sub encloser to build or not to build

[ticks77]

ok i have absolutly no idea on what to do ....

i have a dayton HF 15 and no box.

the guy at P and E said they sell a 3.0cuFT box but it has no ports and that i could stuff it and get an F3 of 34 hz

or i could build one he said "The smallest would be 5.4 cu. ft. with a 4" port x 22.11" long, that would give you an F3 of 25.33 Hz" when i asked him what the smallest i could get away with ported and get 25hz. he recommended 8.8 cu ft

what do i??? does anyone have detailed plans for a box that would sound good with my 15 and hit as low or lower than 25 hz
need plans bad very detaild

 

[TLS Guy]

ok i have absolutly no idea on what to do ....

i have a dayton HF 15 and no box.

the guy at P and E said they sell a 3.0cuFT box but it has no ports and that i could stuff it and get an F3 of 34 hz

or i could build one he said "The smallest would be 5.4 cu. ft. with a 4" port x 22.11" long, that would give you an F3 of 25.33 Hz" when i asked him what the smallest i could get away with ported and get 25hz. he recommended 8.8 cu ft

what do i??? does anyone have detailed plans for a box that would sound good with my 15 and hit as low or lower than 25 hz
need plans bad very detaild

Please look on the DIY and sub forums. Use the search engine. I have posted a lot of Dayton alignments. See if yours is there, if not I will run for you. I need the exact model number so I can find the Thiel/Small parameters.

You need to educate yourself a little first before we go over the same ground again.

Here is one thread and there are quite a few others.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37690

 

[ticks77]

295-468 i have educated myself enough i just dont have the software

 

[ticks77]

so a 3.0 would be good?

 

[TLS Guy]

Alignments you requested

Here are your alignments. The vented enclosure is large.

Name: 295-468
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: Dayton Loudspeaker
No. of Drivers = 1
Fs = 18 Hz
Qms = 3.1
Vas = 270.3 liters
Cms = 1.478 mm/N
Mms = 52.88 g
Rms = 1.929 kg/s
Xmax = 14 mm
Xmech = 21 mm
P-Dia = 213.7 mm
Sd = 358.8 sq.cm
P-Vd = 0.502 liters
Qes = 0.49
Re = 3.3 ohms
Le = 1 mH
Z = 4 ohms
BL = 6.347 Tm
Pe = 500 watts
Qts = 0.42
no = 0.31 %
1-W SPL = 87.06 dB
2.83-V SPL = 90 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Vented Box
Shape: Prism, square (optimum)
Vb = 8.933 cu.ft
Fb = 16.29 Hz
QL = 5.274
F3 = 19.13 Hz
Fill = minimal
No. of Vents = 2
Vent shape = round
Vent ends = two flared
Dv = 4 in
Lv = 25.95 in

The vent velocity is 20 m/sec which is excellent.

Here is your sealed alignment.

Name: 295-468
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: Dayton Loudspeaker
No. of Drivers = 1
Fs = 18 Hz
Qms = 3.1
Vas = 270.3 liters
Cms = 1.478 mm/N
Mms = 52.88 g
Rms = 1.929 kg/s
Xmax = 14 mm
Xmech = 21 mm
P-Dia = 213.7 mm
Sd = 358.8 sq.cm
P-Vd = 0.502 liters
Qes = 0.49
Re = 3.3 ohms
Le = 1 mH
Z = 4 ohms
BL = 6.347 Tm
Pe = 500 watts
Qts = 0.42
no = 0.31 %
1-W SPL = 87.06 dB
2.83-V SPL = 90 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Closed Box
Shape: Prism, square (optimum)
Vb = 2.452 cu.ft
Qtc = 0.707
QL = 17.04
F3 = 36.93 Hz
Fill = heavy

Although this is a 15 inch woofer, it is not the best I have come across. In both the vented and sealed alignment have cone displacement issues. Xmax is exceeded below 50 Hz.

