where are you guys buying your subs?

[pjoseph]

I am torn between buying my JL 13W1 on ebay or from the car audio shop down the street which is selling it for a lot more money.
what do you think?

 

[Guiria]

For me there are a handful of factors involved in purchasing online or local:

1. Warranty coverage
2. Service
3. What is my risk level acceptance for online purchases without warranty
4. How much is shipping? How much are taxes?

Ask yourself those questions and go for it.

 

[tcarcio]

Depends on what you need and what kind of enclosure your going to use. I bought my recent sub here and they have a few choices and the owner is reliable and will give you any advice you might need. www.diycable.com

 

[annunaki]

Some JL Audio equipment sold through the internet is compromised* to remove serial numbers & such. JL is very much against trans-shipped merchandise (which is how you see it online other than through Crutchfield or used as JL does not allow online sales.

The best bet is to work with a local dealer to get a good price. Negotiate. Tell him he can earn your business (and likely future business/referrals) by meeting you halfway or more (from the pricing you see online) or you will find it through other channels.

*by compromised, I mean solvent used to lift the spider to gain access to the serial number placed underneath, amplifiers having circuit boards removed to remove the serial # underneath them, etc.

FYI JL will not service any product that has been tampered with or the Serial # removed. Nor will they honor warranty if purchased from an unauthorized dealer.

 

[MidnightSensi]

Always purchase from an authorized dealer. You'll pay a bit more, but you know your getting a new product and you can register it with JL for warranty.

I always call companies to find dealers, because sometimes companies will say they are when they really aren't. Sometimes websites have dealer locators also.

 

[WmAx]

LOL! I know this is about a W1, but let's take it up a notch or three.... I would never buy a JL W7 from an authorized dealer... nor even suggest anyone else do so. You can practically get two 'unauthorized' ones for the price of an 'authorized' dealer unit. There are reliable places to buy them that provide a replacement warranty for a year. There must be some serious mark up at the 'authorized' places considering how cheap you can get brand new W7s from other sources.

-Chris

 

[MidnightSensi]

LOL! I know this is about a W1, but let's take it up a notch or three.... I would never buy a JL W7 from an authorized dealer... nor even suggest anyone else do so. You can practically get two 'unauthorized' ones for the price of an 'authorized' dealer unit. There are reliable places to buy them that provide a replacement warranty for a year. There must be some serious mark up at the 'authorized' places considering how cheap you can get brand new W7s from other sources.

-Chris

The difference is one place sells floating, possibly used, stolen or misallocated product versus the other one sells units shipped from a JL distributor. Like mentioned earlier, some of that stuff if you run the serial number with JL it turns out to be a false serial number. It's actually fairly common, especially in car audio which is absolutely full of crooks. When they go after the retailer they say it was from somewhere else and it costs too much to prosecute them, costs the company money and ends up raising the price of legit speakers. Some of those online retailers that sell at a discount buy through various channels, that could be even stolen, pushed around to get it clean enough to sell.

 

[WmAx]

The difference is one place sells floating, possibly used, stolen or misallocated product versus the other one sells units shipped from a JL distributor. Like mentioned earlier, some of that stuff if you run the serial number with JL it turns out to be a false serial number. It's actually fairly common, especially in car audio which is absolutely full of crooks. When they go after the retailer they say it was from somewhere else and it costs too much to prosecute them, costs the company money and ends up raising the price of legit speakers. Some of those online retailers that sell at a discount buy through various channels, that could be even stolen, pushed around to get it clean enough to sell.

Whatever; the authorized price is absurd, and a poor value. I have purchased W7s from two different discount sellers and they are a perfect product, and have no evidence of being disassembled as mentioned earlier. I doubt these very large companies I have used are giant fencers... instead they just likely violate the JL resale policy which is no big deal to me.

-Chris

 

[MidnightSensi]

Whatever; the authorized price is absurd, and a poor value.

No disagreement there.

I have purchased W7s from two different discount sellers and they are a perfect product, and have no evidence of being disassembled as mentioned earlier. I doubt these very large companies I have used are giant fencers... instead they just likely violate the JL resale policy which is no big deal to me.

