I’m reluctantly making this post, but which speaker should I buy

[the machine]

All,

This is really much easier than most silly questions like this. I’m 100% absolutely purchasing either Focal Sopra #2 or #3 for my main LR.

The room is 16x20x8.5. MLP is about 8 ft from TV. LR currently are sopra 1s. They are 10 ft apart (able to be moved closer together if I swap positions with my subs). The rear of the cabinet sits about 16” from wall putting the tweeter about 30” from back wall.

I have Apollon PNC 1200 monos to run the mains (400wpc at 8 ohm), so I can comfortably run either speaker.

My main concern is the larger size of the 3s and if they will become boomy in my medium sized room. I’ve read differing opinions on this, but I don’t want to make the wrong choice. I’m not able to demo because I’m not buying new and I don’t want to be a jerk by demoing both speakers from a local shop with no intention of purchasing from them. I 100% will be buying used. I do usually get upgrade-itis which is why I have the apprehension on just grabbing the 2s and being done. It’s how I ended up with 2 PB-16s after buying PB-2000s.

Thanks

 

[shadyJ]

Since you are using subwoofers, I would just get the Sopra 2s unless you plan on blasting the speakers really hard. The larger woofers of the 3s will give them a bit more extension and a bit more headroom below 250Hz, but that is it. Not worth it unless the price difference is small.

 

[the machine]

Since you are using subwoofers, I would just get the Sopra 2s unless you plan on blasting the speakers really hard. The larger woofers of the 3s will give them a bit more extension and a bit more headroom below 250Hz, but that is it. Not worth it unless the price difference is small.

Thanks James. The only really reason I am considering the 3s is that I’m toying with the idea of running 2.0 music as opposed to 2.2. The 3s would help out in the lower end, but I do love bass and might find myself quickly reverting back to the 2.2 for stereo anyways. If the price difference were about 2k, still taking the 2s over the 3s?

 

[Swerd]

Your room is 16×20 = 320 ft².

Focal recommends the Sopra 2 for rooms as small as 320 ft², and would be ideal for larger rooms up to 750 ft². The Sopra 2 has two 7" woofers and is 46⅞" tall with a footprint of 14×21". Weighs 121 lbs.

Focal says the Sopra 3 will reveal its full potential in larger rooms measuring up to 860 ft². It has two 8¼" woofers and is 49¾" tall, with a foot print of 15×23". Weighs 154 lbs.

Both speakers are of similar sensitivity, 91 and 91.5 dB, with similar bass performance. The F3 frequency of the Sopra 2 is 34 Hz, and it's F6 is 28 Hz. The Sopra 3's F3 is 33 Hz, and it's F6 26 Hz.

Compared to the larger Sopra 3, the Sopra 2 is 3" shorter, with a smaller footprint, and is 33 lbs. lighter. Mind you 121 lbs is still quite heavy.

I haven't heard either speaker, but Focal recommends the Sopra 2 over the Sopra 3 for a room of 320 ft². I'd be inclined to go with that. As a guess, I think the Sopra 3 might overwhelm your room.

 

[Swerd]

My main concern is the larger size of the 3s and if they will become boomy in my medium sized room. I’ve read differing opinions on this, but I don’t want to make the wrong choice. I’m not able to demo because I’m not buying new and I don’t want to be a jerk by demoing both speakers from a local shop with no intention of purchasing from them. I 100% will be buying used. I do usually get upgrade-itis which is why I have the apprehension on just grabbing the 2s and being done. It’s how I ended up with 2 PB-16s after buying PB-2000s.

Once you wrestle those 121 lb. Sopra 2s into place, that might solve your upgraditis problems once and for all. Speakers of that size should come with their own audiophile-grade forklift.

I thought my speakers, at 62 lbs. each, were about as heavy as I'd want to move.

 

[the machine]

Once you wrestle those 121 lb. Sopra 2's into place, that might solve your upgraditis problems once and for all. Speakers of that size should come with their own audiophile-grade forklift.

True. I did feel that way with the PB 16s. Those were a nightmare to unbox.