Sealed this driver is limited to 20 watts at 30 Hz. Vented it is limited to 40 watts at 30 Hz. Even if you put this in a sealed enclosure of 0.538 cu.ft, the power handling sealed is only 40 watts and the F3 is 53 Hz which hardly classified it as sub.

I'm sorry but this is not a promising driver. If you go to all this trouble may be you should consider the infinity kappa perfect 12.

I have built quite a few speakers. In my view a driver or drivers have to be worth the effort. I would not devote time to this driver personally.

 

[TLS Guy]

I forgot to state that there is no significant difference in the performance between a sealed 3.0 cu.ft sealed enclosure and the one modeled.

 

[TLS Guy]

I forgot to state that there is no significant difference in the performance between a sealed 3.0 cu.ft sealed enclosure and the one modeled.

BTW your 5.4 cu.ft vented enclosure has an F3 of 24Hz. In needs two flared ports 3 inches in diameter and 25 inches long. That enclosure really needs a constructed slot vent. The air speed is about 35 m/sec which is on the high side.

 

[ticks77]

Although this is a 15 inch woofer, it is not the best I have come across. In both the vented and sealed alignment have cone displacement issues. Xmax is exceeded below 50 Hz.

Sealed this driver is limited to 20 watts at 30 Hz. Vented it is limited to 40 watts at 30 Hz. Even if you put this in a sealed enclosure of 0.538 cu.ft, the power handling sealed is only 40 watts and the F3 is 53 Hz which hardly classified it as sub.

I'm sorry but this is not a promising driver. If you go to all this trouble may be you should consider the infinity kappa perfect 12.

I have built quite a few speakers. In my view a driver or drivers have to be worth the effort. I would not devote time to this driver personally.

what????? i have the 12 and it is awesome very loud my neighbors down the street can hear it like a car stero very clean bass no distortion shakes the house the 15 will be even better so i dont really know what your talkin about, have you actually heard one of the HF 12s or 15s? dont know what your program said but anything reaching below 20 hz with little or no distortion is a good speaker in my book

 

[ticks77]

the kappa is weak sounds like crap compared to my HF 12 my boy down the street has it .... and its in the proper box with propper watts my ears dont lie man

 

[ticks77]

how is 18hz which is part of the freq range hardly classified as a subwoofer? next your gonna tell me my solobaric is not loud which has won 2 comps.
not talkin trash or nothin just saying some of your info might be a lil off

 

[TLS Guy]

My info is not off. I have accurately modeled the woofer. I was referring to the half cubic foot sealed enclosure as not qualifying to be sub, as the F3 was above 50 Hz. The other alignments qualify as subs.

Now I have modeled quite a few Dayton subs and they are all very different.

These models accurately reflect the performance of this driver.

I'm sorry but it is a fact that this driver requires a very large in enclosure in vented format to optimize performance. Even then the driver is power limited below 50 Hz because it reaches its mechanical limits. You pretty much know that this driver will take a huge enclosure, because the Qts is on the high side. This driver I can tell is really intended to be used in a sealed enclosure. Its F3 is then in the neighborhood of 30 Hz which is actually pretty good for a driver in this price range. I'm just saying there are more promising drivers out there which there are.

Anyhow I stand by my data, and it agrees very closely with what you were given before. Previously you were never given the data about power handling and frequency. It still produces 102 db below 50 Hz. It just produces 114 db above 50 Hz

Anyhow those are the facts. Don't shoot the messenger.

 

[ticks77]

ok run this one if you get a chance im useing this speaker 295-464 in this box 300-635 which has two ports with a 240 amp all found and PandE website

 

[ticks77]

what are the dimentions of a 6 cu ft box like length width height and how would the 6 cu ft box sound and length of the port?

 

[annunaki]

I will check the HF series 15" woofer when I get a chance later tonight. I thought it modeled fairly well in a 4.6 cu.ft. sealed enclosure. When using the notch filter on the Dayton HSA plate amplifiers an f3 of 25hz was possible. I have plans for the enclosure as well. They are hand drawn but work well. I will model it again to check for excursion issues.

