Can you use your pre-outs as well as run speakers from the terminals on the same channel?

[lovinthehd]

I recently bought an Onkyo TX-RZ810 new in box, so saved some money compared to newer models. I have 3 old Technics SE-A1010 in perfect conditions, so I want to use them for front, surround and back speakers. Since I don't have a 1 channel amp, I want to use the internal amp of the receiver just for the center speaker. My doubt is if having just a single speaker connected to the internal amp could cause an electrical problem to the receiver.

No not a problem for your avr. You could use all channels on external amps or just one if you want and anywhere in between. They're made to do this....

 

[jcsantana]

No not a problem for your avr. You could use all channels on external amps or just one if you want and anywhere in between. They're made to do this....

Thanks for your feedback. Will do it that way while I save for buying a 1 channel amp.!!!!

 

[audiophool78]

Why would you run zones in the same room as mains? Sounds convoluted....

Thats a really good question and Im happy to enlighten you. Most avrs that have multi zone functionality severely limit the capabilities of what zone 2 can and cannot do. For instance, many avrs will not output a digital signal of any kind. So if you were hoping to dac your source using your avr, no luck. And many of the avrs that will accept a digital signal will not do so over hdmi.

I am running a laptop via hdmi into my avr for HD audio streaming. I have two different sets of front speakers...one set for 5.1 surround sound, and another set (warmer sound) for music. But I only have 1 listening room. BOTH my movie source and music source require an hdmi connection in order to take full advantage of the best fidelity my equipment can offer.

For my particular case and for many others, zones are all but useless.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thats a really good question and Im happy to enlighten you. Most avrs that have multi zone functionality severely limit the capabilities of what zone 2 can and cannot do. For instance, many avrs will not output a digital signal of any kind. So if you were hoping to dac your source using your avr, no luck. And many of the avrs that will accept a digital signal will not do so over hdmi.

I am running a laptop via hdmi into my avr for HD audio streaming. I have two different sets of front speakers...one set for 5.1 surround sound, and another set (warmer sound) for music. But I only have 1 listening room. BOTH my movie source and music source require an hdmi connection in order to take full advantage of the best fidelity my equipment can offer.

For my particular case and for many others, zones are all but useless.

Why not just your preferred speakers as L/R in one setup?

 

[audiophool78]

Why not just your preferred speakers as L/R in one setup?

Because I prefer one set of speakers for Movies and gaming, and another for music. Movies/gaming speakers are much more analytical and revealing which I want for dialogue, effects and such.

The pair of speakers I use for music have a much more laid back sound (ring radiator vs horn tweeter).

 

[lovinthehd]

Because I prefer one set of speakers for Movies and gaming, and another for music. Movies/gaming speakers are much more analytical and revealing which I want for dialogue, effects and such.

The pair of speakers I use for music have a much more laid back sound (ring radiator vs horn tweeter).

Weird but okay

 

[audiophool78]

Weird but okay

You are such a petulant little kid on this forum. Literally hundreds of separate threads you can find yourself asking your little contrarian questions of every little thing that everyone has to say. Then someone gives you a perfectly intelligent answer to what was honestly a pretty stupid question and your response is "weird".

There isnt anything weird what so ever about using different speakers for 2 ch music than you use for movies. To act like it's "weird" and you cant possibly comprehend it is so childish.

 

[lovinthehd]

You are such a petulant little kid on this forum. Literally hundreds of separate threads you can find yourself asking your little contrarian questions of every little thing that everyone has to say. Then someone gives you a perfectly intelligent answer to what was honestly a pretty stupid question and your response is "weird".

There isnt anything weird what so ever about using different speakers for 2 ch music than you use for movies. To act like it's "weird" and you cant possibly comprehend it is so childish.

Yes thanks for the PM threatening to embarass me in front of "the whole internet". I think it's weird, shoot me. You're the one asking a question one could probably answer himself in any case with a look at a manual....

