Why not external EQ / Crossovers for HT or Stereo?

[Hattrick17]

Agreed.

I think if you ask an artist about a painting or sculpture, they will still have critiques and things they would have done differently or could still improve. No doubt the same is true of music, which is why when an artist revisits a song later or even just playing it live, it is often different. That is why I like to go to concerts, hearing it with slight differences that may just be the flavor the artist felt like that night makes it more interesting.

Sure, bands playing together in one room to record still happens of course, but even back to the 70s, they are separately mic'ed and semi-isolated from each other, recorded on separate tracks. I heard of many artists collaborating during covid where they would just share their part of the track with the other to collaborate and then combined their work into a song. Whichever way they do it, if you like the music, it doesn't matter how they did it.

Agreed.

 

[dlaloum]

Yes you are correct regarding differences. However being my thread was worded so poorly I was including the use of both EC and EQ for a HT system or even just a great stereo system, or just a sound bar with subs. I would bet that most people around the world use some sort of stereo and or sound bar for watching movies maybe some have subs as well and tune using the sub and if possible tone controls though I think most Pres and Integrated amps don't have them anymore. Maybe in the UI menu.
Though I like my 7.1.2 System which is built around my Arcam AVR 850 with Dirac latest version as stated tweaked using my ears.

I almost am starting to think HT is a joke an going back to a great stereo system. Why, The effects are just that effects, not a true representation of reality and a great illusion and of course great to market and sell! I find in movies most effects are are overstated per volume and tone as well. Example is when the T-Rex is approaching does the tone stay the same in reality. No it does not. Same with a train going by via Doppler Effect. In the movies great exaggerated. Why if there is no "Oh wow" factor the interest will diminish. . As I mentioned most would agree video content created is 95% LCR adding subs helps if you have L&C speakers that don't reach down to the levels. However those ultra lows for subs are not a real representation of frequencies most hear in the outside world. They are effects as well. I don't need Dirac I can use EQ for my room if I want to create a sound reproduction that I enjoy but being I have it I use it. My room is treated very well in my opinion and find I turn off Dirac EQ most of the time. If I feel bass sounds a bit out of control I can adjust that outside of Dirac with the AVR850.

You are right that movies are an artificial environment that attempts to simulate a fantasy world, and generate/encourage the "willing suspension of disbelief".

Many stereo recordings are also like this - some recordings (a small subset!) - actually endeavour to provide a "window" on a musical event...
These recordings are where the magic happens - where if the system is setup just right, and the recording is just right, you can close your eyes and you "are there" - the holy grail of high fidelity.

But reality is, most recordings are multi-miked, and then the soundstage is set up artificially, there is nothing there that has ever existed in reality. - For those, a Dolby Surround, PLII, or Logic7 rendition, is as authentic as anything else - and often will sound better, with a wider sweet spot, and an impression of imaging available right through the room (assuming multi speakers of course).

Even using 3 matched speakers, and Dolby PLII for a L/C/R setup, can provide an improved rendition of traditional stereo - Martin Logan and Bryston demonstrated that about 15 or 20 years ago... there was a brief buzz about it, and then it disappeared - but their setup was nothing "special" 3 well matched speakers well setup, and a Bryston AVP running Dolby PLII.

I enjoy most of my stereo material through my 5.1.4 setup, using Dolby Surround - when I want to "test" something specific, I drop back to pure stereo sometimes just to check stuff, but most of the time I prefer DSU.

 

[Hattrick17]

You are right that movies are an artificial environment that attempts to simulate a fantasy world, and generate/encourage the "willing suspension of disbelief".

Many stereo recordings are also like this - some recordings (a small subset!) - actually endeavour to provide a "window" on a musical event...
These recordings are where the magic happens - where if the system is setup just right, and the recording is just right, you can close your eyes and you "are there" - the holy grail of high fidelity.

But reality is, most recordings are multi-miked, and then the soundstage is set up artificially, there is nothing there that has ever existed in reality. - For those, a Dolby Surround, PLII, or Logic7 rendition, is as authentic as anything else - and often will sound better, with a wider sweet spot, and an impression of imaging available right through the room (assuming multi speakers of course).

Even using 3 matched speakers, and Dolby PLII for a L/C/R setup, can provide an improved rendition of traditional stereo - Martin Logan and Bryston demonstrated that about 15 or 20 years ago... there was a brief buzz about it, and then it disappeared - but their setup was nothing "special" 3 well matched speakers well setup, and a Bryston AVP running Dolby PLII.

I enjoy most of my stereo material through my 5.1.4 setup, using Dolby Surround - when I want to "test" something specific, I drop back to pure stereo sometimes just to check stuff, but most of the time I prefer DSU.

I think I have done a very good job with my room and the use of Dirac with my Arcam though I only get one setting to utilize. Now there are AVR's now with multiple options to create additional corrections choices. I will be upgrading to one in about a year or so when I upgrade my TV to 8K. I have a Marantz 7.1 system in my bedroom I do not use or need a center channel being the the L&R are about 5' apart so they produce an great center spread. I could do this with my living room as well which has a 12' spread but have kept the center which I think fills nicely for that spread I don't let it be too front. One feature I do like with the Arcam AVR 850 is the multi-channel stereo. I use it from time to time because it is good! The engineers did a great jove making it not sound like ever pair of speakers is running in stereo it almost seems like surround sound however not so prominent. One thing great with very good AVR's is choices. One will not have so many choices with 2- channel. So I do need to step back and think, "Do I really want to get rid of this for a 2-channel system?' Probably not, though I mentioned it earlier. I have the luxury of having a nice large empty room in my unfinished basement which I will be building a new dedicated HT/Music Room with all the right room build and treatments. it will have two systems in that room a dedicated stereo and a HT AVP with all the trimmings. Should be fun!

 

[highfigh]

Yes you are correct regarding differences. However being my thread was worded so poorly I was including the use of both EC and EQ for a HT system or even just a great stereo system, or just a sound bar with subs. I would bet that most people around the world use some sort of stereo and or sound bar for watching movies maybe some have subs as well and tune using the sub and if possible tone controls though I think most Pres and Integrated amps don't have them anymore. Maybe in the UI menu.
Though I like my 7.1.2 System which is built around my Arcam AVR 850 with Dirac latest version as I have mentioned that I tweaked the settings using my ears.

I almost am starting to think HT is a joke an going back to a great stereo system. Why? The effects are just that effects, not a true representation of reality but a great illusion that is fun. I find in movies most effects are are overstated per volume and tone.. Example is when the T-Rex is approaching does the tone stay the same and the volume is so loud when it isn't close? This is very common practice in many movies. Does it make it more fun yes. But I find it a bit silly when I experience it all the time. Same with a train going by via Doppler Effect. In the movies that is greatly exaggerated. Why if there is no "Oh wow" factor the interest will diminish. . As I mentioned most would agree video content created is 95% LCR adding subs helps if you have L&C speakers that don't reach down to the levels. However those ultra lows for subs are not a real representation of frequencies most hear in the outside world. I don't need Dirac I can use EQ for my room if I want to create a sound reproduction that I enjoy but being I have it I use it. My room is treated very well in my opinion and find I turn off Dirac EQ most of the time especially for music. If I feel the bass sounds a bit out of control I can adjust that outside of Dirac with the AVR850 or trimming levels with my SVS sub app. Though my best practice is to not use subs for stereo being my speakers have great low end range.

Stereo is an illusion, too- what's your point about home theater, which has never been anything other than illusion?