 

[TLS Guy]

ok run this one if you get a chance im useing this speaker 295-464 in this box 300-635 which has two ports with a 240 amp all found and PandE website

You will have to send a link. I can't find that site.

Here is the 4.6 cu.ft sealed enclosure recommended by Anunaki.
It is xmax limited at 60 Hz

Name: 295-468
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: Dayton Loudspeaker
No. of Drivers = 1
Fs = 18 Hz
Qms = 3.1
Vas = 270.3 liters
Cms = 1.478 mm/N
Mms = 52.88 g
Rms = 1.929 kg/s
Xmax = 14 mm
Xmech = 21 mm
P-Dia = 213.7 mm
Sd = 358.8 sq.cm
P-Vd = 0.502 liters
Qes = 0.49
Re = 3.3 ohms
Le = 1 mH
Z = 4 ohms
BL = 6.347 Tm
Pe = 500 watts
Qts = 0.42
no = 0.31 %
1-W SPL = 87.06 dB
2.83-V SPL = 90 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Closed Box
Shape: Prism, square (optimum)
Vb = 4.6 cu.ft
Qtc = 0.588
QL = 17.04
F3 = 36.11 Hz
Fill = heavy

Here is the 6 cu.ft vented you asked for. Vent velocity is 33m/sec. It becomes xmax limited at 50 Hz.

Name: 295-468
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: Dayton Loudspeaker
No. of Drivers = 1
Fs = 18 Hz
Qms = 3.1
Vas = 270.3 liters
Cms = 1.478 mm/N
Mms = 52.88 g
Rms = 1.929 kg/s
Xmax = 14 mm
Xmech = 21 mm
P-Dia = 213.7 mm
Sd = 358.8 sq.cm
P-Vd = 0.502 liters
Qes = 0.49
Re = 3.3 ohms
Le = 1 mH
Z = 4 ohms
BL = 6.347 Tm
Pe = 500 watts
Qts = 0.42
no = 0.31 %
1-W SPL = 87.06 dB
2.83-V SPL = 90 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Vented Box
Shape: Prism, square (optimum)
Vb = 6 cu.ft
Fb = 16.29 Hz
QL = 5.274
F3 = 23.04 Hz
Fill = minimal
No. of Vents = 2
Vent shape = round
Vent ends = two flared
Dv = 3 in
Lv = 22.31 in

Actually the 3cu.ft sealed that was originally suggested to you seems as good as any. Remember the sealed enclosures roll off at 12 db per octave and the Vented at 24 db per octave.

 

[ticks77]

thanks man the guy at p and e sujested a 22 in cubed box i guess 5 cu ft sealed i just dont know about cutting the circle i know they make jigs in stuff but its pretty crucial

 

[darien87]

what????? i have the 12 and it is awesome very loud my neighbors down the street can hear it like a car stero very clean bass no distortion shakes the house the 15 will be even better so i dont really know what your talkin about, have you actually heard one of the HF 12s or 15s? dont know what your program said but anything reaching below 20 hz with little or no distortion is a good speaker in my book

Dude, what are you 13?!?! TLS gives you a lot of good information and you attack him like a red-headed step child.

By the way, look into some punctuation. You typing out one long run-on sentence makes you sound like a little kid, texting to his BFF.

 

[ticks77]

http://www.partsexpress.com/speaker-building.cfm well my current HF 12 is at 27 hz

would the HF 15 be best in a 3.0 cu ft sealed or 22 3/4 cube sealed i think thats like 5.0 cuft i want the 15 to have better sound than my 12 or eles its not an upgrade

 

[annunaki]

What do you mean by "better sound"? Deeper bass? Better tonal accuracy? Increased output?

The 12" Infinity Perfect VQ is a great sub for DIY use as it is so versatile. There are other subs that work very well, it really depends upon budget and the expected results. The JL Audio 13W3v3 is a great option as is the W7 and W1v2.

 

[ticks77]

nah dude i already bought the 15 at a steal by better sound i mean louder deeper smoother than the 12 an up grade from the 12 ya know