Looking for a budget/used sub that fits my system

[john_dikeman]

Hello all!

I'm new here and I'm curious if anyone has suggestions for a subwoofer that would fit my situation.
Ideally I'd rather get something used, perhaps an old model, that I could pick up locally, ie Belgium or Netherlands.

I am currently running Focal Aria 906 speakers with an Arcam A18 FMJ integrated amplifier. It's a relatively small room and I think, because of my girlfriend, I can basically only put it in the corner.

I'm looking for something with good sound quality above all else. Don't need huge, slamming bass. I listen to a lot of jazz and classical, but also hip hop, funk, a bit of everything. But in all cases, accurate, musical bass is what I'm looking for.

I've been snooping around for some older JM Lab/Focal subwoofers thinking that might fit the bill but curious if anyone else had suggestions. Those show up between 100-300 euros fairly often around here.

Any suggestions are most welcome.

 

[Pandaman617]

How difficult is it for you to get SVS products? Even an older SB12NSD would be a great compliment to your Focals. In terms of other brands I used a Def Tech SuperCube II as well as a Carver True Subwoofer Super Jr. both are 12”x12”x12” and were used when I was in a dorm and had to accommodate a small 2.1 setup. Neither are bass monsters but for their size they fit the bill. I picked up both for around $220 used and that was over two years ago. My experience with smaller subs is relatively limited but I can tell you all 3 listed subs were affordable second hand and for music they exceeded my performance expectations. You’re not going to get 18HZ at 105dB out of them but they’ll add enough bottom end to fill out the sound.

 

[john_dikeman]

I've been looking for SVS SB1000. Can't find them used around here and new they are around 499. I could save up a bit and do that.
I've also found a Rel Quake II nearby for 150.
And a Focal Electra 900 for 500.
Any comparisons between these three?
I'll look around a bit for the other two you mentioned.

 

[Pandaman617]

I would audition that REL, I haven’t heard that specific sub but I’ve listened to a number of their subwoofers over the years and always found them to be well engineered and to have excellent performance for the size cabinet and driver they were.

 

[lovinthehd]

Looking for some info on the Rel and JM Lab/Focal subs not finding a whole lot.

Rel, might suit your purposes....but it's a small sub (seems to be an 8" driver) and doesn't dig particularly deep. I've never been particularly attracted to Rel, value and performance are easily bested generally. For $150 might be okay.

The Focal looks like a much nicer sub, but is significantly larger (and heavier....one ad has it at 97 lbs). Larger driver (13") and also is ported. Would be the most powerful and deepest digging of these three I'd think. This would be the one I'd aim at, but....

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

For people on the wrong side of the Atlantic ocean, I highly recommend BKElec Subs.

Sub Woofers - Sub Bass - Subwoofer

 

[john_dikeman]

OK, some used subs have come and gone. I was actually prepared to purchase the Quake but the owner realized there was a weird hum.

I sort of think what'd be best for my would be a BK XLS 200 however, what's available nearby and barely affordable...

BK Xls 300 PR
SVS 20-39 C

Any comparisons for the two of these re SQ?

 

[TLS Guy]

OK, some used subs have come and gone. I was actually prepared to purchase the Quake but the owner realized there was a weird hum.

I sort of think what'd be best for my would be a BK XLS 200 however, what's available nearby and barely affordable...

BK Xls 300 PR
SVS 20-39 C

Any comparisons for the two of these re SQ?

Yes, the BK subs from a good little firm at Southend on Sea, now the City of Southend on Sea, make excellent subs.

They do sell from their factory, maybe you could do a day trip and pick one up. Southend is close to the south and east coast ports, so you could make a day trip of it.

It is right at the most North East point on the Thames Estuary, right opposite Sheerness at Garrison Point.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

OK, some used subs have come and gone. I was actually prepared to purchase the Quake but the owner realized there was a weird hum.

I sort of think what'd be best for my would be a BK XLS 200 however, what's available nearby and barely affordable...

