360 Failure rate approaching 33%?

mikeyj92

mikeyj92

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Nearly one in every three Xbox 360 consoles fail, according to retailer reports



By several metrics, the Xbox 360 is the most successful console so far of this generation. Despite the startling pace of the Wii, the Xbox 360 still has the most consoles sold worldwide and the longest list of games and exclusives. For a gamer looking for online-enabled high-definition gaming today, the Xbox 360 appears to satisfy those needs.

One often overlooked factor when considering a console purchase is reliability, an area that is becoming apparent where the Xbox 360 falls short. Anecdotal evidence is heavily pointing to Microsoft’s latest console as being significantly more prone to failure than what consumers are accustomed to.

Microsoft has said before that its Xbox 360 failure rate falls within three to five percent, what it believes to be well within industry standards. Internet reports from Xbox 360 owners, however, suggest that the failure rate is much higher than that.

In an effort to gain a more accurate picture of Xbox 360 failure rate, DailyTech decided to poll retail outlets that sell the Xbox 360 and with it the option to purchase an in-store extended warranty. Out of all Xbox 360 extended warranties sold, we wanted to know how many were claimed by consumers with defective consoles, thus giving us a more accurate failures percentage.

After contacting several retailers from various regions in North America, the responses were unanimous: the Xbox 360 is the least reliable gaming console in recent history. Current EB Games or GameStop employees who offered information did so under strict anonymity, as it is against company policy to reveal such information to the public. Furthermore, our sources confirmed that EB Games revised its Canadian warranty policies during early 2007 for consoles solely due to the failure rate of the Xbox 360.

EB Games held conference calls for its Canadian stores informing them of the new policy changes and revealing alarming failure rates of the Xbox 360. “The real numbers were between 30 to 33 percent,” said former EB Games employee Matthieu G., adding that failure rate was even greater for launch consoles. “We had 35 Xbox 360s at launch I know more than half of them broke within the first six months (red lights or making circles under the game discs). Two of them were dead on arrival.”

Interestingly, Microsoft has acknowledged that the initial batch of Xbox 360 consoles made during the launch window suffer from below average reliability. In response to an overwhelming defect rate of launch consoles, Microsoft agreed to repair all machines manufactured in 2005 free of charge, and issue a refund for those who already paid for repairs of launch units up until January 1, 2006.

The three flashing red lights – commonly referred to in gaming communities as the “Red Ring of Death” – is a sign of an Xbox 360 hardware failure. The sign is apparently common enough that Microsoft has added an option to its 1-800-4MY-XBOX support line that names “three flashing red lights” specifically.

As a result of the high failure rate of the Xbox 360, EB Games corporate nearly doubled the prices of its one-year, over-the-counter warranty. While the previous warranty would give a customer a brand new console in exchange for the broken one, the new policy now states that the customer will receive a refurbished console instead. The move was made because it was becoming too costly for the retailer to give the customer a brand-new machine, which still carries a store cost close to the MSRP. The price increase and policy change wasn’t exclusive to only the Xbox 360, however, as it also applies to all other Sony and Nintendo consoles sold.

The failure rate nearing a third of all Xbox 360 consoles was found at other retailers too. A Best Buy customer service department manager, who wished to remain unnamed, said that failure rates for the console were “between a quarter to a third” of all units sold.

“We see a ton of [Xbox 360s] come back all the time. We strongly push our customers to buy our service plans no matter what they buy, but it is especially important for them with the Xbox 360,” said the manager. “It’s a lucky thing for us that Microsoft extended the factory warranty to one year, because we were having a hell of a time dealing with the launch units. Now we don’t have to deal with those broken [Xbox 360s] until their second year, for those who have purchased the two year plans.”

In late 2006, Microsoft boosted the warranty of all Xbox 360 consoles to one year, up from 90-days previously. For gamers who are out of warranty, however, a replacement or repair will cost Xbox 360 customers $140.

