majorloser

majorloser

Moderator
Then came the 357 SIG which is the chamber of my Glock 32.
.40 S&W that is necked down to a 9mm
 
m-fine

m-fine

Audioholic
Then came the 357 SIG which is the chamber of my Glock 32.
.40 S&W that is necked down to a 9mm
Yes, a good round that is close to a tried and true .357 mag in an auto. Virtually any .40 can be converted to 357 sig with a barrel swap, so you can get 2 caliber options for just a bit more than the price of one.
 
GlocksRock

GlocksRock

Audioholic Spartan
If I'm using a necked down round, I'll take a 400 corbon, it's a necked down .45 that uses a .40 bullet.

 
majorloser

majorloser

Moderator
If I'm using a necked down round, I'll take a 400 corbon, it's a necked down .45 that uses a .40 bullet.

I already own a 45 that I shoot +P+'s with. the Corbon has the same problem as the 357 Sig. It's tough to easily get ammo.
 
GlocksRock

GlocksRock

Audioholic Spartan
It is tough to find ammo for those necked down rounds, which is why I don't own any guns that shoot them. I have .357 magnum, 9mm, and .45 acp as my pistol calibers. Luckily one of my best friends is a gunsmith and he's always coming across different things and can get me pretty much whatever I need.
 
jeffsg4mac

jeffsg4mac

Republican Poster Boy
oh, i didn't know taurus was "ranked" higher than s&w ... i didn't recognize the brand when my gunrunner offered it ... will look into it.
Out of the 4 Smiths that I have owned all them had issues with reliability. I have never had an issue with my Ruger or Taurus revolvers. One of my Smiths developed a timing issue and sent copper shavings flying back at me. If not for my shooting glasses it would have hit me in the eye.

This is what I am getting for my wife.

http://www.taurususa.com/product-details.cfm?id=265&category=Revolver&toggle=&breadcrumbseries=



This is another excellent choice but not ported. It is however one of he strongest .357 made. http://www.ruger.com/products/gp100/specSheets/1705.html

 
J

James NM

Audioholic
Actually you have it backwards, the 10mm came first, and since it was breaking guns and FBI agents couldn't handle it's recoil, and also for overpenetration reasons, the 10mm was shortened and the .40 S&W was created.
Actually. I don't have anything backwards. I am well aware of the history of the 10mm and the 40 S&W. This was not a chicken or the egg question. My post was not about which came first or the history of either cartridge. It was about the relationship in size between the 10mm and 40 S&W cartridges.
The 10mm is nothing more than an elongated 40 S&W case with more powder. Revolvers and semi-auto guns chambered in 10mm are basically no larger and have the same round capacity as other guns chambered in major hand gun calibers.
Describing a 40 S&W as a shortened 10mm, or a 10mm as a lengthened 40 S&W, or a 38 spcl as a shortened 357 Mag, or a 357 Mag as a lengthened 38 spcl is perfectly acceptable when describing the relationships in size between the cartridges.

If you're having eggs for breakfast, who cares which one came first?
 
GlocksRock

GlocksRock

Audioholic Spartan
Out of the 4 Smiths that I have owned all them had issues with reliability. I have never had an issue with my Ruger or Taurus revolvers. One of my Smiths developed a timing issue and sent copper shavings flying back at me. If not for my shooting glasses it would have hit me in the eye.

This is what I am getting for my wife.

http://www.taurususa.com/product-details.cfm?id=265&category=Revolver&toggle=&breadcrumbseries=

My buddy has that, I've shot it a few times and like it quite a bit. Both my .357 magnums are made by Taurus and never had a problem with either of them, I would reccomend them to anyone.
 
jeffsg4mac

jeffsg4mac

Republican Poster Boy
Describing a 40 S&W as a shortened 10mm, or a 10mm as a lengthened 40 S&W, or a 38 spcl as a shortened 357 Mag, or a 357 Mag as a lengthened 38 spcl is perfectly acceptable when describing the relationships in size between the cartridges.

If you're having eggs for breakfast, who cares which one came first?
I might also add that many of the magnum rounds were started by hopping up existing rounds. The 357 came from hot loaded 38's, the 454 from hot loaded 45LC, the 44mag from hot 44 specials, etc, etc.
 
Patrukas777

Patrukas777

Senior Audioholic
my wifes firearm

After I leave for work, my wife sits on top of the roof with one of these:

 
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