BK Xls 300 PR
SVS 20-39 C

Any comparisons for the two of these re SQ?

BKElec XLS 300RP - it's 10" Sub with 300W RMS amp and a passive radiator design (smaller box) - then new it was priced at 380 UK pounds. I don't have CEA measurements for it, but my gut feeling is it is a very capable little sub for smaller spaces.

SVS 20-39 PC-Plus (DO confirm if this indeed is the correct model number) - Is a beast in comparison:
12.3" SVS woofer, 525W Bash amp in a ported layout (more efficient). $899 (US) priced then was new

SVS is a much older model, circa 2007, but if the amp and woofer have no damage, it's by far better sub.

For reference original websites for both:

SVSound - Cylinder Subwoofers

SV Sound - Thanks for stopping by SVS, The Sound Authority (TM). If you're in the market for a new subwoofer, speakers, or both, for your home theater, or just want to read more about bass and sound, you've come to the right place.

web.archive.org

XLS300/PR

 

[john_dikeman]

Would be cool to go visit the BK factory. But honestly, I think I need to go second hand anyway, for budgetary reasons.

One of my questions though with the SVS 20-39 +, I read a lot of reviews that it can shake the house etc. Which sounds fun, but mostly I want a sub for musical clarity, also at quiet dynamics. Would it be good for that as well.
Or would it make more sense to wait for a smaller sub like the BK XLS 200? Or even the 300 I see locally at the moment.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

that SVS can play very loud if needed, but it doesn't make it bad at lower volumes. Both will be excellent for music, but SVS would be a good fit in smaller or larger rooms, where that BK (specific) would only fit smaller rooms.

If both are priced similarly, I would go for SVS. But again, amp on subs can go bad and that's the chance you'll be taking with any used sub. Both subs you're looking at are long gone from both production and support.
The fact that I was able to dig their product pages only on Internet Archive should tell you something.

 

[john_dikeman]

Thanks for the advice, I'm going for the SVS. Will pick it up tomorrow. Not sure what I'll tell the girlfriend... Might end up in my studio instead of the living room, which would also be fine actually. Then I can buy a modest subwoofer later that won't freak her out.

One question, I'll be running this (assuming it goes in the living room) with an integrated amplifier which has a pre out but no crossovers. What would you recommend, run it high level through the subwoofer then out to my speakers using the built in 80 hz crossover in the sub or run the RCA per amp outs to the sub and just set the sub around 70 hz where my Focal 90s speakers start to dip and let the speakers run full range? I suppose I can try both, but curious what your input would be.

 

[Eppie]

High level connections on a subwoofer are typically pass-through. It does not act as a high pass filter for your main speakers, so they would still get a full range signal. If you want to separate the lower frequencies that would have to be done at the pre-amp stage. If the amplifier has a pre-amp out and in loop, you could place an active crossover in there.

With an older integrated amp it is more common to run the mains full range and adjust the subwoofer controls to match. If you want more control than that, you could use the pre-out and connect a mini-dsp between the pre-out and subwoofer, but that also requires investing in a measurement microphone and using a laptop to take measurements and program the mini-dsp.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks for the advice, I'm going for the SVS. Will pick it up tomorrow. Not sure what I'll tell the girlfriend... Might end up in my studio instead of the living room, which would also be fine actually. Then I can buy a modest subwoofer later that won't freak her out.

One question, I'll be running this (assuming it goes in the living room) with an integrated amplifier which has a pre out but no crossovers. What would you recommend, run it high level through the subwoofer then out to my speakers using the built in 80 hz crossover in the sub or run the RCA per amp outs to the sub and just set the sub around 70 hz where my Focal 90s speakers start to dip and let the speakers run full range? I suppose I can try both, but curious what your input would be.

Where did you see the sub has a built in 80hz crossover? Was just looking at a review that makes it seem it just has the typical low pass filter (mislabeled as a crossover).

 

[john_dikeman]

INteresting...