When compared against other systems, the Xbox 360 is failing at higher rates than its current competitors and predecessors. Former EB Games worker Matthieu G. said that the failure rates for all other consoles were not high enough for the retailer to consider revising its policies, and guesses that that most other console systems have a failure rate of less than one percent, including the PlayStation 3. Another EB Games manager, when asked if the store warranty was worth it, conceded that in the hundreds of Wii units sold at that location thus far, zero have come back as defective.

Despite the overwhelming evidence that the Xbox 360 is a relatively unreliable games machine, Microsoft officials refuse to comment on its failure rate. Peter Moore, VP of Microsoft’s entertainment division, said to the Mercury News, “I can’t comment on failure rates, because it’s just not something – it’s a moving target. What this consumer should worry about is the way that we’ve treated him. Y’know, things break, and if we’ve treated him well and fixed his problem, that’s something that we’re focused on right now. I’m not going to comment on individual failure rates because I’m shipping in 36 countries and it’s a complex business.”

Similar questions regarding the Xbox 360 hardware met with the man responsible for the design of the console, Todd Holmdahl. He too sidestepped the issue with the Mercury News, saying, “I would say we don’t have a high defect rate. The vast majority of people are really excited about their product, and that we are targeting profitability for next year.”

Asked differently about whether or not the Xbox 360 falls into the ‘normal’ three to five percent return rate, Holmdahl said, “We don’t disclose the actual number,” and “We don’t comment on that.”

No piece of technology, no matter how well designed, should be expected to completely free of failure. The key metric is whether or not a product falls within industry standards of acceptable failure rates – and from findings based off retailer-supported warranty returns, the actual rate of failures could be six to ten times greater than what Microsoft is letting on.

Regardless of what the actual failure rate is, there is consumer perception that the Xbox 360 is a less reliable machine than its competitors. That fact alone should encourage Microsoft to do more than just avoid all comments on failures and only preach on the wonderful experience of its consumer base.
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
A little more tidbit I read today on the 360 failure rate. According to this site between 1,500 and 2,500 360's a day make it to the repair factory DAILY in the UK. No wonder UPS is doing so well right now :rolleyes:.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
I knew failure rate was high, but not that high. Even 25% would be high given the amount of time the console has been out.
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
I knew failure rate was high, but not that high. Even 25% would be high given the amount of time the console has been out.
10 percent would be ridiculously high considering most other consoles history and the fact that over 10million 360's have been sold. I am just glad I chose the ps3 over the 360 after constantly hearing 360 complaints from my friends and reading these articles especially because the biggest problem I have had with my ps3 is the occasional hdmi handshake issue.
 
gene

gene

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Let me add to this by mentioning my XBOX 360 failed and required service after 3 months of light usage. Almost everyone I know who owns a 360 had similar reliability issues. This is unacceptable and makes me kinda regret I upgraded to a 360 from Xbox. I did it all for Star Trek and Halo 3 and lost my favorite hockey game in the process while also dealing with reliability issues.
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
Let me add to this by mentioning my XBOX 360 failed and required service after 3 months of light usage. Almost everyone I know who owns a 360 had similar reliability issues. This is unacceptable and makes me kinda regret I upgraded to a 360 from Xbox. I did it all for Star Trek and Halo 3 and lost my favorite hockey game in the process while also dealing with reliability issues.
Come to the dark side and get a ps3 ;). Less than 1% breakage issue and it is so much sexier than a 360.
 
jonnythan

jonnythan

Audioholic Ninja
I don't see anything other than purely anecdotal data in that article..
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
I don't see anything other than purely anecdotal data in that article..
The problem is Microsoft's refusal to release hard data makes us rely on anecdotal data. As long as they refuse to admit there is a problem and release real data which probably won't happen if failure rates are above 10% which seems likely speculation, both high and low, will rule the game of what is going on with the 360.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
I don't see anything other than purely anecdotal data in that article..
And Gene's post is anecdotal also? I will say my brother has had his for some time and hasn't had any problems, so he must be one of the lucky ones.
 
jonnythan

jonnythan

Audioholic Ninja
And Gene's post is anecdotal also? I will say my brother has had his for some time and hasn't had any problems, so he must be one of the lucky ones.
Yeah, it is. By definition.

