YXY Aspect Ratio Controller Vertical Stretch

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I just stumbled onto this free software used with HTPC (like PDVD) to change the aspect ratio of the movie:

http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/htpc/yxy/yxy_instructions.html

For example, you can change the aspect ratio of a 2.35:1 movie (black bars on top & bottom) to 1.78:1 movie (no black bars on top & bottom) without distorting the image.

I tried it out on my laptop last night and it worked so I will try it out with my projector at home.

Who needs to pay big bucks for those Vertical Stretch video processors?

 

[jostenmeat]

Hey cool ADTG, but vertical stretch is not really an expensive feature. Heck I think even older affordable receivers might even provide that function! It obviously comes as standard feature on many PJs.

It's the glass that's the doozie. At least if you want good glass.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Lol, welcome to the 21st century - the XYZ software was last updated on 11/20/2000
jostenmeat is right, stretch/zoom functions are easy to implement, btw: there is no such thing as lossless changing aspect ratio - ether part of image is gone or you are distorting the image (even slightly)
I believe most new software player have this feature built in by now - I know VLC, MPlayer and MPC-HC do

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Hey cool ADTG, but vertical stretch is not really an expensive feature. Heck I think even older affordable receivers might even provide that function! It obviously comes as standard feature on many PJs.

It's the glass that's the doozie. At least if you want good glass.

Lol, welcome to the 21st century - the XYZ software was last updated on 11/20/2000
jostenmeat is right, stretch/zoom functions are easy to implement, btw: there is no such thing as lossless changing aspect ratio - ether part of image is gone or you are distorting the image (even slightly)
I believe most new software player have this feature built in by now - I know VLC, MPlayer and MPC-HC do

Wait, so you guys are telling me my Denon 5308 can do this?

I know about the ZOOM function, but that's not what I was looking for.

I know the Denon AVR-4810CI advertises the Vertical Stretch that supposedly does not induce distortion like the ZOOM funtion most of us are familiar with. None of the other Denon (including AVP-A1HD & 5308) even mention the capability of Vertical Stretch.

 

[jostenmeat]

Wait, so you guys are telling me my Denon 5308 can do this?

I know about the ZOOM function, but that's not what I was looking for.

I know the Denon AVR-4810CI advertises the Vertical Stretch that supposedly does not induce distortion like the ZOOM funtion most of us are familiar with. None of the other Denon (including AVP-A1HD & 5308) even mention the capability of Vertical Stretch.

I don't know about Denon, but I'm pretty sure Onkyo had this capability as far as back as two years ago with the 906 for instance (maybe 876 too, not sure). However, it looks like it's inconvenient in the sense that you have to go into the menu to able/disable the function.

edit: I think the 876 does it too. The names are called zoom, which is misleading I think. If you look at pg 111 of the manual here, you can see the distortion that occurs with the zoom, ahem stretching. There are several types. I wonder if all of the ISF featured Onkyo/Integras have this.

http://filedepot.onkyousa.com/Files/own_manuals/SN_29344753A_TX-SR876_NR906_En_web.pdf?CFID=1121205&CFTOKEN=45268965&jsessionid=f030e77c758b715b75cb7f3615733752783b

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Well, that's no good.

I've done that with my Mitsubishi TV also.

Most DVD players and my Denon BD player can do that too.

I thought this was something new and special.

 

[jostenmeat]

I thought this was something new and special.

You could make it special . . . if you just added a few things . . . $$$$ . . . .

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Well, looks like this YXY only works on DVD, like most things.

It does not work at all on blu-rays.

Oh well, I tried.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

You guys are right. My projector has that vertical stretch function too; it's called Letterbox, and it does produce some veritcal image distortion. There is a function that is called Overscan that does not distort the picture at all.

I tried the Vertical Stretch function on the Denon 4810CI by the way.

It did exactly what you guys said - simply stretch the image vertically and cause some distortion.

I'll stick to the Overscan and avoid image distortion.

 

[jostenmeat]

You guys are right. My projector has that vertical stretch function too; it's called Letterbox, and it does produce some veritcal image distortion. There is a function that is called Overscan that does not distort the picture at all.

I tried the Vertical Stretch function on the Denon 4810CI by the way.

It did exactly what you guys said - simply stretch the image vertically and cause some distortion.

I'll stick to the Overscan and avoid image distortion.

ADTG, what exactly is your "overscan" doing to the picture; why are you using it?

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

ADTG, what exactly is your "overscan" doing to the picture; why are you using it?

I use it for 2.35 Wide Cinescope movies to fill up the screen (eliminate top/bottom black bars).

It's another form of ZOOM, but not as SEVERE & distorting as the USUAL zoom function.

It has 5 Overscan Steps, and each step "zooms" in a little bit.

Even at the max Overscan (level 5), it still only fills the screen (eliminates vertical black bars) about 90%.

I don't notice any distortion at all with Overscan. It's a lot more effective than any Zoom/Stretch function I've seen.

But that Vertical Stretch function on the $3,000 Denon AVR-4810CI is a total joke. It's a simple Zoom that most TVs and DVD players can do.

I hate 2.35 widescreens.

 

[jostenmeat]

I use it for 2.35 Wide Cinescope movies to fill up the screen (eliminate top/bottom black bars).

It's another form of ZOOM, but not as SEVERE & distorting as the USUAL zoom function.

It has 5 Overscan Steps, and each step "zooms" in a little bit.

Even at the max Overscan (level 5), it still only fills the screen (eliminates vertical black bars) about 90%.