 

[highfigh]

All,

This is really much easier than most silly questions like this. I’m 100% absolutely purchasing either Focal Sopra #2 or #3 for my main LR.

The room is 16x20x8.5. MLP is about 8 ft from TV. LR currently are sopra 1s. They are 10 ft apart (able to be moved closer together if I swap positions with my subs). The rear of the cabinet sits about 16” from wall putting the tweeter about 30” from back wall.

I have Apollon PNC 1200 monos to run the mains (400wpc at 8 ohm), so I can comfortably run either speaker.

My main concern is the larger size of the 3s and if they will become boomy in my medium sized room. I’ve read differing opinions on this, but I don’t want to make the wrong choice. I’m not able to demo because I’m not buying new and I don’t want to be a jerk by demoing both speakers from a local shop with no intention of purchasing from them. I 100% will be buying used. I do usually get upgrade-itis which is why I have the apprehension on just grabbing the 2s and being done. It’s how I ended up with 2 PB-16s after buying PB-2000s.

Thanks

Make sure to sit in a position that's not a multiple of any room dimension, so move back.

 

[shadyJ]

Thanks James. The only really reason I am considering the 3s is that I’m toying with the idea of running 2.0 music as opposed to 2.2. The 3s would help out in the lower end, but I do love bass and might find myself quickly reverting back to the 2.2 for stereo anyways. If the price difference were about 2k, still taking the 2s over the 3s?

$2k is not huge, given the MSRPs of these speakers. If you are not strapped for cash, I would probably spring for the Sopra 3 speakers. I don't think its bass will overwhelm the room, and if you do think it's too much, you can plug the port or just EQ the bass. One of the problems with putting a large speaker in a small room is that the tweeter height might be too high for your listening position, so make sure that your listening position doesn't place your ears too low for either speaker.

 

[the machine]

$2k is not huge, given the MSRPs of these speakers. If you are not strapped for cash, I would probably spring for the Sopra 3 speakers. I don't think its bass will overwhelm the room, and if you do think it's too much, you can plug the port or just EQ the bass. One of the problems with putting a large speaker in a small room is that the tweeter height might be too high for your listening position, so make sure that your listening position doesn't place your ears too low for either speaker.

So thats actually my gripe with the 1s. I’m 6’3” and the tweeters sit too low on the matching stands. I find myself slouching a lot to get in the ideal position

 

[highfigh]

So thats actually my gripe with the 1s. I’m 6’3” and the tweeters sit too low on the matching stands. I find myself slouching a lot to get in the ideal position

Sounds like you need some bean bag chairs.

 

[the machine]

Make sure to sit in a position that's not a multiple of any room dimension, so move back.

MLP is 9 feet from wall, TV sticks out about a foot

 

[shadyJ]

So thats actually my gripe with the 1s. I’m 6’3” and the tweeters sit too low on the matching stands. I find myself slouching a lot to get in the ideal position

Maybe the thing to do is get stands that bring the height up to your ears. That would be a hell of a lot cheaper than buying Sopra 2 or 3s. With the a bookshelf speaker, the height does not have to be fixed, but there isn't much you can do when the tower speaker height is not great for your listening position (except to change the height of your listening position).

 

[the machine]

Maybe the thing to do is get stands that bring the height up to your ears. That would be a hell of a lot cheaper than buying Sopra 2 or 3s. With the a bookshelf speaker, the height does not have to be fixed, but there isn't much you can do when the tower speaker height is not great for your listening position (except to change the height of your listening position).

I am replacing my SVS speakers with focal. Original intention was always to move the 1s to surrounds. If you recall a few months back my DM about the rear surrounds, I’m going to get a pair of aria 906. I do mostly use the area for movies, but I do like playing music. I hope to get more music time in with some big floorstanders.

(I suppose I could always sell my monos, grab another pair of No1s, but then… upgrade-itis)

 

[Matthew J Poes]

Your room is 16×20 = 320 ft².

