Which Amp For Front Speakers

[rjharle]

They look like an even match. The 1140, with 2 channel driven, will have similar current capability to the PVA7. It may actually have lower distortions, hence slightly better clarity, but again, an even match.

Actually the 1140 powers the center, surround, back and ceiling. When I had the MRX 720 setup (with Subs) I was told the PVA7 had a better amp (could be wrong) than the 720, so I powered the 936s with the PVA7 but now, I don't know if that still stands with the 1140?

 

[lovinthehd]

I never claimed they were subs, When asked what speakers would be powered by the amp I responded the Aria 936. My SVS 13 Ultras and self powered. The only speakers that will be powered by the PVA7 will be the Aria 936. I apologize for any miss understanding.

You said your fronts had subs, thought you meant your front speakers. So a bit less work on your amp if you have subs....

 

[PENG]

Actually the 1140 powers the center, surround, back and ceiling. When I had the MRX 720 setup (with Subs) I was told the PVA7 had a better amp (could be wrong) than the 720, so I powered the 936s with the PVA7 but now, I don't know if that still stands with the 1140?

I don't know about the MRX720, the MRX740/1140 did measure very well on the bench (by Gene, Audioholics.com) and I assume you have read it.

I could not find any measurements on the PVA7, so I have no idea how someone knew it had "a better amp" and obviously that could be wrong, or right. Many people would assume a power amp must have "better amp" that those built into an AVR, that's a reasonable assumption, but again, based on specs and available collaborative information of the likes of the MRX720/1120 740/1140, the PVA amps are just comparable with no evidence of them being "better", when used with the front speakers only.

Either way, I am 100% confident that you wouldn't hear a difference if you don't know which one is powering the front 3 speakers. The PVA amp might have better continuous rating but we should know that continuous ratings are, in most cases not relevant to listening to real world contents, as movie and music contents are not pure tones, such as 1000 Hz, 2000 Hz etc sinewave tones. So, whatever is convenient to you, is probably the "better" way.

Regardless, the PVA amps, imo, are good for the surround/height channels, but in order to get the best out of the 936 if you listen to relatively high spl, I would recommend something like the MCA325 for the LCR, though for better value, something like the Hypex NC502MP class D amps or the Monolith might be better choices.

If you listen to spl at leat 10 dB below reference, then you don't need those "real" 4 ohm rated power amps.

 

[rjharle]

I don't know about the MRX720, the MRX740/1140 did measure very well on the bench (by Gene, Audioholics.com) and I assume you have read it.

I could not find any measurements on the PVA7, so I have no idea how someone knew it had "a better amp" and obviously that could be wrong, or right. Many people would assume a power amp must have "better amp" that those built into an AVR, that's a reasonable assumption, but again, based on specs and available collaborative information of the likes of the MRX720/1120 740/1140, the PVA amps are just comparable with no evidence of them being "better", when used with the front speakers only.

Either way, I am 100% confident that you wouldn't hear a difference if you don't know which one is powering the front 3 speakers. The PVA amp might have better continuous rating but we should know that continuous ratings are, in most cases not relevant to listening to real world contents, as movie and music contents are not pure tones, such as 1000 Hz, 2000 Hz etc sinewave tones. So, whatever is convenient to you, is probably the "better" way.

Regardless, the PVA amps, imo, are good for the surround/height channels, but in order to get the best out of the 936 if you listen to relatively high spl, I would recommend something like the MCA325 for the LCR, though for better value, something like the Hypex NC502MP class D amps or the Monolith might be better choices.

If you listen to spl at leat 10 dB below reference, then you don't need those "real" 4 ohm rated power amps.

I just got this email back, the Anthem

Hello,
Well you certainly could now sell the PVA but read on.

Those speakers are 8 ohms nominal. That is usually a way of saying 6 ohms. And that is not even considering the impedance curve.
The PVA is 125 W into 8 which is a bit less that the 1140, but those are 'integrated' watts
A dedicated power amp and especially one from Anthem will always be a better choice if you already own it.
Depending on how many extra channels you have available, it would also be possible to bi amp the front sound stage.

John V
Technical Support Advisor
Paradigm | Anthem AV

So, together with your comments, I'll use the PVA-7 for the fronts. Thank you for all your help

 

[PENG]

I just got this email back, the Anthem

Hello,
Well you certainly could now sell the PVA but read on.

Those speakers are 8 ohms nominal. That is usually a way of saying 6 ohms. And that is not even considering the impedance curve.
The PVA is 125 W into 8 which is a bit less that the 1140, but those are 'integrated' watts
A dedicated power amp and especially one from Anthem will always be a better choice if you already own it.
Depending on how many extra channels you have available, it would also be possible to bi amp the front sound stage.

John V
Technical Support Advisor
Paradigm | Anthem AV

So, together with your comments, I'll use the PVA-7 for the fronts. Thank you for all your help

I expected they would say that, think about it, why wouldn't they? Integrated amp, power amp always better right? That's why manufacturer's marketing, customer support people would tell you. Reality is, one must compare the specifications, and measurements if available, before substantiated such claims.