I don't notice any distortion at all with Overscan. It's a lot more effective than any Zoom/Stretch function I've seen.

But that Vertical Stretch function on the $3,000 Denon AVR-4810CI is a total joke. It's a simple Zoom that most TVs and DVD players can do.

I hate 2.35 widescreens.

Thanks for answering my question. This is what I suspected, but wasn't entirely sure, so I deleted the stuff I had typed, and asked first, just to be sure.

A rehash of what I deleted: Obviously, you are well aware that you are cutting out a LOT of your picture. I think it's almost exactly 1/4 if I'm not mistaken.

Any calibration you may do for, say, your 1.78 is now no good for your zoom mode. The brightness and other settings will be perfectly off by the amount you zoom.

I'm just saying, in case you never thought about it. Though I'm sure you probably have, and of course you do what you like.

What is nice about scope setups is that ALL of the potential lumens of the unit are in use. With my own 1.78 screen, when I have a 2.35 AR movie, yes about 1/4 of the picture is black bars which means about 1/4 of potential lumens are wasted on these black bars. The scope setup, with vertical stretch & anamorphic glass, means that you use all of the available lumens for either AR.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Optoma HD81-LV owner's manual definition of Overscan:

Mask off a few pixels on each edge of the
image to be displayed. Use this function
to adjust if image source happens to have
noise near any edge of the display image.

The overscan function doesn't seem to cut off much of the image - at least so far that I have noticed.

There are some things I don't like about the HD81-LV (no vertical/horizontal lens shift), but brightness is NOT one of them. This thing is so extremely bright even on the LOWEST lamp mode - Economy Mode (calibrated).

I hope the LED DLP projectors will get this bright and stay under $6K street price.

 

[s162216]

Simple answer to all of this: get one of those (hughly expensive) Phillips 2.35:1 56" TV's. That way theres no black bars (which I don't mind anyway) and no distortion from stretching vertically or loss of detail from zooming.

Look amazing to me but way out of my price range for long long time I think!

http://www.trustedreviews.com/tvs/review/2009/06/10/Philips-Cinema-21-9-56PFL9954H-56in-LCD-TV/p1

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Simple answer to all of this: get one of those (hughly expensive) Phillips 2.35:1 56" TV's. That way theres no black bars (which I don't mind anyway) and no distortion from stretching vertically or loss of detail from zooming.

Look amazing to me but way out of my price range for long long time I think!

http://www.trustedreviews.com/tvs/review/2009/06/10/Philips-Cinema-21-9-56PFL9954H-56in-LCD-TV/p1

There is no way I'm going from a 120" Screen and 73" DLP TV to a 56" TV!

And what happens with the rest of the 1.78 AR movies, which are the majority of the movies? Side black bars? No thanks.

 

[s162216]

Actually most films are actually shot these days in 2.35:1, it tends to be only lower budget films that are shot in the 1.85:1 aspect ratio. All that happens with 16:9 is that 2.35:1 and 1.85:1 films (and in older cases 1.66:1) are letterboxed (or pillarboxed for 1.66:1) to fit the 1.78:1 frame. The Philips TV removes the black bars and scales the image to fit the wider ratio.

Phillips will bring out a bigger version soon anyway, its the first TV with a 2.35:1 aspect ratio and theres bound to be blu rays coming out in 21:9 instead of 16:9 if it catches on. Of course this would require an update to the standard. Personally I would love one!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Actually most films are actually shot these days in 2.35:1, it tends to be only lower budget films that are shot in the 1.85:1 aspect ratio. All that happens with 16:9 is that 2.35:1 and 1.85:1 films (and in older cases 1.66:1) are letterboxed (or pillarboxed for 1.66:1) to fit the 1.78:1 frame. The Philips TV removes the black bars and scales the image to fit the wider ratio.

Phillips will bring out a bigger version soon anyway, its the first TV with a 2.35:1 aspect ratio and theres bound to be blu rays coming out in 21:9 instead of 16:9 if it catches on. Of course this would require an update to the standard. Personally I would love one!

It will only sell as long as the price is the same as the current TVs or just slightly more. Otherwise, it will not sell as much.

But if I'm changing screens, I'm getting a BIGGER screen, not smaller.

 

[s162216]

Its new so of course its going to be expensive initially, it has to use a different LCD panel to other TV's so that pushes the cost up. Its supposed to be a high end product anyway. The price will come down in time, look at how much just 50" TV's used to cost, I remember flicking through a catalogue about 5 or 6 years ago and seeing 50" LCDs costing £4000, now look at how much they cost.

 

[jostenmeat]

Optoma HD81-LV owner's manual definition of Overscan:

Mask off a few pixels on each edge of the
image to be displayed. Use this function
to adjust if image source happens to have
noise near any edge of the display image.

The overscan function doesn't seem to cut off much of the image - at least so far that I have noticed.

Right, I knew you had a bright (dlp) PJ, with a screen that is not huge. That description of overscan is exactly what I think of for the "intended" usage. Even Panasonic plasmas' zoom/picture 1 is the one with overscan (have to select "2" to not have overscan). It's subtle, but I guess I am still not exactly understanding your usage, especially when you say getting rid of 90% of vertical bars or something.

 

[jostenmeat]

Actually most films are actually shot these days in 2.35:1, it tends to be only lower budget films that are shot in the 1.85:1 aspect ratio.

What about Avatar, The Dark Knight, and Up? There are many others.

Phillips will bring out a bigger version soon anyway, its the first TV with a 2.35:1 aspect ratio

Runco already had one years ago, but it's an in-wall RPTV. JVC had a prototype at some point.