Obama ends program that let pilots carry guns

[JLMEMT]

You would be surprised. They are very good at what they are trained to do. And that is fly the aircraft within its specified limits under all weather conditions. But in my professional experience the majority of the unscheduled maintenance that is performed is the direct result of pilots flying the planes out of their rated spec. Whether it be overspeeding the engines, or passing the rated "G" spec.



You kind of make my point with your example of the wife and kids thing. Combat experienced soldiers are proficient in combat because they have come to accept death and do not crumble under extreme situations. I don't think most people realize how hard it would be to pick out a 6 inch target on a moving aircraft while in a crisis situation. It would be nearly impossible especially for someone that shoots at static targets from solid ground for practice once a year . I'm not saying that I agree with the decision at all, just offering a little more insight



See above post.


I think the best solution would be to equip all pilots with some sort of less than lethal weaponry. Such as a high velocity beanbag gun or an electric stun gun. Something that would not be able to penetrate the skin of the aircraft and would not kill someone which would certainly be the case with the discharge of a firearm in close proximity. Even if you hit the target its still a good chance the round would pass through and hit a civilian.

That would be great when you A; Get the terrorists to agree to only attack one at a time or B; create a new super less lethal weapon.


Tasers are worthless against multiple targets.

Beanbags, etc require a shotgun or 40mm type launcher. So now you want them to operate a long gun in the space that you argue they can't effectively use a handgun( designed for close quarter combat)??

 

[markw]

That's great, but what is your plan to do it?


The Israeli's have it figured out pretty well, but not enough people get blown up here for that to be accepted.

They don't have a surfeit of lawyers salivating over the thought of suing the screening agencies for the civil rights violations they would have to commit by using profiling.

Not that I'm against profiling. It works great in Israel and I'm sure it could work well here, given a chance. We're just not allowed to use that tool. ...Pity. It would probably make flying much more plesasurable.

 

[Rickster71]

I guess there really is no answer at all.....we are a nation of hand wringers.

That's why the whole war on terror is a joke.

As long as people in the 'softened' USA bristle and whine at the thought of prisoners with women's underwear on their heads in Abu Ghraib prison or Guantánamo Bay. When the thought of 'Water Boarding' (Simulated drowning) makes the USA go boo-hoo.
And spineless politicians run the war by public opinion polls. We will always lose.

When the enemy is willing to do whatever it takes, and we are too squeamish, we will lose.
The enemy knows we are a country divided, they've seen us blink.

When one of our solders is captured and they cut their heads off, and put it on Youtube.
All, while we're still whining about the underwear.

I'm gonna go hide under my bed...

 

[JLMEMT]

Point taken.

Non-lethal is best.

Bean bag shot gun. That would scare the daylights out of a terrorist wielding a box cutter.

They hurt and they offer brief psychomotor disruption, but they are hardly a effective close quarter weapon or an effective way to put someone out of the fight.

We are not talking about someone here that is a loudmouth because they aren't getting a drink soon enough, we are talking about someone that is seriously trying to take over the plane. I realize only a minor difference to some, but to me it matters.

 

[JLMEMT]

Amendment- from now on all flight attendants must be hot virgins...

Talk about starting over!

That may be like an honest politician.

 

[aberkowitz]

Talk about starting over!

That may be like an honest politician.

How about the Austin Powers approach- hot fembots that can shoot knockout gas out of their boobs??

Alternatively, they could just pay me to fly on planes and eat Chipotle all day long.... although I'm not sure if that would knock people out or just plane kill them .

 

[JLMEMT]

They don't have a surfeit of lawyers salivating over the thought of suing the screening agencies for the civil rights violations they would have to commit by using profiling.

Not that I'm against profiling. It works great in Israel and I'm sure it could work well here, given a chance. We're just not allowed to use that tool. ...Pity. It would probably make flying much more plesasurable.

Though it has to be done "right" to work. And I am afraid that most of the current TSA couldn't get it right. See the previous posts about $9 an hour and quality. Not to mention some of the power hungry clowns they have found.