Out of almost 12 million consoles sold, all of the actual data from the "secret, anonymous" sources in the article amounts to about 50 sold consoles.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
And if 1/3 of those 50 fail that is still not a good representation on the whole... Giving Microsoft the benefit of the doubt, even 10% failure rate would not be a good thing.
 
D

davo

Full Audioholic
Another thing to keep in mind, as you cruise different forums you will find most of them have a thread relating specifically to Xbox 360 failures.

Now why is that? Is it because their owners love to beat up on their own machine?

I thought about starting a PS3 /Wii complaint thread just to keep things even.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Sorry, I don't buy that one. I'm sure there are bashers out there, but I HIGHLY doubt the majority of them are fake. If I bought a product that failed I am MUCH more likely to want to tell people about it than one that is working well.

I have nothing of interest to report about my PS3 other than the fact that I am very pleased with it.
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
Sorry, I don't buy that one. I'm sure there are bashers out there, but I HIGHLY doubt the majority of them are fake. If I bought a product that failed I am MUCH more likely to want to tell people about it than one that is working well.

I have nothing of interest to report about my PS3 other than the fact that I am very pleased with it.
I am in the same boat with both my Wii and PS3 very happy with both and no worries at all after long gameplay.
 
A

abboudc

Audioholic Chief
Todd Holmdahl should be fired and never allowed to design any hardware ever again. It's not bad enough Microsoft screws up all the software they touch, now they're doing it with hardware too.

Among my friends, 30% seems about right. In fact, i've seen more problems with the 360 first hand than i've seen with all the other consoles all the way back to the NES combined.
 
Rob Babcock

Rob Babcock

Moderator
Another bit of anecdotal "evidence"- my brother, a die-hard Xbox and 360 fanboy, has had three Xbox 360's and every one had died!:eek:
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
More news:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070705/tc_nm/microsoft_xbox_dc_5

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - Microsoft Corp. (Nasdaq:MSFT - news) said on Thursday "an unacceptable number of repairs" to its Xbox 360 will force it to take a charge of more than $1 billion for its most recent quarter, and it announced a new, extended warranty for the video game console.

The announcements come amid mounting complaints about Xbox 360 failures on the Internet. Microsoft said it had investigated the sources of hardware failures indicated by three red flashing lights on the console and had identified "a number of factors" that can cause such failures.

Microsoft said it would extend warranty coverage to three years to cover the problem and would reimburse customers who had previously paid for repairs related to the three-flashing-lights error message.

Microsoft also said it has made improvements to the Xbox 360 console.
Interesting that they added the three year warranty...
 
avaserfi

avaserfi

Audioholic Ninja
I can't wait to see Microsofts gaming divisions profits this quarter it will probably be similar to Sony's previous quarter after something like this.
 
mikeyj92

mikeyj92

Full Audioholic
I can't wait to see Microsofts gaming divisions profits this quarter it will probably be similar to Sony's previous quarter after something like this.
Some info...in the last 3 fiscal years, MS's gaming division has lost over 3 billion dollars...and this warranty extension will cost them over a billion on top of that. Needless to say, MS's gaming division is not looked upon kindly by investors...in fact, news blurbs I have access to are slamming MS today. It is amusing to read, especially since I don't own any MS stock.
 
hemiram

hemiram

Full Audioholic
What is it that's failing? Is it CPU's or HD's dying from heat issues? That's about the only thing I can think of. I don't have very many friends with them, but I know a couple have had units die pretty soon after they got them.

If it is a heat issue, MS should know better, it's not that hard to make something that doesn't cook itself to death. I wonder if it's a matter where the "boss" said, "It has to be this size (the size an XBox 360 is), and no bigger!!" without thinking about cooling issues as the thing ages and gets dusty/cat hairy inside. When my cat was alive, his hair got sucked into everything I had that had a fan in it. One of my PC's video cards wigged out one day. Both of the little fans on it were loaded with cat hair. After I sucked it out with the vac, everything was back to normal. I checked and the other PC was almost as badly loaded up. I started cleaning them out every three months and the problem never resurfaced.
 
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