Damn you McCain!!!

[Rickster71]

Maybe I'm just cynical, but how much does an 80% approval rating mean in a state that has more caribou and reindeer than human beings?

80% is pretty good, considering here in these forums we don't have that kind of consensus when it comes to LP's vs CD's, or if all amps sound the same.

 

[itschris]

Obama would probably do a good job because of the fact that he would be the first black man to be elected president and this is his chance to show america that he (and black people, for lack of a better term) can do it and its also his chance to try and persuade the hearts and minds of the racist people to believe otherwise.

He wont screw that up. He cant.

There are still many people who grew up and lived in a time when things were very different than today. It wasnt that long ago. We have come a long way and this is a great step forward.

I don't disagree with that. I do believe that we all hold our own personal prejudices, but I think Obama's success, which is based on very little other than his own charisma and media driven persona, is a testament that we've moved beyond the rascism of yesterday.

In fact, I'm proud to be a Republican and I'm proud to say our current administration had been one of the most inclusive in history. Black Secratary of State, Latino AG. I'm a huge fan Colin Powell and though I disagree with some of his politics, I think he's a man of character and proven success. I'd be honored to have him as my president.

I just don't see nor have that confidence in Obama. I question his judgement, his motives, and his record...what little there is. I'm tired of every time someone questions him, it's labeled as an smear or attack, like he's somehow unimpeachable, yet it goes completely unnoticed when he outright lies like he did in his speech. He brought up and took a shot at McCain for saying that he thought the middle class was $5mm in income. He knew damn well that the comment was made in jest to make a point in a broader conversation. In fact, McCain even laughed after he said that and said I'm sure my opponent will take that last comment and mischaracterize what I said. True to form I guess.

I'm proud that Obama has had the success that he's had. It proves to me that we've moved beyond where we used to be. I just wish this movement was behind someone of more substance, someone who was more than a charasmatic speech.

 

[itschris]

Obama would probably do a good job because of the fact that he would be the first black man to be elected president and this is his chance to show america that he ....

Another thing I'd like to have a better understanding of. If there's any black members here, I'd like your opinion. I keep hearing he cold be the first black president. He's very much done a very artful job of leverging that he's black.

But isn't he also half white? Why isnt that ever mentioned or talked about. If you're part black, does that make you black? I often try to put myself in the shoes of others and I think if I were black, I'd be a bit insulted that he's leveraged himself on that... as if he'd be riding on my back as a black man to take advantage. I think his upbringing bears little resemblence to the struggle that many black people his age had faced. If he was 25% black, would he still be black, would he still be the first black president if elected?

I just find it odd that he has foresaken his "white side" in a seemingly transparent effort to say "I'm one of you" and gain the support of the black population.

I'm really hoping to get some feedback on this, because I really want to understand this issue. Like I said, I try to put myself in other people's shoes, but I won't fool myself and pretend I have a true perspective.

 

[zhimbo]

But isn't he also half white? Why isnt that ever mentioned or talked about. If you're part black, does that make you black?

Look at him. If you saw him for the first time, and didn't know who he was, would you hesitate for an instant in thinking he was a black person?

"Black" and "white" aren't primarily about biology. They're about social classification. Growing up, do you think people classified him as black or not?

I just find it odd that he has foresaken his "white side" .

He sure features his white mother and white grandparents an awful lot to say he's "forsaken" his white side. I don't really see where he's "forsaken" any of his heritage.

 

[zhimbo]

I just wish this movement was behind someone of more substance, someone who was more than a charasmatic speech.

Download a 60 page policy statement here

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

It's about as specific (less in some ways, more in others) as McCain's policy statements:

http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/

Convention speeches, etc., are poor places for wonky lists of specific policies.

 

[gus6464]

You are right about him being half white half black. His mother was from Kansas and came from a Baptist/Methodist background.

I always find it funny when he keeps pulling the race card (he says he's black). I am half Panamanian and half Chinese but when everyone asks me what I am I just always say I am mixed even though I look for the most part Latino. If you saw me you would never be able to tell that I am half Chinese but I still let everyone know that I am. It seems as if Obama is shunning away half of where he came from just to win an election and I take a big offense to that. This is one of the main reasons I never liked him from the beginning.

 

[itschris]

Look at him. If you saw him for the first time, and didn't know who he was, would you hesitate for an instant in thinking he was a black person?

"Black" and "white" aren't primarily about biology. They're about social classification. Growing up, do you think people classified him as black or not?



He sure features his white mother and white grandparents an awful lot to say he's "forsaken" his white side. I don't really see where he's "forsaken" any of his heritage.