 

[krzywica]

or just plane kill them .

Was that an accidental pun?

 

[Matt34]

Though it has to be done "right" to work. And I am afraid that most of the current TSA couldn't get it right. See the previous posts about $9 an hour and quality. Not to mention some of the power hungry clowns they have found.

I about got into a damn fist fight with the TSA schmucks at O'Hare a couple years ago because they wanted to search my trained explosive detector dog/attack dog for concealed contraband.

 

[krzywica]

Yeah those guys are a real PITA when your coming back to CONUS.

 

[markw]

I about got into a damn fist fight with the TSA schmucks at O'Hare a couple years ago because they wanted to search my trained explosive detector dog/attack dog for concealed contraband.

Ya shoulda told them that's inserted rectally and tey should go for it.

As for another post, a few "professionals" well-trained in profling should be able to replace a goodly number of these minimum-wage clowns that impede me from boarding airplanes.

 

[aberkowitz]

Was that an accidental pun?

Oops , my bad!

 

[highfigh]

Playing devil's advocate:

#1. That's racists and profiling.

#2. They are too busy searching grandmothers, and diaper bags...just so they won't be accused of profiling.

Re: profiling terrorists- someone mentioned "If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, and it's made of wood..."- very few attacks on the US have been carried out by people who weren't Middle Eastern and if they can't accept the fact that we don't want these incidents repeated for that reason, they're being pretty uncaring of how the US general population felt when 9-11 happened.

 

[Rickster71]

Re: profiling terrorists- someone mentioned "If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, and it's made of wood..."- very few attacks on the US have been carried out by people who weren't Middle Eastern and if they can't accept the fact that we don't want these incidents repeated for that reason, they're being pretty uncaring of how the US general population felt when 9-11 happened.

I see you're not taking the terrorists' feelings into account.

 

[highfigh]

I see you're not taking the terrorists' feelings into account.

There's a two word saying that covers my thoughts on this and the second one is them. The first word has four letters.

 

[Alex2507]

I see you're not taking the terrorists' feelings into account.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But when some innocent guy from Michigan gets locked up for 8 months because of the usual reasons we would lock up an innocent guy from Michigan (turban, beard, ceremonial dagger, likes to pray, etc) ... you know? I'm not saying that I have the answer but we can't have all that nonsense going on either.

 

[mike c]

Ya shoulda told them that's inserted rectally and tey should go for it.

i think that's how they were gonna do it and why Matt was gonna bust them up. (unless there's another way to search for concealed items on a dog) [unless matt's dog had pants and pockets]

As for another post, a few "professionals" well-trained in profling should be able to replace a goodly number of these minimum-wage clowns that impede me from boarding airplanes.

yeah, i read somewhere that these profilers were pretty accurate - catching those BEFORE they do anything bad.

my luggage was checked by TSA this January, but this time they didn't break the lock - and it wasn't a TSA-approved lock. that was great
(guess bath and body liquid soaps were pretty suspicious )

my last lock was snipped by TSA.

 

[annunaki]

Playing devil's advocate:

#1. That's racists and profiling.

#2. They are too busy searching grandmothers, and diaper bags...just so they won't be accused of profiling.

People need to realize that some toes are going to get stepped on from time to time. It is not intentional nor personal. It is the safety of all that is at stake.

You cannot please everyone all of the time. However, you can please most of the people most of the time.

 

[Rickster71]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But when some innocent guy from Michigan gets locked up for 8 months because of the usual reasons we would lock up an innocent guy from Michigan (turban, beard, ceremonial dagger, likes to pray, etc) ... you know? I'm not saying that I have the answer but we can't have all that nonsense going on either.

I hear you brother.
Makes you wonder why all the innocent guys from Michigan (w/ turbans, beards) don't put some heat on their people that are making them all look bad.

What's the first thing that happens when a new guy shows up on a union job and works too fast?....

 

[GlocksRock]

Let's just take the traditional democratic approach and just ban the evil planes, because we all know that without the planes, there will be no more crime.

The guns aren't the problem here, and it's not hard to see that.