Focal recommends the Sopra 2 for rooms as small as 320 ft², and would be ideal for larger rooms up to 750 ft². The Sopra 2 has two 7" woofers and is 46⅞" tall with a footprint of 14×21". Weighs 121 lbs.

Focal says the Sopra 3 will reveal its full potential in larger rooms measuring up to 860 ft². It has two 8¼" woofers and is 49¾" tall, with a foot print of 15×23". Weighs 154 lbs.

Both speakers are of similar sensitivity, 91 and 91.5 dB, with similar bass performance. The F3 frequency of the Sopra 2 is 34 Hz, and it's F6 is 28 Hz. The Sopra 3's F3 is 33 Hz, and it's F6 26 Hz.

Compared to the larger Sopra 3, the Sopra 2 is 3" shorter, with a smaller footprint, and is 33 lbs. lighter. Mind you 121 lbs is still quite heavy.
View attachment 60105
I haven't heard either speaker, but Focal recommends the Sopra 2 over the Sopra 3 for a room of 320 ft². I'd be inclined to go with that. As a guess, I think the Sopra 3 might overwhelm your room.

Where does focal provide these room size recommendations.

a room that is 750 square feet likely has taller ceilings than 8’ too.Let’s make the calculation easu With 10’ ceilings. Very common in new construction. 7500 cubic feet. That far exceeds THX Dominus Spec. It’s unlikely the Focals would even pass ultra spec. Sopra 2 certainly wouldn’t.

Roughly speaking if you take the maximum SPL of the speaker at 1 meter and subtract 7dB, that is what you get in a 3000 cubic foot room or so. Something the size of the room in question here. Let’s just say reference levels are not desired and we want to achieve 102dB peaks and 82dB average listening volume at the MLP. The Sopra 2 would need to achieve about 109dB at 1 meter.

this is the Linearity data obtained by soundstage at 2 meters. That was 95dB, or 101 at 1 meter. It’s already near its 3dB compression limit. It is maxing out then at 94dB at the listening position. Admittedly not in the bass, it’s running out of steam in the high frequencies.

now don’t get me wrong. I think most people would find these more than fine in such a room. However I do think that using the Sopra 3 in a large 750 square foot room would not work well. I would love to see more thorough max SPL data on the speaker to see where it runs out of steam in the lower frequencies. It’s showing about a dB or so of compression at that 95dB test. In that larger room you subtract 13dB from the 1 meter value (101dB) to obtain the max in room SPL. Speakers hit their limits differently. Some star tot compress but go another 9dB before losing it. Others hit the full 3dB of compression within another 2-3 dB. Pro Audio speakers often have even more headroom and may go 12dB. However my point is that the Focals at best would hit a limit across its bandwidth within 6dB in all likelihood. 101-13+6 gives us a 94dB max SPL (and if the musical passage had a good bit of Hf energy the tweeter would also now be blown as it hit its limit around 87dB).

 

[Alex2507]

I thought my speakers, at 62 lbs. each, were about as heavy as I'd want to move.

 

[Swerd]

Where does focal provide these room size recommendations.

Focal's spec sheets speak of recommended floor area in square feet, not room volume in cubic feet. The OP's room is 16'×20' with 8½' ceiling.

Focal Sopra 2 Spec Sheet

Sopra N°2 clearly inaugurates a new era for the "Premium High End" bringing new performance criteria. Compact, modern, a pure design, character… all these are essential factors to ensure perfect integration into your interior. Equipped with best midrange drivers ever developed by Focal, with the NIC (Neutral Inductance Circuit) and TMD (Tuned Mass Damper) technologies, Sopra N°2 pushes back the limits of sound reproduction in terms of transparency in a very compact enclosure. Sopra N°2 is perfectly at ease in rooms measuring up to 320 ft² (30 m²), and is even ideal for larger rooms measuring up to 750 ft² (70 m²).