-Chris

We'll have to agree to disagree. Those retailers don't fence the products themselves, but they buy gray market stuff that has questionable origin and don't ask the questions. It's the only way they can sell discounted product, because JL regulates the price and would drop an authorized dealer that did that. They do this to prevent dealers from undercutting eachother/to protect margins. There is no legit way to get around this. If JL has outpriced me then I'll have to buy something less expensive, but I'm not going to support gray market buying.

 

[chucksrt]

I look for items for sale locally or at least some what local but I have bought things online for mega discounts and not had any problems. I is shameful how much mark up goes into some of these products. I bought a car amp that cost $600 and it failed over a year later, I contacted the manufacture and it cost $150 to rebuild it and by rebuild I mean replace all of the internals and there was still a profit on that i'm sure. So if I can find a deal And it seems ok that's enough for me.

 

[annunaki]

LOL! I know this is about a W1, but let's take it up a notch or three.... I would never buy a JL W7 from an authorized dealer... nor even suggest anyone else do so. You can practically get two 'unauthorized' ones for the price of an 'authorized' dealer unit. There are reliable places to buy them that provide a replacement warranty for a year. There must be some serious mark up at the 'authorized' places considering how cheap you can get brand new W7s from other sources.

-Chris

Chris,

I have a friend/customer of mine that tried getting "warranty" from one of those places. There was a $125.00 charge for their "warranty" work. In theory what they preach sounds good, but in practice it rarely works that way.

That is just one experience I know about though.

 

[Guiria]

We'll have to agree to disagree. Those retailers don't fence the products themselves, but they buy gray market stuff that has questionable origin and don't ask the questions. It's the only way they can sell discounted product, because JL regulates the price and would drop an authorized dealer that did that. They do this to prevent dealers from undercutting eachother/to protect margins. There is no legit way to get around this. If JL has outpriced me then I'll have to buy something less expensive, but I'm not going to support gray market buying.

While the product is different the principles are the same. I own a small online store and ebay profile selling high end bicycle components, my sources are the same sources as legit bike shops across the nation. In fact my distributor knows we sell online but they need our business just as bad as they need the bike shops business so they let it go. Just because its gray market doesn't mean it was a knock off, used, or otherwise B grade. As an example our website offers wheelsets with full warranty and we are an online authorized seller. If we sell that same wheelset on ebay, the manufacturer warranty is gone, but that's the only difference. We offer a warranty for the product so the customer is still covered.

If customers have problems we work with our distributor and sometimes the manufacturer to solve the problem and we've never run into problems where the manufacturer won't honor their product warranty.

Perhaps speakers are different, but there are a lot of people selling EXACTLY the same product online that you can buy local but for less.

To the OP, of course the decision is yours, and their is risk involved in shopping online from unauthorized dealers but be careful from who you buy and you will most likely get an excellent, legit product at a great value.

 

[adwilk]

Its sad, unfortunately, that online retailers to some extent have absolutely destroyed some retail industries. But, at the same time, have boosted total retail sales across the board and have been a positive influence in minor economic growth in some cases.

Pre-Ecommerce, You had to buy from a dealer, or out of the newspaper. Possibly the classic mail order approach was taken. Point is, you kept your dollars local, improved your local marketplace, and things were fine cause we didnt know any better.

Lets say local stereo guy needs to gross 2500 dollars a day to stay in business.

he sells ACME product for $500, makes a profit of 250 and sells 10 a day.

now come internet sales

He now only sells 6 units a day.. what happens to his price to keep his doors open?

Now thats a very elementary example for a quite complex issue. Internet sales drive retail prices in all kinds of directions depending on particular business model. He can up his price hoping his 6 remain to make ends meet or he can follow the walmart model and hope for higher volume lower margin...

No matter what though, the PERCEIVED VALUE at the retail level is shot. The price no longer seems reasonable... BUT the old addage of "you get what you pay for" is important.

Chris (WmAx) is the anomoly, he knows what to expect when he opens his JL box and understands the legitimacy of it... he also knows the parameters of making that product perform optimally and safely for years of use.