 

[kanetankerous]

I was wondering a similar thing as the OP, but for a different reason. What I was considering was running Left/ Right speakers from the powered speaker terminals on my Yamaha R- A3080 receiver and then running two matching subwoofers from the Left/Right pre-outs. I figure that if this works I can get the full range of my Swan Diva 5.6 speakers PLUS the low range of the Velodyne CH12 subs reproducing the Left /Right channels, NOT the LFE. I have two SVS PB-3000 at the front for the LFE, plus two SVS PB-2000 at the back for LFE emanating from the rear (yes, I know they're the same signal).. I'm just curious how the fronts would sound with subs playing the Left/Right signal.

 

[lovinthehd]

I was wondering a similar thing as the OP, but for a different reason. What I was considering was running Left/ Right speakers from the powered speaker terminals on my Yamaha R- A3080 receiver and then running two matching subwoofers from the Left/Right pre-outs. I figure that if this works I can get the full range of my Swan Diva 5.6 speakers PLUS the low range of the Velodyne CH12 subs reproducing the Left /Right channels, NOT the LFE. I have two SVS PB-3000 at the front for the LFE, plus two SVS PB-2000 at the back for LFE emanating from the rear (yes, I know they're the same signal).. I'm just curious how the fronts would sound with subs playing the Left/Right signal.

If you have all the gear, set it up and see what you think. I'd think it'd be a bit bass heavy depending what you do with the subs' LPFs/levels and don't think there's enough specific L/R bass info to make it worthwhile in that sense. Why not just run the speakers full range and use the double bass feature and a limiting lpf from the avr.

 

[kanetankerous]

If you have all the gear, set it up and see what you think. I'd think it'd be a bit bass heavy depending what you do with the subs' LPFs/levels and don't think there's enough specific L/R bass info to make it worthwhile in that sense. Why not just run the speakers full range and use the double bass feature and a limiting lpf from the avr.

I'll try that as well. I've only just set the 3080 up and haven't even had time to read the manual. Busiest time of year workwise for me, so haven't had any free time to calibrate, etc. My Swan Diva sound good, but could use a bit more bass in my opinion, but bass from the actual channel, not LFE. What I want is well balanced sound from the bell tower tweeter highs down to the sub bass-ment. Then include the LFE lows as well. I was mainly curious if there was a way to add the subs as part of the channels sound.

 

[lovinthehd]

Haven't even had enough time to run YPAO to do a general calibration/setup? That's probably a good start in any case...but do read the manual

I looked for spec on a Swan Diva 5.6 and got references to some other model numbers, so not sure what it is. I doubt the Swans are anywhere near as capable as your subs in lower bass, and could well lack in the bass range you prefer, too, especially if contrasted with the sub's capabilities but if you haven't even calibrated yet wouldn't make too many judgements until you do.

Hard to know what your preferences are. In any case I'd still use the subs and start with a crossover of 80hz and not use the Swans full range, but you do have a feature for double bass in the Yamaha (called Extra Bass by Yamaha, see pg 122 of your manual) where you can set your Swans to full range and still redirect some bass content to the subs as well.

LFE only happens with content that have recorded such a channel so is it with movies you're finding a lack of bass or is it music?

 

[kanetankerous]

Haven't even had enough time to run YPAO to do a general calibration/setup? That's probably a good start in any case...but do read the manual

I looked for spec on a Swan Diva 5.6 and got references to some other model numbers, so not sure what it is. I doubt the Swans are anywhere near as capable as your subs in lower bass, and could well lack in the bass range you prefer, too, especially if contrasted with the sub's capabilities but if you haven't even calibrated yet wouldn't make too many judgements until you do.

Hard to know what your preferences are. In any case I'd still use the subs and start with a crossover of 80hz and not use the Swans full range, but you do have a feature for double bass in the Yamaha (called Extra Bass by Yamaha, see pg 122 of your manual) where you can set your Swans to full range and still redirect some bass content to the subs as well.

LFE only happens with content that have recorded such a channel so is it with movies you're finding a lack of bass or is it music?

I did do a YPAO general set-up, just haven't had time to do some tweaks. I tried the Extra Bass, but will have to study the manual as there have been so many settings that I've tried, only to have "not available" keep popping up on the receiver's readout. It's primarily music in which the bass sounds lacking, but I really want to adjust and even out the sound for both, to reach a "set and forget" calibration where the system sounds perfect for any listening situation.

