Wine and Wine Storage

[itschris]

Lately I've been back on my wine kick. We have a new small wine bar near our house that we really enjoy spending time at. The owner is from Australia and his family has been in the wine business for 3 generations. I've learned more in the past six months than I have over the past six years. He's a great educator and it's changed my whole wine drinking ways.

I like collecting as much as I like drinking and I'm up to about 300 bottles at this point. I have fairly large wine cabinet with a 500 bottle capacity, but I hate the thing. Literally every 6 months the fan burns out and I have to yank the chiller, take it apart, and yank the fan. It's just a hassle. Most of the wine is comprised of daily drinkers under $30, but as of now, I do have about 50-75 bottles that are actually kind of important and I have to be especially carefull of. I've been thinking about building a smallish cellar... maybe a 1,200 bottle capacity. I don't have the room anymore to have a real room, but I think I could create a nice small walk-in closet sized room.

If any of you guys have cellars or collections, I need some pointers.

 

[darien87]

300 bottles?!?! Yikes. Sorry, that's too big-baller for me. The wife and I like to go wine tasting and make the drive up to Napa a few times a year. We usually buy about 5 bottles or so and that keeps us for a few months.

 

[j_garcia]

My collection has been pared down to about 20-30 bottles that we will actually drink. I used to keep a hundred or so but found that I like drinking them more than I like having them around. So we will buy a few bottles of something that is good, or a 1/2 or whole case if it is exceptional, but I haven't found anything lately that I've been aging and drinking later. We'll keep it maybe a year or 2 and finish it off. So long term storage hasn't been an issue for me

Cellar: center of the house or in the basement, no light, no heating/cooling ducting access. I don't think it needs to be constantly controlled temp as long as it is in a spot that doesn't see big swings or extremes. For a collection that size though, you might want something that is well controlled especially if you are going to keep some of them for a while.

Darien, let me know if you want to head up to Napa together some time, we go up quite often too and I know a lot of little "off the beaten track" places that really kick butt.

 

[mperfct]

this is way beyond the scope of my little built-in 75 bottle rack, but I'm interested to see how it turns out.

 

[MidnightSensi]

I have a Subzero two zone undercounter unit.

Cellars aren't much better, because you still need to cool them and control the humidity, which is harder to do in a room than in a contained box. I feel your struggle though, I have more trouble with refrigeration units....

Wine can be fun to collect, but, personally I'll just pay more for it, let someone else store it and drink it when I buy it. If you have some special ones, that's great, but storing $30 bottles of wine gets to be a bit much. Most the 100-500 dollar/bottle wines I have people gave me as gifts, and I end up never feel the occasion is special enough to drink them. So I have a cheap beer instead.

 

[itschris]

The thing that got me into wine in the first place was really thinking about vintage and how once it's gone, it's gone. The collector (and I use that word very loosely) like to keep a few bottles of each one I really like, and I'll drink some of it, but still try to keep some because I know I can't get it anymore... probably. Silly I know, but it makes me feel good and I probably do this because life in general has been so stressfull the past year that I need something fairly mindless and childish to amuse myself.

I have bottles ranging from $7 on up. I'd say the lion's share are about $25. I've gotten away from the California Cabs for the most part and have been drinking and gathering South African cabs from the Stollenboch region (Kennonkop is my favorite right now) and from Australia (Penley Pheonix). I've just found that the bolder wines from these regions are a far better value. Don't get me wrong, I love a good bottle of Cakebread Cab, but I don't want to pay $90+ for it when I get a $30 cab from South Africa that I enjoy just as much or even more.

I've also been hunting specifically for those great wines under $10 and have found a couple that I've stocked up on.

I don't know that I'll ever have 1000+ bottles, but I'd like to know I can. I have to do a lot more research I guess.

Let's just start listing favorite wines.... varietal, vintage, region, price and anything you want to say about it.

 

[skers_54]

The biggest issues with storing wine are keeping out ambient light, maintaining a cooler temp and keeping the humidity relatively constant. Too little humidity will dry out the cork and allow oxygen to seep in, oxidizing the alcohol. Too much humidity will cause the cork to swell, possibly making it fail as well.

When I was in Napa earlier this summer, one of the guys running the tastings at Chateau St. Jean said a very well respected wine critic told him that he stored partially drank wine in his freezer and microwaved it when he wanted to drink it! I thought that was really interesting, since it pretty much slapped all the conventional wisdom in the face.

