clyindrical subwoofer, pipe orgain resonance?

D

density

Audioholic Intern
Hello,

I know many companies are making cylindrical subwoofers, and state that there is no difference in sound from a box. I've not seen a good explanation other than weight/footprint for making a cylindrical subwoofer. Can you help with this?

Also, the subwoofers I've seen are quite long in order to get the volume needed. Many are close to 5foot or longer. It seems that this would give you a big pipe organ style resonance, is this not the case or is it handled somehow? (so in a 5ft cyl you would have a half wavelength resonance at something like 113Hz, for instance.)
 
J

Joe Schmoe

Audioholic Ninja
I have seen a speaker (not a sub) that uses a 3" driver in a 3" X 37" cylinder and claims 40Hz-20KHz +/- 3dB. It seems to me that it would suffer from the same sort of resonance. It also seems to have insufficient volume/driver area to achieve the claimed bass extension. Is this simply false advertising?:confused:
 
F

fmw

Audioholic Ninja
Also, the subwoofers I've seen are quite long in order to get the volume needed. Many are close to 5foot or longer. It seems that this would give you a big pipe organ style resonance, is this not the case or is it handled somehow? (so in a 5ft cyl you would have a half wavelength resonance at something like 113Hz, for instance.)
Pipe organs suffer from resonance?
 
GlocksRock

GlocksRock

Audioholic Spartan
cylinder subs are also stronger than boxes and require no bracing... but I guess that would fall under the weight category. Some people just prefer the looks of a cylinder sub, and even though I have one, I would have prefered the box, but I'm just as happy either way... especially since the cylinder cots me less.
 
patnshan

patnshan

Senior Audioholic
I love the tube subs. Smaller footprint and interesting look are selling points for me, other than the fact that they sound amazing!

I can't answer your technical question as I am no EE, but have talked to SVS about this. To go lower in a box, you need one or both of two things
1. more volume (would be length or width in a tube, length is easier given fixed driver sizes)
2. more power (bigger amp, as mine is a plus, making it equal to a longer standard PCI per SVS)
This is complicated by the fact that you can also go lower by plugging a port or two. I have one plugged, tuning it down to 20. The output goes down, but for my needs is still more than adequate.

So, as you can see I only partially understand the concepts and am even worse at explaining them:D Well, I tried.

Pat
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Audioholic Jedi
Pipe organs suffer from resonance?
Pipe organs don't suffer from resonance, they use it. But for the resonance of pipes, the king of instruments would be silent. Each pipe is tuned to a specific pitch. Most pipes are flute type, flue, pipes open at both ends. The shaping of the pipe, its metal content and many other factors determine its harmonic content. The open pipes radiate even harmonics. There are sets of pipes with one for each note. These are the ranks. Each rank "speaks" when the appropriate stop is pulled. Each stop has a different harmonic balance. This gives each stop its unique sound.

The ranks are laid out in order on the wind chests to make a division. Now the keys are the y axis of large graph board and the stops the x axis. When a given x and y line up a pipe speaks. In the mechanical organ this is done with sliders actuated by trackers. The keys go up and down the x axis and the stop sliders the y. There is a hole in each slider, for each pipe to allow air from the wind chest to get to the pipe. When holes in two sliders line up the pipe speaks.

There are reed stops that have a vibrating reed at the mouth, such as the trumpet, tuba and genschorn stops. In organ pipes you need lots of harmonic content in addition to the fundamental (the tuning) frequency of the pipe.

There are also the pipes, usually made of wood, that are closed (stopped) at one end. These are the gedackt pipes. A pipe closed at one end has a fundamental half the frequency of an open pipe of the same length.

Now it is these latter gedackt pipes that are of interest to the speaker designer. The closed pipes radiate odd harmonics. These are not generally considered as pleasing as the even harmonics.

Now an organ builder wants rich harmonic content, the speaker builder does not. However the gedackt pipe can be adapted to the speaker builders needs.

The crudest adaptation is the cylinder speaker mentioned in this thread. This is a straight cylinder, whose length is half the wavelength of the fundamental. The fundamental, and therefore the area of reinforcement to the speaker driver is narrow. The odd harmonics are generated because the speaker is at the closed end of the pipe. These are suppressed with the fiber fill.

Now if we take our gedakt pipe, give it a reverse taper, that is to say make the area of the closed end three or four times grater than the open end, you broaden the fundamental greatly. This is now much more promising for loudspeaker loading. Now if you place the diver a little further down the pipe from the closed end you can position it to greatly discourage the generation of odd harmonics, especially the loudest third harmonic of the fundamental. In other words you place the diver at the node of displacement of the third harmonic. If we then fold the pipe we suppress HF radiation completely, this is important if the speaker is not a sub. We then fill the pipe uniformly with fiber fill to suppress any residual harmonic content.

Now the pipe tuning frequency and the volume of air in the pipe have to be matched to the Thiel Small parameters of the driver. As I have previously shown this form of loading will augment the bass output of a driver from F3 to 100Hz, 2 to 3db over other alignments. I regard this method as the optimal bass loading for drivers that have suitable parameters.

It is absolutely suited to making the finest of subs. If you ever hear one you will regret it until you have one of your own.

These pictures will give you are good idea of how it is done.

http://mdcarter.smugmug.com/gallery/2424278#127083295

So Joe, you see resonance is not a bad thing. The trick is to make resonance work to your needs for the task in hand.
 

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