My opinion, based on my knowledge and experience is that the 1140, when used for 2 or even 3 channel is, as I stated before, a good equivalent, toss up, with the PV7. This is based on you specific case/application.

And, as I also suggested, whichever way is more convenient to setup for your applications, is probably the "better" way. John V's good guy, I have no disagreement with what he is saying, I guess except the "integrated watts" part as there is no such thing, though I think I know what he really meant.

 

[philly]

I have the anthem str dual monoblock amp, and a
question about amplifier Cooling... I use AC Infinity coolers for two of my components. They keep them in the upper 80's. However my Anthem amplifier is sitting on top of my cabinet so it's open for ventilation but it still runs a temperature around 100 to 105. is that too hot and should I also get a fan cooler for that as well??
Thanks!

 

[rjharle]

I expected they would say that, think about it, why wouldn't they? Integrated amp, power amp always better right? That's why manufacturer's marketing, customer support people would tell you. Reality is, one must compare the specifications, and measurements if available, before substantiated such claims.

My opinion, based on my knowledge and experience is that the 1140, when used for 2 or even 3 channel is, as I stated before, a good equivalent, toss up, with the PV7. This is based on you specific case/application.

And, as I also suggested, whichever way is more convenient to setup for your applications, is probably the "better" way. John V's good guy, I have no disagreement with what he is saying, I guess except the "integrated watts" part as there is no such thing, though I think I know what he really meant.

I have the specs for both amps (attached) I'm not sure, if they will help be here they are.

 

[Tankini]

With those choices flip a coin, whichever sided it lands on still good to go. Chasing that dragging down a rabbit hole, Is broad with this hobby. Class D amp/amps for surround duty would be a great option.

 

[PENG]

I have the specs for both amps (attached) I'm not sure, if they will help be here they are.

Those info sheets are part of basis for my assessment, that for your application the two are very much a toss up.

Please also keep in mind, that for power output, doubling = 3 dB in terms of SPL, and it has been said that for a person to perceive twice as loud, volume need to go up by at least 6 dB, most cited 10 dB.

The difference between difference in output (Watts) and in output (dB) are as follows:

So, for perceived loudness based on Denon or Marantz AVR, the difference between 175 W and 200 W represents about 1 click on the volume button, that is about 0.5 dB SPL difference.

Output (W)	dB increase
100.00
125.00	0.97
150.00	1.76
175.00	2.43
200.00	3.01
225.00	3.52
250.00	3.98
275.00	4.39
300.00	4.77
325.00	5.12
350.00	5.44
375.00	5.74
400.00	6.02
425.00	6.28
450.00	6.53
475.00	6.77
500.00	6.99
525.00	7.20
550.00	7.40
575.00	7.60
600.00	7.78
625.00	7.96
650.00	8.13
675.00	8.29
700.00	8.45
725.00	8.60
750.00	8.75
775.00	8.89
800.00	9.03
825.00	9.16
850.00	9.29
875.00	9.42
900.00	9.54
925.00	9.66
950.00	9.78
975.00	9.89
1000.00	10.00

 

[philly]

Similar question for me... I have a 5.2.2 configuration with the Marantz av10 and amp10 for all my speakers except the two front Mains, which I power with the Anthem Str amp. do my crossover and LPF settings on the prepro stay the same for the fronts/subs, as when I just used the amp10? [B&W 702s3 mains] Thanks!

 

[PENG]

Similar question for me... I have a 5.2.2 configuration with the Marantz av10 and amp10 for all my speakers except the two front Mains, which I power with the Anthem Str amp. do my crossover and LPF settings on the prepro stay the same for the fronts/subs, as when I just used the amp10? [B&W 702s3 mains] Thanks!

Crossovers should not be affected by the use of different power amps.

 

[rjharle]

Those info sheets are part of basis for my assessment, that for your application the two are very much a toss up.

Please also keep in mind, that for power output, doubling = 3 dB in terms of SPL, and it has been said that for a person to perceive twice as loud, volume need to go up by at least 6 dB, most cited 10 dB.

The difference between difference in output (Watts) and in output (dB) are as follows:

So, for perceived loudness based on Denon or Marantz AVR, the difference between 175 W and 200 W represents about 1 click on the volume button, that is about 0.5 dB SPL difference.

Output (W)	dB increase
100.00
125.00	0.97
150.00	1.76
175.00	2.43
200.00	3.01
225.00	3.52
250.00	3.98
275.00	4.39
300.00	4.77
325.00	5.12
350.00	5.44
375.00	5.74
400.00	6.02
425.00	6.28
450.00	6.53
475.00	6.77
500.00	6.99
525.00	7.20
550.00	7.40
575.00	7.60
600.00	7.78
625.00	7.96
650.00	8.13
675.00	8.29
700.00	8.45
725.00	8.60
750.00	8.75
775.00	8.89
800.00	9.03
825.00	9.16
850.00	9.29
875.00	9.42
900.00	9.54
925.00	9.66
950.00	9.78
975.00	9.89
1000.00	10.00

Thank you