99% of the American public do not.

I've been in the golf industry for years... I'm comfortable ordering some things online...

The average golfer at a retailer pays 700 for a set... he can buy that same set online for 250. What to do... what to do...

That 700 buys him the set of clubs, properly fit, properly warranteed and with true expert advice on the product hes buying.. once more, he knows the product is 100% Legit. He got what he paid for.

The unit online fits a guy twice is strenth and size, is the wrong model for his game, not guaranteed against breakage and is made in TsinTsou's garage.

Which is the better value...

You can do what you want... but when any of us buy specialty equipment in any form or function, you purchase more than the product. You purchase the service, the linneage of the product, the peace of mind of quality, the product itself, and the satisfaction of knowing who you did business with and knowing that you are truly a valued customer.

I personally think spending money at a local retailer is the only obvious choice with a few, very very rare exceptions. At least, at the very least, buy only from credible authorized dealers.

All that said, i have nothing against ID companies at all, my experience has led me to believe that the buying experience from these companies is perfectly legit.

Sorry to all the good guys out there in cyberspace, the bad guys ruined it for ya....

 

[WmAx]

I personally think spending money at a local retailer is the only obvious choice with a few, very very rare exceptions. At least, at the very least, buy only from credible authorized dealers. .

In the case of 'authorized' dealers... some manufacturers will not authorize simply on account of the reseller selling below M.A.P. The M.A.P. on JL W7 drivers is obscene and one of the circumstances where I must disagree with making sure it's from an 'authorized' dealer. A 12" W7 is $840 minimum, from an authorized dealer. It's $450 from a discount seller. You practically buy 2 for the price of one! Buying discount, one can yield a great deal and make a superb value DIY subwoofer project. With the M.A.P., I can't even recommend the driver.

-Chris

 

[adwilk]

You practically buy 2 for the price of one!

-Chris

Exactly, just one driver failure from an unauthorized account and replacement is more than just buying one from an authorized acct.

 

[WmAx]

Exactly, just one driver failure from an unauthorized account and replacement is more than just buying one from an authorized acct.

I do not understand your intended meaning.

-Chris

 

[T2T]

I do not understand your intended meaning.

-Chris

It appears as if he's meant that if you buy from an unauthorized source and then have problems, you'll have to buy a new driver. Purchasing 2 drivers from the unauthorized channels could cost more than 1 driver from an authorized source - and, feature warranty coverage.

Personal comment: I don't believe the chances of failure are that high. I like to live on the edge and "self insure" as needed with purchases. Plus, one has to read the fine print. The manufacturer could substitute the item with a refurbished item instead of repairing yours or giving you a new replacement. Back to "self insurance" - if you buy the cheaper one, pack the money saved away for a rainy day.

 

[WmAx]

It appears as if he's meant that if you buy from an unauthorized source and then have problems, you'll have to buy a new driver. Purchasing 2 drivers from the unauthorized channels could cost more than 1 driver from an authorized source - and, feature warranty coverage.

Personal comment: I don't believe the chances of failure are that high. I like to live on the edge and "self insure" as needed with purchases. Plus, one has to read the fine print. The manufacturer could substitute the item with a refurbished item instead of repairing yours or giving you a new replacement. Back to "self insurance" - if you buy the cheaper one, pack the money saved away for a rainy day.

Oh, well for marginally more (about $60), one can buy 2 of the W7 12" drivers from the unauthorized source as compared to a single unit from the 'authorized' source. That seems like quite the excellent 'warranty' to me -- an entire extra back up unit.

JL, if they really refuse to even service a sub for pay, that was bought from a non-authorized dealer; that would really make them a true a-hole if you ask me..... it's already bad enough that they refuse to stand behind their own products because you did not pay the conspired wallet-rape prices that an 'authorized' dealer is FORCED to charge by JL.

But, as you said, the chances seem pretty minimal that you will have a failure.

-Chris

 

[annunaki]

JL will service for a fee, however, if the serial numbers are removed or defaced they will not service a unit.

 

[highfigh]

So, when does ethics rear its ugly head in this kind of discussion?