One of the more interesting wineries I went to was the Van Der Hayden vineyard. It's a mom-and-pop operation that runs its tasting room out of an old chicken coop. The owner is a riot and they have a late harvest cab sav that's absolutely fabulous. It's definitely worth checking out, even just for the owner's stories.

 

[j_garcia]

Humidity is less of an issue these days as a large percentage of the industry has switched to corks of other types than real cork that are less apt to have long term storage issues.

Last night I had an old vine Zinfandel from Chouinard Vineyards. $19 a bottle and excellent stuff. http://www.chouinard.com/ They have 2 excellent dessert wines as well, probably my favorite things from them currently. The Viognier Ice wine is spectacular and their Orange Muscat is pretty good, though neither is quite as cheap for dessert wine's smaller sizes - every bit worth it though. I am very happy that these guys are local.

Valley of the Moon cab from Sonoma $11 at Cost Plus. Awesome.

Chateau St. Jean is a great place. Only been there once, but their wine maker really has a great knack for making wine that tastes great without the cost.

My newest favorite is http://www.fieldstonewinery.com/ Their standard Syrah was quite good at $24. A little high, but better than many I've had that cost much more than that. Their reserves were excellent. When we were up there last year we were fortunate to be poured by the wine maker himself. A surprisingly young guy but extremely knowledgeable and very nice. Pretty far for us, but I love driving up there.

 

[Alex2507]

Regarding the room itself you'll want some serious thermal insulation. In Florida I was called into a multi million dollar home to beef up their insulation because when they went on vacation the wine room was at say 75f and they let the rest of the home go to 85f causing all kinds of condensation that water damaged all kinds of stuff. Now that I think about it you may want a back up generator for that a/c as any power outage would be a disaster and maybe insure that wine too.

I almost wish I still drank.

 

[j_garcia]

I agree, a large collection or anything expensive might be worth having a generator. A buddy of mine lives in a remote area and their power grid wasn't that great and when they would lose power in the summer, it could be days before they got power back. The first time it happend, he almost lost his 5000 gal exotic fish tank! Who cares about the wine...the stuff he had in there was a lot of dough.

 

[darien87]

Darien, let me know if you want to head up to Napa together some time, we go up quite often too and I know a lot of little "off the beaten track" places that really kick butt.

Too bad this didn't come up sooner. We just went a couple of months ago. We hit V. Sattui, Beringer and a couple of others. We always have lunch at Bouchon in Yountville and had our entire meal comped this time.

Beringer is my favorite winery, (we always make sure to buy a bottle of their White Zin/Chardonnay blend since you can't buy it in stores), but Sterling in a nice tour and has great wine.

We went to Murphy's about 6 months ago and spent a day going up and down the main road that has tasting rooms all up and down it. We went to Ironstone, which is the biggest one out there, and although the tour was nice and the grounds were exquisite, we probably liked their wine the least. Didn't buy a single bottle.

 

[j_garcia]

Behringer surprised me. I hate their store stuff, but their reserve stuff that I've only seen at the winery is actually pretty good. Sterling is a great place to tour, but I'm only fond of a few of their wines. There are a few other places within a few miles of there that you might also like. We always eat at Napa Valley Grill when we go up there.

Right in the area on 29, Peju is one of my favorites. Coppola is a great place to tour but the wine is too pricey for what it is. Most of the stuff we go to is not in that area, since it is more touristy and tends to have the majority of the traffic. I like the small places where you get to meet the actual people/family and they do things the "old school" ways still

 

[itschris]

Behringer surprised me. I hate their store stuff, but their reserve stuff that I've only seen at the winery is actually pretty good. Sterling is a great place to tour, but I'm only fond of a few of their wines. There are a few other places within a few miles of there that you might also like. We always eat at Napa Valley Grill when we go up there.

Right in the area on 29, Peju is one of my favorites. Coppola is a great place to tour but the wine is too pricey for what it is. Most of the stuff we go to is not in that area, since it is more touristy and tends to have the majority of the traffic. I like the small places where you get to meet the actual people/family and they do things the "old school" ways still

Behringer reserves always seem to make whatever top list you have to be looking at. It's funny that the store stuff isn't much to speak of though my wife loves their Chinnen Blanc. We buy it by the case from Publix and end up paying abou $5/bottle.