 

[Pogre]

There isnt anything weird what so ever about using different speakers for 2 ch music than you use for movies. To act like it's "weird" and you cant possibly comprehend it is so childish.

Hey whatever blows your hair back, lol.

I found speakers that I liked for music first then built the rest of the system from there. I've found that any speaker that does well with music is going to be more than acceptable for movies. I mean, unless they're SO warm that everything is smeared and dialogue is unintelligible. At that point tho, I think one could make an argument they're not good speakers for anything.

Besides, I think it'd look kinda weird having all of those speakers crowding up the front of my room...

 

[Trell]

Yes thanks for the PM threatening to embarass me in front of "the whole internet". I think it's weird, shoot me. You're the one asking a question one could probably answer himself in any case with a look at a manual....

"Manual" reminds me too much of "manual labour", just saying!

Many posts are because the poster did not read the manual, but on the other hand many manuals are poorly written.

 

[highfigh]

"Manual" reminds me too much of "manual labour", just saying!

Many posts are because the poster did not read the manual, but on the other hand many manuals are poorly written.

True, but in light of the amount of information in most user manuals that won't just pop into someone's mind, it's probably best to at least look at the index, to find something that applies to whatever they want to do.

If you think manuals are badly written now, look for some 1970's manuals from the major Japanese manufacturers- those were very difficult to understand.

 

[Trell]

True, but in light of the amount of information in most user manuals that won't just pop into someone's mind, it's probably best to at least look at the index, to find something that applies to whatever they want to do.

If you think manuals are badly written now, look for some 1970's manuals from the major Japanese manufacturers- those were very difficult to understand.

With so many manuals available for download it's much easier to search them and the manuals are much more likely to be updated than the hard-copy, of course. Sometime I just reply with a link to the manual after Googling for it, and it should not be that hard to do for most.

As for bad manuals (from translation to English) there is this fellow with the moniker batpig that has a Denon-to-English site, but quite some years since it was updated:

batpigworld.com - batpigworld Resources and Information.

batpigworld.com is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, batpigworld.com has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!

batpigworld.com

 

[highfigh]

With so many manuals available for download it's much easier to search them and the manuals are much more likely to be updated than the hard-copy, of course. Sometime I just reply with a link to the manual after Googling for it, and it should not be that hard to do for most.

As for bad manuals (from translation to English) there is this fellow with the moniker batpig that has a Denon-to-English site, but quite some years since it was updated:

batpigworld.com - batpigworld Resources and Information.

batpigworld.com is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, batpigworld.com has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!

batpigworld.com

Same info- I don't care which version people use, they need to pick one so they don't repeat the same questions we see far too many times.

It's good that many manuals are printed in several languages, but if nobody reads them, it's all wasted. I would much rather read them online and besides, I feel foolish trying to expand the pages in the paper version with my fingers when others can see me doing that.

 

[audiophool78]

Hey whatever blows your hair back, lol.

I found speakers that I liked for music first then built the rest of the system from there. I've found that any speaker that does well with music is going to be more than acceptable for movies. I mean, unless they're SO warm that everything is smeared and dialogue is unintelligible. At that point tho, I think one could make an argument they're not good speakers for anything.

Besides, I think it'd look kinda weird having all of those speakers crowding up the front of my room...

You hit the nail on the head. The speakers I had in my original 7.2 were extremely warm and layed back. I could NEVER hear details and dialog in movies properly. But I saved the front 2 for music because they are like warm caramel in that department.

As far as crowding, there is no issue. My speakers are all bookshelves. When I watch music, one set comes out of the closet and the other goes in. Transition takes 2 minutes.

 

[audiophool78]

Besides, I think it'd look kinda weird having all of those speakers crowding up the front of my room...

Another bonus is my receiver can now power my entire surround system as the new speakers are 8ohm are about 7db more efficient. I use two Outlaw monoblocks to power the two 4ohm speakers for music. I'm really happy with the results and I dont feel like I had to compromise on anything aside from the slight inconvenience of having to switch the front LR.