Focal Sopra 3 Spec Sheet

The biggest loudspeaker of the line, Sopra N°3 perfectly combines dynamics, space optimisation and harmonic richness. With its two 8¼" (21 cm) woofers, this loudspeaker offers solid, rich and perfectly defined bass for music lovers looking for optimum performance. Despite its reasonable size, it will reveal its full potential in rooms measuring up to 860 ft² (80 m²).

 

[Matthew J Poes]

Focal's spec sheets speak of recommended floor area in square feet, not room volume in cubic feet. The OP's room is 16'×20' with 8½' ceiling.

Focal Sopra 2 Spec Sheet


Focal Sopra 3 Spec Sheet

Ah that is helpful, I guess I never looked at their spec sheet carefully.

I don't think the Sopra 2 or 3 would be a problem in the OP's room. It's the larger room claim that I find a bit dubious. Their speakers show too much compression to work in large rooms. Even in a 16x20 room you would be approaching the limit of the Sopra 2 if reference cinema levels was the goal. Certainly the Sopra 2 couldn't do a large room, but I don't think the Sopra 3 could either. Obviously it would have more bass headroom, but how much? And more importantly, what about the treble range? It's the same tweeter and same crossover in that range, so the tweeter limit is the same. It would be massively below reference levels at the listening position hitting it's limit.

Typically when a speaker is hitting 3dB of compression, THD is also approaching 10%.

 

[the machine]

Given the exchanges here, I’m glad I made this thread. This has been very informative. I’ve read the spec sheets and that’s one of the reason I’m having this discussion. They do really make it seem like the 3’s need a large room. The way they have worded it though is likely inadequate, at best. Given that we live in a three dimensional world, with three dimensional rooms, volume is likely more relevant. My home also has two rooms that are slightly larger than the 16x20, but instead the 8.5’ ceilings in the basement, there are 20 foot ceilings. I’m sure either speaker would sound much different from room to room.

Def leaning towards the 3’s

 

[Matthew J Poes]

For what it's worth, a room would need to be fairly small for a large speaker to be inappropriate or not work in that room.

In a 16x20 room, I would be surprised if even this wouldn't work.

The bass is rarely the issue, that is more myth than truth. The size of the woofers or amount of bass produced are not room size dependent. A speaker designed for larger rooms may have more of a response tilt built in, given the reduced room gain, but I doubt that is true of most brands, and frankly many people would likely prefer that anyway. The issue that you run into with speakers in small rooms is that sometimes the spacing between drivers in the array is so great that a fairly long distancing distance is needed in order to enter the speakers far field. This would be true of the larger Focals, but we are still talking 9-10 feet, not 20 feet.

As for the Sopra 2 vs 3, there is no difference in their design that would extend the minimum listening distance. The 3 has more bass, that is really it. Everything else is largely the same.

As I said before though, I would bet both speakers would work fine in your room. It's the tweeter that is the limiting factor, so neither is a good fit in a much larger room where high output is also desired.

Matt

 

[Danzilla31]

For what it's worth, a room would need to be fairly small for a large speaker to be inappropriate or not work in that room.

In a 16x20 room, I would be surprised if even this wouldn't work.

The bass is rarely the issue, that is more myth than truth. The size of the woofers or amount of bass produced are not room size dependent. A speaker designed for larger rooms may have more of a response tilt built in, given the reduced room gain, but I doubt that is true of most brands, and frankly many people would likely prefer that anyway. The issue that you run into with speakers in small rooms is that sometimes the spacing between drivers in the array is so great that a fairly long distancing distance is needed in order to enter the speakers far field. This would be true of the larger Focals, but we are still talking 9-10 feet, not 20 feet.

As for the Sopra 2 vs 3, there is no difference in their design that would extend the minimum listening distance. The 3 has more bass, that is really it. Everything else is largely the same.

As I said before though, I would bet both speakers would work fine in your room. It's the tweeter that is the limiting factor, so neither is a good fit in a much larger room where high output is also desired.

Matt

Could the sopras work either the 2 or the 3 versions in his room or rooms of that size if crossed over to a sub. He has 2 SVS PB 16's. With the subs carrying the low end could those speakers pull they're weight without the tweeter giving out?