DO NOT BUY anything from AV123

[randyb]

It helps that Gene and the powers that be have left this thread open. Hooray for Gene.

 

[Chu Gai]

I really have to wonder about his vendors as well. Also, the people who have done design work for him. If he steals from raffles and friends, what about the people who do business with him in the normal course of business? My opinion would be that it is a "robbing Peter to pay Paul" thing.

I don't know if you remember Randy (I wish you'd use the same damned nick everywhere!!! ), but a fellow did post in another website that he'd run a D&B on AV123 and at the time he found AV123 was running 90 days late in payments.

MLS has also mentioned with great flourish various people that he's brought on board to do work. Now, some information I get on my own. Some I get from people emailing me what they've dug up but choose to remain silent. I did receive an email that suggested to me that one of the people he had employed was only employed for approximately 1/2 year before getting full time employment at another ID company. PM me for details. He did not give the impression that he'd been stiffed. Merely moved to a more stable and full-time gig. Sean though judging from a thread that was sequested on TCA, did indicate he was owed substantial amounts. Other past employees seem to have been compensated in a timely fashion.

 

[gonk]

I think I read somewhere that Sean did some work for them on their web site/computer systems right around the time he left, and he had expected to get paid for that work. Could be wrong, though, and I think he's limited in how much he can say publicly while the lawsuit is pending.

Edit: I searched for quite a while in hopes of finding the thread where Sean and MLS talked a bit about this, but couldn't turn anything up. I was hoping to try to reconstruct what the actual disagreement was, because the exchange took place months ago and I have forgotten the details.

 

[Chu Gai]

Quite so. Eventually it'll become a matter of public record and commented on in one of the newspapers in the appropriate section.

 

[randyb]

I think I read somewhere that Sean did some work for them on their web site/computer systems right around the time he left, and he had expected to get paid for that work. Could be wrong, though, and I think he's limited in how much he can say publicly while the lawsuit is pending.

He has sued?

 

[randyb]

I don't know if you remember Randy (I wish you'd use the same damned nick everywhere!!! ), but a fellow did post in another website that he'd run a D&B on AV123 and at the time he found AV123 was running 90 days late in payments.

MLS has also mentioned with great flourish various people that he's brought on board to do work. Now, some information I get on my own. Some I get from people emailing me what they've dug up but choose to remain silent. I did receive an email that suggested to me that one of the people he had employed was only employed for approximately 1/2 year before getting full time employment at another ID company. PM me for details. He did not give the impression that he'd been stiffed. Merely moved to a more stable and full-time gig. Sean though judging from a thread that was sequested on TCA, did indicate he was owed substantial amounts. Other past employees seem to have been compensated in a timely fashion.

Yea, sorry about the nicks....but someone might be gaining on me. I actually don't remember seeing the D&B thing. I used to run them all the time and on a small company they sometimes are pretty out of date and of course depend on the members to report. They do usually however, if I recall, pick-up tax liens and litigation.

 

[gonk]

He has sued?

There are lawyers involved on both sides...

 

[cschang]

I really have to wonder about his vendors as well. Also, the people who have done design work for him. If he steals from raffles and friends, what about the people who do business with him in the normal course of business? My opinion would be that it is a "robbing Peter to pay Paul" thing.

Also, I haven't bought anything from them in a long time (and not much at that) but recently I have been getting emails about special "bargains". How long can it go on?

I do know that most with a history in the mainstream audio business will not do business with him now. If you notice, those that do business with him now do not have a very long history in the audio business.

 

[randyb]

I do know that most with a history in the mainstream audio business will not do business with him now. If you notice, those that do business with him now do not have a very long history in the audio business.

The only problem is that right at the time things are going badly for customers, along comes a nice review in Stereophile.

 

[Chu Gai]

The only problem is that right at the time things are going badly for customers, along comes a nice review in Stereophile.

Wasn't that for a product that they no longer sold, didn't develop, and was out of production?

 

[cschang]

Wasn't that for a product that they no longer sold, didn't develop, and was out of production?

Right...the Onix Ref 1....which at the time the review was published, was not currently being sold by AV123, and hadn't been for a while.

I wonder what they did when people called asking about the speaker...

 

[randyb]

Right...the Onix Ref 1....which at the time the review was published, was not currently being sold by AV123, and hadn't been for a while.

I wonder what they did when people called asking about the speaker...

I didn't know they don't sell it anymore, but I am not sure what they sell this week. What models are the big sell models? I don't pay too much attention since the only speakers I bought from them were thier first model Rockets and my son has those in his bedroom. They are ones that Pierce designed the crossover, but who knows what production produced.

 

[Soundman]

It helps that Gene and the powers that be have left this thread open. Hooray for Gene.

I'm actually surprised by this. Aren't there like 800 posts now?

 

[Soundman]

I think I read somewhere that Sean did some work for them on their web site/computer systems right around the time he left, and he had expected to get paid for that work. Could be wrong, though, and I think he's limited in how much he can say publicly while the lawsuit is pending.

Edit: I searched for quite a while in hopes of finding the thread where Sean and MLS talked a bit about this, but couldn't turn anything up. I was hoping to try to reconstruct what the actual disagreement was, because the exchange took place months ago and I have forgotten the details.

I do know that a couple of years ago, Sean took care of me. He was awesome. Can only say good things about that guy.

 

[cschang]

I'm actually surprised by this. Aren't there like 800 posts now?

I am actually not a big fan of Audioholics as evidence of my join date and post count.

That said, I also give kudos to Audioholics for this thread. I think Gene and company would do the audio community well, and gain some hefty site visits if they wrote an article on the subject. A lot of facts can be stated, and a lot of questions asked.

 

[gonk]

If he means this Ref.1 review, then yes it is a product no longer offered by AV123. The Reference line was developed by others, although MLS may have had some input on some of the products. Onix has completely split from AV123 and started building a network of US dealers to sell their speakers and electronics. That split had already happened well before the Stereophile review was published. I wonder what the Stereophile editors thought when they realized that?

 

[gonk]

I do know that a couple of years ago, Sean took care of me. He was awesome. Can only say good things about that guy.

I've had positive dealings with Sean, buy that's mostly been through his new business.

 

[cschang]

I have my share of run ins with Sean and Steve during their time at AV123, but since then, all of my encounters with them have been positive.

 

[cschang]

If he means this Ref.1 review, then yes it is a product no longer offered by AV123. The Reference line was developed by others, although MLS may have had some input on some of the products. Onix has completely split from AV123 and started building a network of US dealers to sell their speakers and electronics. That split had already happened well before the Stereophile review was published. I wonder what the Stereophile editors thought when they realized that?

Yup...that's the one.

These reviews go to the manufacturer/dealer before the are published. Interesting that AV123 did not correct the fact that they did not sell the speaker anymore.

 

[just listening]

When I saw that review I began to wonder how long it had been in the can. I'd suspect that it was decided to be held back (after MLS saw it) until there was a month that needed some extra reviews and then inserted. Looking at the declining page count of Stereophile in the past year from 170 down to 104 pages, it's a reasonable explanation.