What I'm drinking now:

2006 Arzuaga Tempranillo, Spain, about $30
2004 J. Bookwalter Subplot 22 Red Blend, Washington, about $20
2005 Penley Pheonix Cabranet, Australia, about $20
2005 Kennenkop Cabranet, South Africa, about $30
2005 Craneford Merlot, Australia, about $30
2006 Guggenheim Malbec, about $9

I bought a case of each of these and have just been rotating depending on what I cook for dinner. I've mainly drinking the Malbec since it's a lot more affordable and I just find it to be an easy drink. My next favorite is the Penley. At $20, it's pretty much at my limit of what I'll spend for a "everyday" kind of drinker. The others I've been drinking on a more limited basis since they start getting a bit pricey.

Thinking about it though, I've gone through nearly a case of the Subplot 22. It's a big big big blend, but with a ridiculously smooth light finish. The Penley is just very bold, but very very smooth from start to finish. I'd put it up against a lot of $50 Napa cabs any day. I think it would hold it's own quite wel.

I'm not sure what to do about the cellar issue. Maybe I'll just finish loading up the cabinet I have and call it a day. Drink more of what I got for now. I got to talk it over with the wife too and convince her to give up the walk-in in the back office.

 

[itschris]

300 bottles?!?! Yikes. Sorry, that's too big-baller for me. The wife and I like to go wine tasting and make the drive up to Napa a few times a year. We usually buy about 5 bottles or so and that keeps us for a few months.

It's been over time. If I come across a wine I like, I'll usually buy a case if it's not outrageous, drink several then keep a few aside and move on. The higher end stuff I've just collected over time. I got my hands on a few bottles of Ghost Block Cab. The wine bar we like to go to had a couple of cases and everytime we went in, I just picked up a bottle. The stuff I care about the most are my 97 cabs and meritage bottles. I have some good stuff there and just like having it.

My wife likes to drink a glass or two just about every night with dinner. I'm about an every other day drinker. In about 6 months, I'll likely move back away from wine and start with the tequila again. I go in phases.

 

[mperfct]

I like cheap wines too. My wife is a CPA, and that brings our whole budget down. At least she likes wine. We intend to get more serious into it within a year or so once we stop socking so much money at the house.

So far I like Estancia Paso Robles quite a bit, as well as Penfold Reserve Shiraz, as well as some of the Austrailian Shiraz/Syrahs. It's rare that I find a wine that is spectacular, but the times I do find them, I rarely write them down, even though I have a wine journal.

 

[AnthemAVM]

We have recently starting trying red wines, really enjoy, but don't have any place to store them.

I was just given a bottle that sells for $100 wish I could trade it for a few bottles.

 

[Adam]

Gulp. 300 bottles?! Wow, congrats my man. That's excellent. I'm tempted to try out some of your recent favorites.

I don't think I could buy that many. I'm not sure where I'd store 300 bottles of Manischewitz. (I joke, but I do like that Concord Grape during the cold holiday season.)

 

[j_garcia]

So far I like Estancia Paso Robles quite a bit, as well as Penfold Reserve Shiraz, as well as some of the Austrailian Shiraz/Syrahs. It's rare that I find a wine that is spectacular, but the times I do find them, I rarely write them down, even though I have a wine journal.

I have a wine journal too and it is more or less empty too

 

[irish]

Sorry if off topic but while people are throwing out favorites... mind would be Insignia. Also a big fan of Silver Oak and Opus One. Check out the artwork of Thomas Arvid for incredible wine prints.

 

[avaserfi]

In my undergrad I took a course on beverages for Hotel Restaurant Management majors. The class mostly focused on wine tasting, by region. It was a great time, especially seeing all the non-drinkers deal with the whisky/whiskey tasting day *gag gag gag*. I got a lot of extra tastes that day .

The end result of the class was a much larger appreciation for wine, of course. Sadly, my partner did not share that appreciation, until recently because I was still buying it to cook with. She ended up drinking it with me after cooking and it grew on her. Lately, we have been drinking more wine, we typically keep 6-8 bottles around. Nothing expensive, if we get a $20, for example, it is a special occasion or some fantastic deal. Along with that I am reading up on vinting. I have most of the tools from brewing, too bad I can't grow the grapes. Because of that I have tried my hand at some country wines, right now I have an apple wine fermenting. Its will be ready in about 6 more months.

So give some low end recommendations too, it is hard to find quality wines in lower price ranges especially as spoiled as I got in the class (we would regularly try 4-5 $60+ quality bottles a day). Right now we are just feeling out what is in our price range and running into some bad and some decent, nothing really worth buying again.