I've seen him cozy up to the black part of society, even referring to himself as black... so I was just wondering about the part of him that's white.

I'm not judgeing as much as I'm trying to understand this phenomenom.

 

[itschris]

Download a 60 page policy statement here

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/

It's about as specific (less in some ways, more in others) as McCain's policy statements:

http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/

Convention speeches, etc., are poor places for wonky lists of specific policies.

I'll give it a read. I've done quite a bit of research already, and typically come away with little in the way of detail. Thanks for the info.

 

[itschris]

Anybody catch Bill Maher last night? "The Maverick and the MILF" priceless

I'm fairly open minded and do my best to respect other's opinions, but Bill Mahar is just one of those guys I can't stomach. He has that arrogant, "You're just not smart enought to 'get it'" way about him that just makes me want to reach through the TV.

 

[majorloser]

Anybody catch Bill Maher last night? "The Maverick and the MILF" priceless

 

[Adam]

Hee, hee, hee! I just watched the Bill Maher video - thanks to Dave and Gene for that.

That's hilarious! I don't have to agree with it all, but I found it very funny. The final punchline was probably my favorite.

 

[aberkowitz]

That Bill Maher monologue was hysterical. "It looked a lot like John Edwards"- that just killed me!!!

 

[Alex2507]

I'm fairly open minded and do my best to respect other's opinions, but Bill Mahar is just one of those guys I can't stomach. He has that arrogant, "You're just not smart enought to 'get it'" way about him that just makes me want to reach through the TV.

I'm okay with the arrogance, it's that built in questioning whine that gets me.

I still liked the bit.

 

[mtrycrafts]

That Bill Maher monologue was hysterical. "It looked a lot like John Edwards"- that just killed me!!!

"The concept of Pulling out"
Hysterical

 

[jamie2112]

I cannot agree more on some of the things Bill said. It is scary to think a soccer mom could step into the president position if the maverick dies" which is a good possibility" he is very old and I have watched him fumble more than a few speeches. I can't believe the Republican party...... No offense to resident republicans but jeeze this makes NO sense to me.......
Mike please don't ban me......

 

[itschris]

I cannot agree more on some of the things Bill said. It is scary to think a soccer mom could step into the president position if the maverick dies" which is a good possibility" he is very old and I have watched him fumble more than a few speeches. I can't believe the Republican party...... No offense to resident republicans but jeeze this makes NO sense to me.......
Mike please don't ban me......

Soccer mom? No disrespect, but you don't know a lot about her career I guess. What qualifies Obama? Less then a year in congress?

 

[itschris]

You mean like Bill O'Rielly? Maybe its just a thing with guys named Bill

O'Rielly is at least an equal opportunity offender. He's been a tough critic on the Bush Admin and even Paul Wolfson said the he, along with FOX in general, had provided the fairest coverage.

The head on MSNBC are outright ridiculous the way they swoon whenever you mention Obama's name. For me, it's not a right - left thing, but a substance thing. Everyone's just so caught up in the celebrity and the spectacle that they seem to be losing sight of what's important.

Anyway, these conversations are fun, but become useless when they become a debate about ideaology.

I was really trying to understand the 50/50 black/white issue. I just find that compelling that he's considered black, that he refers to himself as black, leverages the black community, yet he's also white. I wanted to understand that better. I'm still not sure I do. It begs the question, if he wasn't black, would he still be as popular? Would we even be talking about him or would he be thought of like any other inexperienced congressman?

 

[billy p]

Soccer mom? No disrespect, but you don't know a lot about her career I guess. What qualifies Obama? Less then a year in congress?

Lighten up a bit!

 

[jamie2112]

Ok Chris you are right I didn't spend 2 hours researching her story. My conclusion is she is a glorified soccer mom with 5 kids who was mayor in a small town of less than 5000 people and other than that she has NO political record at all. I am not even going to consider JM's choice for VP as his campaign is now going to pull out all the stops I am sure. If the people didn't want Hillary why the h#$% are they going to vote for a woman who has 1/100th of the experience of her. It doesn't make sense to me. The fact that you are even bringing up the "black" issue is enough to make me amazed at your thinking........This is my last post on this subject because it turns people into political Anal-lists....sorry just my opinion....
Please don't ban me Mike.........

Chris Have YOU looked at Obama's career?

 

[jamie2112]

Sorry to get so Uptight at this subject but I am tired of people looking at the world with blinders on.......Last post on this just wanted to say sorry for getting so aggro on this....Back to Audio now....