Took me a while to find it but I got the idea here:

"For most music I am unfortunately going to have to use the high-level inputs, and from what the guy at SVS told me, 80Hz and below automatically be filtered out by the sub. This is not adjustable or defeatable at all using the high-level inputs."

Polk LSi-15s with SVS 20-39 PC-Plus... good combo?

Do you think the two of these will mix well for music and movies? (I only have a 2-channel setup right now). For most music I am unfortunately going to have to use the high-level inputs, and from what the guy at SVS told me, 80Hz and below automatically be filtered out by the sub. This is not...

www.hometheaterforum.com

 

[TLS Guy]

INteresting...

Took me a while to find it but I got the idea here:

"For most music I am unfortunately going to have to use the high-level inputs, and from what the guy at SVS told me, 80Hz and below automatically be filtered out by the sub. This is not adjustable or defeatable at all using the high-level inputs."

Polk LSi-15s with SVS 20-39 PC-Plus... good combo?

Do you think the two of these will mix well for music and movies? (I only have a 2-channel setup right now). For most music I am unfortunately going to have to use the high-level inputs, and from what the guy at SVS told me, 80Hz and below automatically be filtered out by the sub. This is not...

www.hometheaterforum.com

That SVS sub you were looking at is an old sub and would be a high risk purchase in any event.

The problem is that your Arcam has no bass management, but it does have pre outs.

So you need a powered sub with a variable crossover. So you connect the right and left pre outs to the left and right inputs of the sub. Then you set the crossover on the sub to the F3 of your Focal speakers pls 50%. The F3 of your focal speakers is 55 Hz, so that means you set the sub crossover to 80 Hz. Your focal speakers will be getting a full range signal, but they are now. The above arrangement usually works satisfactorily in your situation.
Avoid Polk subs, they are just honk boxes.

 

[john_dikeman]

TLS Guy
The setup you mentioned, running RCA and setting the sub to 80hz, would work with this SVS.

I'm scheduled to go check it out shortly. The owner said it's in perfect shape as he didn't use it much (for what that's worth...)
What should I check out when I go see it? Anything in particular to look out for?
From what I hear, the main problem with an old sub like this is the amp can die. I know SVS has some modern amps I could replace this one with so for me if it lasts a few years as is I'd be happy. Even with the price of a new amp it'd be cheaper than buying a new SVS sub...

 

[TLS Guy]

TLS Guy
The setup you mentioned, running RCA and setting the sub to 80hz, would work with this SVS.

I'm scheduled to go check it out shortly. The owner said it's in perfect shape as he didn't use it much (for what that's worth...)
What should I check out when I go see it? Anything in particular to look out for?
From what I hear, the main problem with an old sub like this is the amp can die. I know SVS has some modern amps I could replace this one with so for me if it lasts a few years as is I'd be happy. Even with the price of a new amp it'd be cheaper than buying a new SVS sub...

Sub technology has improved enormously since that sub saw the light of day. In addition class D technology used in sub amps, was not mature then, and prone to a host of problems causing failure. Changing a sub amp is usually far from just a swap over. Personally I would not be taking the trouble to even look at that sub.

 

[john_dikeman]

Ok, for the record, I wrote SVS re the high level crossover issue and they said this:

"
The high-level outputs are a pass-through and so it's better to run the speakers directly off the Arcam amp. Even high-level outs that do apply a high-pass are generally only 6dB per octave and not worth putting all the extra passive crossover components inline with the speakers, especially at the high quality level of your Focals.

Thanks and if you have any other questions, please don't hesitate to ask. "

 

[john_dikeman]

Bought it. Seems to work perfectly. Sounds fantastic! It's my first real sub so I guess I don't have much to compare it to but I absolutely don't need more bass.
I will keep a lookout for a used BK XLS200 anyway as I'm curious how a smaller sub which is really made for music would compare. I have my hifi system in the living room but I also have my music studio which could use a sub as well. So, let the gas continue.... But for the moment I am very satisfied.