Have i damaged the tweeter on my Ultra Towers?

[Oggaaaa]

I wouldn't equate channel trim levels and master volume like that. What particular drivers on the speakers are the problem now that you've narrowed it down.

I think it's the tweeter but I don't know if anything else internally is damaged.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/hummGDPRePzJDRo1A this is a video of how amazing it sounds now...

 

[Oggaaaa]

One and a half month later and i have installed new tweeters which made no difference. I have also sent my Ultra Towers to the retailer here in Sweden for troubleshooting. They can unfortunately not find any issues with the speakers and now I'm out of ideas. Really frustrating to say the least.

 

[TLS Guy]

One and a half month later and i have installed new tweeters which made no difference. I have also sent my Ultra Towers to the retailer here in Sweden for troubleshooting. They can unfortunately not find any issues with the speakers and now I'm out of ideas. Really frustrating to say the least.

Obviously the problem is in the receiver like I originally suspected. Sound and vision have measured those SVS Ultra speakers. There is no impedance curve posted, BUT they measured the minimum impedance at 3 ohms. So they are NOT 8 ohm speakers. A manufacturers "nominal" impedance means nothing. It is basic dishonesty pure and simple. Absent a curve your best guide to the actual impedance of a speaker is the minimum impedance plus 10%. That makes your ultra towers 3.3 ohm speakers and NOT 8 ohm speakers.

In my view you can not drive those speakers with a receiver, and certainly not the current crop.
My guess is that there is already damage to the receiver as you admit to playing it loud.
If you are going to keep those speakers then you are going to have to use beefy external amplification.

I don't know if you are using the SVS matching center. That apparently has a minimum impedance of 2.9 ohms.

So you receiver is going to have to be checked out, and if it checks OK or is returned repaired then you need a very robust power amp. I have to say though that minimal impedances that low, are a pretty strong hint of incompetent design and a tip off that the crossover may be in resonance. I certainly would not be happy if those speakers were my design, and I can assure you it would be right back to the drawing board.

 

[lovinthehd]

I think it's the tweeter but I don't know if anything else internally is damaged.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/hummGDPRePzJDRo1A this is a video of how amazing it sounds now...

I just listened to your video (I usually don't bother with such, so many things can get in the way of it being useful) but it doesn't sound like the tweeter particularly, perhaps more midrange area, but not knowing the track in the first place or at what volume you're playing that, or what you recorded with, hard to judge. What is the track?

If the replacement tweeter didn't change things then its not the tweeter particularly in any case. TLS always moans about avrs so hard to know if there's much substance there. I have read reports of several members with such speakers that had no such problems with typical avrs, and even moving to more powerful amps no significant change. I think you just have more analysis in front of you.

 

[TLS Guy]

I just listened to your video (I usually don't bother with such, so many things can get in the way of it being useful) but it doesn't sound like the tweeter particularly, perhaps more midrange area, but not knowing the track in the first place or at what volume you're playing that, or what you recorded with, hard to judge. What is the track?

If the replacement tweeter didn't change things then its not the tweeter particularly in any case. TLS always moans about avrs so hard to know if there's much substance there. I have read reports of several members with such speakers that had no such problems with typical avrs, and even moving to more powerful amps no significant change. I think you just have more analysis in front of you.

The speakers have been reliably reported to be 3 ohm at 80 Hz. He admits to driving his speakers at high volume with his receiver before the fault occurred.

I think that the problem is in the power supply of the receiver. I think the power supply now has reduced voltage or is unable to produce the specked current, and the amps are clipping at a much lower volume than they should. This could well be a voltage regulator issue.

 

[lovinthehd]

The speakers have been reliably reported to be 3 ohm at 80 Hz. He admits to driving his speakers at high volume with his receiver before the fault occurred.

I think that the problem is in the power supply of the receiver. I think the power supply now has reduced voltage or is unable to produce the specked current, and the amps are clipping at a much lower volume than they should. This could well be a voltage regulator issue.

Can't say I've ever heard of an avr being damaged in such a way (or an amp). I'd simply test the avr with other speakers first. How about the crossover components in the speaker?

ps Is this something that generally would brick an avr rather than keep functioning? Then again we often don't get much analysis reported on failed units or know exactly what happened.

 

[TLS Guy]

Can't say I've ever heard of an avr being damaged in such a way (or an amp). I'd simply test the avr with other speakers first. How about the crossover components in the speaker?

ps Is this something that generally would brick an avr rather than keep functioning? Then again we often don't get much analysis reported on failed units or know exactly what happened.

He sent the speakers to be tested, and apparently they are fine.

Since both channels appear to have the same problem, this has to be a power supply problem with the AVR. Since it sounds as if the receiver is clipping at too low a power level, this sounds like a low voltage problem on the power bus. This is the only way I can put this together from what we know now.

And yes, I'm not keen on AVRs. As far as I'm concerned most of them no longer being for ohm stable at power is highly limiting. You can make a two way bookshelf keep out of trouble, but it is really limiting in the design of large multi driver systems. An awful lot are actually four ohm and sometimes less, and the spec. is not truly honest by the manufacturer. I say not truly honest, because as you know the impedance of a speaker is all over the map, depending on which frequency you want to pick. So, a manufacturer can claim impedance reading from any point on the frequency spectrum. Any reasonable amplifying device should be able to power any reasonably designed speaker within its power band. At one time that was generally true, and now it is the exception among receivers. That is actually intolerable.

 

[lovinthehd]

He sent the speakers to be tested, and apparently they are fine.

Since both channels appear to have the same problem, this has to be a power supply problem with the AVR. Since it sounds as if the receiver is clipping at too low a power level, this sounds like a low voltage problem on the power bus. This is the only way I can put this together from what we know now.

And yes, I'm not keen on AVRs. As far as I'm concerned most of them no longer being for ohm stable at power is highly limiting. You can make a two way bookshelf keep out of trouble, but it is really limiting in the design of large multi driver systems. An awful lot are actually four ohm and sometimes less, and the spec. is not truly honest by the manufacturer. I say not truly honest, because as you know the impedance of a speaker is all over the map, depending on which frequency you want to pick. So, a manufacturer can claim impedance reading from any point on the frequency spectrum. Any reasonable amplifying device should be able to power any reasonably designed speaker within its power band. At one time that was generally true, and now it is the exception among receivers. That is actually intolerable.

My apologies, I misread the sending the speakers in I think I just stopped reading after he said he installed new tweeters. If the retailer found them working with their gear I suppose it must be his afr.....then again I'd still prefer to test the avr myself somehow (which would be easy for me, have plenty of things to switch it out with) rather than contact Denon for repair/warranty work.

 

[TLS Guy]

My apologies, I misread the sending the speakers in I think I just stopped reading after he said he installed new tweeters. If the retailer found them working with their gear I suppose it must be his afr.....then again I'd still prefer to test the avr myself somehow (which would be easy for me, have plenty of things to switch it out with) rather than contact Denon for repair/warranty work.

What really needs to happen, is the unit connected to dummy resistor loads and fed from a signal generator, and the output observed on a scope and see at what voltage clipping occurs.

 

[mx416]

Hi folks-

So i feel the urge to reply here. For no other reason than to give another SVS ultra perspective. Likely this wont help this particular issue and is anecdotal, but I couldn’t resist. So I have had the SVS ultra towers now coming up on five years. I have ran them with the X4300H for most of that time. Within that 5 years on many occasions i have ran them at “0.0” determined by Audyssey. (Yes, excessively loud). The ultras are still running top notch like the day i bought them. My simple guess is something went wrong in the AVR while switching sources at such high volume and some how caused damage.

cheers and good luck.

 

[TLS Guy]

Hi folks-

So i feel the urge to reply here. For no other reason than to give another SVS ultra perspective. Likely this wont help this particular issue and is anecdotal, but I couldn’t resist. So I have had the SVS ultra towers now coming up on five years. I have ran them with the X4300H for most of that time. Within that 5 years on many occasions i have ran them at “0.0” determined by Audyssey. (Yes, excessively loud). The ultras are still running top notch like the day i bought them. My simple guess is something went wrong in the AVR while switching sources at such high volume and some how caused damage.

cheers and good luck.

Its not the speakers. They have been checked and are fine. The problem is the AVR.